Why are parts of camper frame shocking me?

kwilson · 04-16-2016, 09:29 PM

I just purchased a new 2016 Jayco Jay Feather X17Z. When I got it home, I plugged it in to an exterior GFCI outlet using an extension cord. As I was checking out the LP quick connect port (attached to underside of TT), I received mild voltage shock. The voltage was weak enough that I could leave my fingers on it without really hurting. I checked other metallic parts and received the same shock. (Note: not all parts of frame had voltage.) after unplugging the camper shore line and running on battery, there was no voltage physically detected. I checked my extension cord and found that the ground prong was missing. I read online that this could be why I felt the shock. I bought a new extension cord and still no more voltage. Is there any reason to be concerned from here, or is my problem resolved. I'm not really sure why the frame would have voltage whether or not it's grounded. I always thought the ground was a safety to keep me from becoming the ground due to a short or fault. As I said, I just bought this camper today and I know that calling the dealer will more than likely result in not having a camper for over a month.

oldmanAZ · 04-16-2016, 09:38 PM

Congratulations on the new Jay Feather and welcome to the JOF.

There are several 'electrically savvy' folks on this site. I'm sure one of them will have some information on this.

Grumpy · 04-17-2016, 05:45 AM

Are you sure when you used the bad cord that it wasn't plugged in backwards since the ground prong was gone. If you had the hot and neutral reversed that could have caused your problem.

kwilson · 04-17-2016, 05:50 AM

It is possible. How would that energize my frame?

shadester · 04-17-2016, 06:44 AM

I wouldn't use any cord without the ground on a RV. A little moisture somewhere will give you a shock as you describe. Remember, electric take the path of least resistance. Without a ground, Guess what, your it.

Danno · 04-17-2016, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwilson

It is possible. How would that energize my frame?

If you reverse the polarity, then you pose a risk of electric shock. The ground and neutral wires in your house panel are connected together, so basically it's the same circuit. If you're getting shocks on your TT, that means that the neutral wire and ground are most likely tied together in the breaker panel.
Unplug your trailer, and put an OHM meter between the ground plug and neutral input wire.If you're getting continuity, then that will answer your question. To prevent this, always use an extension cord with a ground.

kwilson · 04-17-2016, 07:46 AM

Thanks for all the input. I really hope this is all due to the bad cord and not a short in my camper wiring. That would be a nightmare to resolve with the dealer as camping season starts.

RoyBraddy · 04-17-2016, 08:30 AM

The only safety ground the RV's get is from the three wire Electrical hookups. Have to make sure all three conductors are being used and you have to know for sure the 120VAC Outlet you have plugged into has the ground wire connected as well.

This is why we don't have to drive a ground stake into the ground for frame ground whenever we park somewhere.

You may run it this as well running your on-board generator but rare I imagine.

The small shock to you could easily kill someone else. Not safe what you have there...

I also would never use one of those small round plastic adapter or a extension cord with less that 12 gauge (12-3) wiring. 10Gauge (10-3) is best but expensive.

You can get one of those RV30A-15A LONG DOgbone Adapters at WALMART in the camping section... Looks like this... The also sell the RV50A-30A that will plug into this one if you have a 50A trailer.

Be safe out there...

Roy Ken

DanNJanice · 04-17-2016, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwilson

I just purchased a new 2016 Jayco Jay Feather X17Z. When I got it home, I plugged it in to an exterior GFCI outlet using an extension cord. As I was checking out the LP quick connect port (attached to underside of TT), I received mild voltage shock. The voltage was weak enough that I could leave my fingers on it without really hurting. I checked other metallic parts and received the same shock. (Note: not all parts of frame had voltage.) after unplugging the camper shore line and running on battery, there was no voltage physically detected. I checked my extension cord and found that the ground prong was missing. I read online that this could be why I felt the shock. I bought a new extension cord and still no more voltage. Is there any reason to be concerned from here, or is my problem resolved. I'm not really sure why the frame would have voltage whether or not it's grounded. I always thought the ground was a safety to keep me from becoming the ground due to a short or fault. As I said, I just bought this camper today and I know that calling the dealer will more than likely result in not having a camper for over a month.

