Poor towing manners with 2/3 full black/grey tanks

**Midnightmoon** · 07-10-2017, 02:57 PM

We just spent the extended 4th of July holiday boondocking here in the mountains of PA. This was our first extended boondocking outing with our new Jay Feather 7 22BHM. Our closest dump station is at a Pilot Flying J 25 miles from our location out on route 70. So, I headed down there earlier today with 2/3 full black and grey tanks (our tanks are 25 gal each) and an empty fresh water tank to get rid of last week's mess.

Anyway, that was the worst 25 miles of driving I've ever experienced in my 30 years of towing. Constant bucking at every road joint in the highway, severe pulling toward any truck that passed us, reacting to every little gust of wind that came up. On the way home with empty tanks, it pulled like a dream. No issues and it tracked strait and true behind my truck.

This is my first light weight trailer. Our previous Nash and Airstream did not behave like this one on the same road making the same trip to empty the waste tanks. I know that my problem is the weight of the water behind the rear trailer axle taking too much weight off the tongue. I just can't imagine that approximately 300# back there in those tanks could make it so miserable.

My setup is a 2007 Ram 2500 Cummins 4x4, Anderson Hitch (set 3/4 in nose down), and my 22BHM. I wish I would have thought to put it on the CAT scale while I was at the truck stop to see the numbers, but I didn't even think about it at the time.

We only boondock in this area a couple of time a year. But does anyone have any thoughts or suggestions to help me out the next time I need to head down to the dump station?

bankr63 · 07-10-2017, 03:24 PM

If only 2/3 full could also be the sloshing of the water. Depending on where your tanks are located, I would try to fill the tank that sits right over the axle more to reduce the rear bias, and/or try with both tanks full (actually reduces the effect of water sloshing side to side).

I realise this can be tough if you only have the water in the fresh tank, kind of assumes you have access to some kind of FW at your boondock location. The state parks we go to have no serviced sites, so I consider that boondocking, but fresh water is available in the CG.

**Midnightmoon** · 07-10-2017, 04:03 PM

Those are good ideas. Thanks. Unfortunately, there is no fresh water available at our site. I had approx 45 gal with me between the fresh water tank and my Jerry cans.

I do have a large truck bed tank that I could bring with me for more water, but I'd like to avoid carrying that extra weight if I don't have to.

oldmanAZ · 07-10-2017, 04:06 PM

Is your fresh water tank in front of your axles?

**Midnightmoon** · 07-10-2017, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldmanAZ

Is your fresh water tank in front of your axles?

Yes.

**Midnightmoon** · 07-10-2017, 04:18 PM

I should also add that I only have one battery and one 20# propane tank. Not much room up there on this narrow body trailer to add additional.

Jagiven · 07-10-2017, 04:33 PM

How about moving some items from the back ot the tt upto the front?

**Midnightmoon** · 07-10-2017, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jagiven

How about moving some items from the back ot the tt upto the front?

I wish I could. Since this unit has an outside kitchen, I have nothing stored in the rear compartment. All of my hoses, levelers, etc. are in the front compartments. We emptied the outside fridge before we left. The inside fridge has some food in it, but it sits just above the drivers side rear trailer wheel. It seems like everything is located behind the axles, bunks, outside kitchen, inside fridge, water heater, bathroom, spare tire, etc. I'm going to have to get creative I'm afraid.

Murff · 07-10-2017, 04:49 PM

How was the drive back?

Equalizing bars or none?

Murff

**Midnightmoon** · 07-10-2017, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Murff

How was the drive back?

Equalizing bars or none?

Murff

Drive back was fine. Pulled at it always does. I'm using a Anderson so no bars. But, yes I did have the WD chains connected.

Murff · 07-10-2017, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Midnightmoon

Drive back was fine. Pulled at it always does. I'm using a Anderson so no bars. But, yes I did have the WD chains connected.

Sounds like the trailer just wasn't happy with all the weight in the back. I know tanks of the past were made with baffles to help with the back and forth slosh. I am not sure about tanks made today.

Murff

**Midnightmoon** · 07-10-2017, 05:10 PM

I'm sure that is the case. Thinking about it now, there is very limited storage under the Murphy bed up front. I could have put the 2 cases of drinking water we had left and our folding chairs under there from the truck bed. It would have helped some I'm sure. How much, I don't know.

clubhouse · 07-10-2017, 06:10 PM

Since the issue sounds very likely that is the rear tank placement, which means the only solution is to elimante some of the rear weight or increase forward weight, which also sounds challenging.

