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Old 03-24-2017, 05:45 PM   #1
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Loaded for Camp and the Scale

We are ready to head out. We weighed the TV loaded w/out TT last weekend. Tomorrow we will hit the scale with the TT loaded for camping. We will get the weight with WDH engaged and then with WDH disengaged to derive our payload number. I think we are going to be over by 200-300lbs, but here's to a better than expected result. I am bringing the impact wrench in case I have to pull a couple of washers on the Equalizer. I think we are going to have too much going to the front axle. I do not know how to redistribute the weight if we are that much over. We really have streamlined our cargo; there's nearly nothing else to shed. It is crazy how little you really can carry with the half ton hitched up. Maybe, it will be better than I think.
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Old 03-24-2017, 05:47 PM   #2
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What's the specs on your camper and truck?


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Old 03-24-2017, 05:54 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by FeatherFam View Post
snip..... Tomorrow we will hit the scale with the TT loaded for camping....snip
Sounds great, let us know the results when you return from your trip

Bob
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Old 03-24-2017, 06:13 PM   #4
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What's the specs on your camper and truck?


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If by specs you mean GVWR and Payload for the TV, the GVWR is 6,600 and the max payload is 1,613. We weighed 6,060 loaded without the TT last weekend. That only leaves 540 for the TT. The TT's "supposed dry" hitch weight is 460, but we will see what the actual is with a GP 27 battery, propane tranks, and TT loaded for camp. There is also the WDH to that will be factored into tomorrow's hitch weight/which impacts payload.

I am quite sure we are over our GVWR; I just need to know how much so i can try to refine our set up.
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Old 03-24-2017, 06:29 PM   #5
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Sounds great, let us know the results when you return from your trip

Bob
Thanks, Bob - Will do. I am taking the CAT Scale data from the link you gave me.
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Old 04-05-2017, 07:45 AM   #6
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Here are our CAT scale numbers fully loaded:

Weight #1, TV Alone
Steer Axle = 3,360
Drive Axle = 2,700
Gross Weight = 6,060

Weight #2, TV+TT+WDH Engaged
Steer Axle = 3,120
Drive Axle = 3,560
Trailer Axle = 4,800
Gross Weight = 11,480

Weigh #3, TV+TT (without WDH engaged)
Steer Axle = 3,080
Drive Axle = 3,640
Trailer Axle = 4,760
Gross Weight = 11,480

TT GVWR (stated on door sticker) = 6,600
Front = 3, 700
Rear = 3,900

Weigh #2 TV GVWR = 6,680 (+80)

Weigh #3 TV GVW 6,720 - Weigh #1 TV GVW 6,060 = Tongue Weight of 660
*propane tanks were empty

Loaded TT Weight (w/o WDH) = 4,760
Tongue Weight % = 13.8%

Loaded TT Weight (w/WDH) = 4,800
Tongue Weight % = 13.7%
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Old 04-05-2017, 08:58 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FeatherFam View Post
Here are our CAT scale numbers fully loaded:

Weight #1, TV Alone
Steer Axle = 3,360
Drive Axle = 2,700
Gross Weight = 6,060

Weight #2, TV+TT+WDH Engaged
Steer Axle = 3,120
Drive Axle = 3,560
Trailer Axle = 4,800
Gross Weight = 11,480

Weigh #3, TV+TT (without WDH engaged)
Steer Axle = 3,080
Drive Axle = 3,640
Trailer Axle = 4,760
Gross Weight = 11,480

TT GVWR (stated on door sticker) = 6,600
Front = 3, 700
Rear = 3,900

Weigh #2 TV GVWR = 6,680 (+80)

Weigh #3 TV GVW 6,720 - Weigh #1 TV GVW 6,060 = Tongue Weight of 660
*propane tanks were empty

Loaded TT Weight (w/o WDH) = 4,760
Tongue Weight % = 13.8%

Loaded TT Weight (w/WDH) = 4,800
Tongue Weight % = 13.7%
So your WDH engaged took 40 lbs off TV.?
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Old 04-05-2017, 05:34 PM   #8
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So your WDH engaged took 40 lbs off TV.?
Yes, That weight went to the trailer axles.

FeatherFam... Looks like you could add some more weight to the front axle of the TV. You are only putting 40# back with WDH engaged. You are still light on the front axle by 240#.
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Old 04-06-2017, 03:23 PM   #9
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FeatherFam,

Great CAT scale data!