This could be a big issue, or not! Don't take any chances with your safety! If in doubt (and the dealer has a long lead time) any decent electrician should be able find any issues.
I suspect the missing ground is the issue, but you never know. I would start by unplugging the trailer and measure between ground and common. On a trailer there should NOT be a connection between the two.
I would then measure from the GND terminal of the plug to the trailer frame, I "think" this should be connected. Once you have checked this stuff out, get one of those outlet checkers, first check the extension cord, then plug in the trailer and check the outlets. I would use an outside plug, so I did not have to touch the trailer. If all this checks out, then most likely it was your missing ground.
If in doubt, hire a qualified electrician.

kwilson · 04-17-2016, 09:09 AM

I went out and purchased a circuit tester. I checked the extension cord and plugged it in trying simulate a reversed plarity without success it only read the open ground. While I understand having an open ground would turn you in tithe ground if touched, I don't understand how my frame is becoming energized. It sounds like oh a short somewhere. I would assume in a normal situation you would not receive a shock even if you weren't grounded. Is this correct?

MrNiceGuy · 04-17-2016, 09:52 AM

You have what is know as a hot skin condition. It can be DEADLY! Please read the information in the link provided. Mike Sokol attends many RV Rallies and is very highly regarded in the RV community.
RV Electrical Safety: Part IV â€“ Hot Skin | No~Shock~Zone

shadester · 04-17-2016, 10:14 AM

You could have one of the wires mildly touching somewhere, it's always possible. Like one of the posters indicated, checking the resistance and see what you have. Might want to do this and change your meter settings also. If you have it set at a low resistance and have a fairly light short you may not see it on the scale your set on. See what I'm saying.
" I would assume in a normal situation you would not receive a shock even if you weren't grounded."
True, under 100% conditions. But think about a converter that gets wet, the moisture can be a conductors to another path like anything metal. There are some many scenario's.

Like Others Say : Consult a qualified electrician when in doubt....

MrNiceGuy · 04-17-2016, 10:33 AM

I suggest you throw away the extension cable missing the ground. This is one of the issues that will cause a hot skin condition.

kwilson · 04-17-2016, 10:38 AM

I immediately went out and bought a new one. 50' 14 gauge. I only plug it in like this when getting it prepped for a trip. Once grounded, the voltage in the frame is not detected. Now I'm just dreading the response I'm going to get from the dealer and the estimated repair time to fix it. I just bought it yesterday and will more than likely be without it for a majority of the camping season in Ohio.

Seann45 · 04-17-2016, 10:43 AM

Get it back to the dealer right now There is a short in the wiring and the unit is UNSAFE..

Seann45 · 04-17-2016, 10:45 AM

The dealer (if you bought from him) should put you to the top of the list with this as he should have caught it on the inspection that he probably charged you for when you took delivery..

kwilson · 04-17-2016, 10:51 AM

Thank you all again for the input. Had I not caught this, I'm afraid to think about what possibly could have happened to my 3 and 4 year old had they come in contact with the camper. I'll keep you posted on what the dealer says.

kwilson · 04-17-2016, 10:56 AM

I do have one more question. If this voltage is only present when the shore line cord is plugged in, does this mean the short is on the 120v side and not the 24 volt side. This may help isolate the problem. Also, what systems run on the 120 v other than refrigerator, water heater and outlets?

MrNiceGuy · 04-17-2016, 04:45 PM

I'm a little confused. When you plugged in your new extension cord did you continue to have the same issue?

kwilson · 04-17-2016, 04:58 PM

If I use the new grounded cord, I don't detect any voltage. Only if using the ungrounded cord is voltage present. I used a voltage detector and touched multiple points on the camper and it alerted me there was voltage detected. I unplugged the Shoreline cable from the bad cord and touched the same points and no voltage detected. Also, using the new cord, I checked all outlets in the camper with a Gardner Bender GFCI and circuit tester. All outlets read as normal no open hots, no open Neutrals, no open Ground, no reverse polarity etc...

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