I agree, re-adjust the WDH moving some more weight to the TV's front axle so that your "hitched/engaged" front axle weight is closer to the TV's unhitched front axle weight of 3,360lbs. Presently your closer to the "hitched/un-engaged" front axle weight of 3,080lbs.

I assume that under your present set-up the TT tows level, or slightly nose down.

TT gross weight (including tongue weight): (11,480lbs) - (6,060lbs) = 5,450lbs

Tongue weight of 660lbs = 12.1% of TT gross weight.

Bob
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Old 04-08-2017, 08:36 AM   #10
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FeatherFam,

Great CAT scale data!

I agree, re-adjust the WDH moving some more weight to the TV's front axle so that your "hitched/engaged" front axle weight is closer to the TV's unhitched front axle weight of 3,360lbs. Presently your closer to the "hitched/un-engaged" front axle weight of 3,080lbs.

I assume that under your present set-up the TT tows level, or slightly nose down.

TT gross weight (including tongue weight): (11,480lbs) - (6,060lbs) = 5,450lbs

Tongue weight of 660lbs = 12.1% of TT gross weight.

Bob
Thank You! Yes, I am going to contact Progress Manufacturing (Equalizer) to get this dialed-in. I am tapped on the spacer washers in the hitch pitch/trajectory setting. I will likely need to raise or lower the hitch shank. The trouble is that Progress goes by wheel well measurement numbers and not actual weight distribution/scale numbers in their hitch setting determinations. I have spoken with them several times and found them to be very helpful, but their approach to setting the distribution has always been about the tape measure's readings and not the scale's weights.

Also, I am considering some coil upgrades for RAM 1500s or maybe air bags. Yet, a slightly stiffer suspension response under load would make a difference in the hitch settings, too. I do not intend to do anything to the suspension that is beyond the chassis's design, nor do I intend to exceed the TV's payload and GVWR. The upgrades that I am considering are designed to assist under loads within the TV's ratings and not increase its load capacity - only help within its GVWR. So, I should probably wait until I make my suspension "upgrades" before trying to set the Equalizer.

Additionally, I am considering a Power Stop Brake (tow product) as a braking upgrade, especially since I seem to be at the TV's margins - probably a good idea in any case. I have heard very good things about the brake upgrades. I still have a lot of life on the factory brakes; they have about 60% of their life left. I want to keep them on for another year or so, but the brake upgrade is certainly in my thoughts, as well. The TV has 72K on it, but it is primarily freeway use, and I am very easy on our vehicles; on the road and in the garage, they get babied. I am the guy in the right lane that you burn by (lol).

I welcome and definitely appreciate input from you pros!
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Old 04-08-2017, 09:14 AM   #11
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If you are maxed out on your washers than you will need to move your L brackets up on the trailer, not your shank head.


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Old 04-10-2017, 04:42 AM   #12
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snip....... The trouble is that Progress goes by wheel well measurement numbers and not actual weight distribution/scale numbers in their hitch setting determinations.......... snip .........but their approach to setting the distribution has always been about the tape measure's readings and not the scale's weights......snip
Yes, most WDH manufactures reference the front fender "measurement" process for WDH adjustment and this will get one in the ballpark....., but there are variables that can effect these results as it relates to the actual percentage of "weight returned" to the TV's front suspension.

Your owners manual (Towing Section) will identify whether to return a minimum of 50%, or 100% of the TV's front fender height when using a WDH. The thought is that 50% return @ the front fender was to represent 50% weight return...., and 100% return @ the front fender was to represent 100% weight return. The CAT scale is the only accurate way to confirm the percentage of actual weight returned.

Bob
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Old 04-10-2017, 06:35 PM   #13
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Thank you! How much weight do you think I need to distribute to the front?
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Old 04-10-2017, 10:16 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by FeatherFam View Post
Thank you! How much weight do you think I need to distribute to the front?
Based on your TV's "unhitched" front axle weight of 3,360lbs, but your present WDH adjustment has you at 3,120lbs (WDH engaged)......., if it were my TV I would be targeting 3,300lbs, but don't exceed 3,360lbs. The WDH objective is to restore the TV's "unhitched" steering and braking characteristics when towing your particular TT.

Bob
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Old 04-11-2017, 06:06 AM   #15
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you may want to look at ebc brakes also. I have had the power stop brakes and yes they are good. I heard about the ebc brakes from a trailer life editor and he highly recommended them. I went with the drilled and slotted rotors and the orange brakes from ebc.
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Old 04-11-2017, 07:04 PM   #16
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Based on your TV's "unhitched" front axle weight of 3,360lbs, but your present WDH adjustment has you at 3,120lbs (WDH engaged)......., if it were my TV I would be targeting 3,300lbs, but don't exceed 3,360lbs. The WDH objective is to restore the TV's "unhitched" steering and braking characteristics when towing your particular TT.

Bob
Agree 100% with Bob.

I think it is also correct as previously stated that this can be accomplished by adjusting the L-brackets on your TT. Raising the brackets will shift more weight to your TV.

Best regards,
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Old 06-19-2017, 06:08 AM   #17
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Round 2

We weighed the loaded TV yesterday. Our loaded TV gross weight dropped 80lbs: 5,980, down from 6,060. We are not exactly sure how we accomplished this; we can account for about 55lbs that we removed. For what it is worth, we used the same scale.

The front axle reduced from 3,360 to 3,200 (-160).

The rear axle increased from 2,700 to 2,780 (+80).

We will load the TT and hit the CAT on our way to camp Wednesday. Assuming I still need to distribute more weight to the front (as per our last round of CAT), I will raise the WDH L brackets on the a-frame a notch.

We have full propane tanks and 100lbs (+/-) of bikes and a rack on the a-frame this time. Last time our tanks were empty, and we did not have bikes on the a-frame/tongue. I will report the numbers Wednesday. Hopefully, we will be close enough to travel safely as I will not be able to change the brackets at the scale. My plan is to make adjustments (if needed) at the CG.
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Old 06-19-2017, 07:52 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by FeatherFam View Post
We weighed the loaded TV yesterday. Our loaded TV gross weight dropped 80lbs: 5,980, down from 6,060. We are not exactly sure how we accomplished this; we can account for about 55lbs that we removed. For what it is worth, we used the same scale.

The front axle reduced from 3,360 to 3,200 (-160).

The rear axle increased from 2,700 to 2,780 (+80)........snip
I agree, interesting weight results compared to your original TV only CAT weights. The CAT scale has a certified tolerance of plus/minus 40lbs, so it may influence your results to some degree as well. Don't forget to be seated in the TV during the weigh-in.

Will be interesting to see how your Wednesday TV/TT CAT results compare to your "latest" TV only loaded weights.

If you get a chance, take a side view 'close-up' pic of your WDH with the TV/TT hitched/engaged reflecting the most recent "L" bracket adjustment prior to/or at the Wednesday weigh-in.

Bob
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Old 06-22-2017, 12:35 PM   #19
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Yesterday's CAT Results

CAT Scale for RAM and Jay Feather
June 21, 2017
*CAT Scale results after raising WDH L Brackets (on a-frame) one hole. Ball pitched with 6 washers.

TV Loaded w/o Trailer:
Steer Axle 3200
Drive Axle 2780
Gross 5980

TV+TT w/WDH:
Steer Axle 3120
Drive Axle 3520
Trailer Axle 4900
Gross 11540

TV+TT w/o WDH:
Steer Axle 2880
Drive Axle 3900
Trailer Axle 4760
Gross 11540

Loaded TT Weight:
2nd Weigh TV+TT Gross – 1st Weigh TV Gross

11540 – 5980 = 5560 (loaded TT)

Loaded Tongue Weight:
3rd TV Axle Weights – 1st TV Gross Weight = Loaded Tongue

6780 – 5980 = 800 (loaded tongue)
*Loaded tongue should be 10-15% of loaded TT

800 = 14.4% of 5560

TV GVWR = 6,600
2nd Steer Axle + 2nd Drive Axle =
3120 + 3520 = 6640 (+40 over GVWR)

If I am reading this correctly, I still need to distribute more weight to the front axle. I am maxed on pitch washers on the WDH. I raised the L Bracket one hole. I did not get a pic of the WDH set up, sorry. I am not sure how to get more weight to the front. Should I raise the L brackets another hole and remove pitch washers? I am also a little concerned about the heavy tongue. We added the Jack It bike rack and two bikes and had full propane tanks. Last time we weighed we did not have this added weight on the a-frame. We are in a CG; my wifi is sketchy. I will go into town to read your replies. Thank You!
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Old 06-22-2017, 12:56 PM   #20
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Check front and rear of TT to make sure you are level.

I would raise L-brackets one more hole and re-check.
Changed about 50-60lbs for my 6,000 TT when I did this.

Move anything you can in the TT to behind the axles will help as well with tongue weight.

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