My only suggestion would be to get a Barker waste tote to empty your tanks into, at least the grey, and carry to tote in your truck bed. This would certainly get some rear weight moved forward or off the TT altogether.

**Midnightmoon** · 07-10-2017, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clubhouse

Since the issue sounds very likely that is the rear tank placement, which means the only solution is to elimante some of the rear weight or increase forward weight, which also sounds challenging.

My only suggestion would be to get a Barker waste tote to empty your tanks into, at least the grey, and carry to tote in your truck bed. This would certainly get some rear weight moved forward or off the TT altogether.

Thanks. I'll have to look in to it.

**FPM III** · 07-10-2017, 07:38 PM

I know this doesn't help with your TT's "behavior" problem, but you can empty your tanks at PA State Parks with a dump station for a $10.00 ($11.00 if a non-PA resident) fee. It might be more convenient than a 50 mile round trip to the Pilot/Flying J on I-70 at the Smithton exit; especially if you go past a state park with a dump station on your way home. From Connellsville, I don't think Ohiopyle SP is much further, if not closer. However, it's an easier drive to Smithton. I live in walking distance to the boundary of Ohiopyle SP.

To avoid handling problems, I always travel with all my tanks empty and fill the FWT at the nearest potable water outlet to my destination if I know there is no city water outlet at the campsite.

**Midnightmoon** · 07-10-2017, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPM III

I know this doesn't help with your TT's "behavior" problem, but you can empty your tanks at PA State Parks with a dump station for a $10.00 ($11.00 if a non-PA resident) fee. It might be more convenient than a 50 mile round trip to the Pilot/Flying J on I-70 at the Smithton exit; especially if you go past a state park with a dump station on your way home. From Connellsville, I don't think Ohiopyle SP is much further, if not closer. However, it's an easier drive to Smithton. I live in walking to the boundary of Ohiopyle SP.

To avoid handling problems, I always travel with all my tanks empty and fill the FWT at the nearest potable water outlet to my destination if I know there is no city water outlet at the campsite.

It's 19 miles from home up to Ohiopyle SP. I've always just chosen to head down to Smithton before we come home since for the few extra miles, I don't have to pull or come back down either Springfield Pike or 3 Mile Hill (I'm off of 982).

I used to dump at River's Edge down in Connellsville. But, lately it has been a real hassle to get in and out of there now that they are very busy. They are always very nice to deal with, just busy.

Getting back to my new trailer. I just didn't expect it to be so tail heavy. I'll get it figured out, but it is a little frustrating.

PonyExpress · 07-11-2017, 06:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FPM III

To avoid handling problems, I always travel with all my tanks empty and fill the FWT at the nearest potable water outlet to my destination if I know there is no city water outlet at the campsite.

FPM, could you expand on where/ how you get that water?

**FPM III** · 07-11-2017, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PonyExpress

FPM, could you expand on where/ how you get that water?

If I read what you're asking correctly, almost anywhere. Many state parks have fresh water outlets at their dump stations and I fill the tank there before heading to the campsite. Just don't use any of the hoses that are used for rinsing your hoses, tanks, etc. I try to reserve campsites that are near enough to a water outlet at the street that I can temporarily connect my hose to fill the tank. I've also temporarily connected to water outlets at bathhouses when possible. I have a "water thief" for situations where the outlet doesn't have the usual male threaded Garden Hose Thread (GHT) for your hose to connect to. I keep a plastic Coleman jug so if I just need to add some water to the FWT, I can walk to the nearest water spigot for water. Then pour it into the tank via its gravity fill spout. It often takes many trips, but it gets the job done without having to drag the TT to a water outlet.

Dustdevil · 07-11-2017, 10:46 AM

Don't know how your particular unit is laid out, but this sounds like a classic case of the trailer being heavy to the rear of the axles. I think you have identified that correctly. It is also likely a symptom of sloshing. Fresh water tanks often have baffles, but waste tanks never do. It would greatly hinder the draining of those tanks under normal conditions. So, they slosh much more than a fresh water tank. If they are behind your axle, that's likely the issue.

The idea to move as much weight as you can ahead of, or over top of, the trailer axle, is a good one. The farther forward you move the weight, the less you have to use to offset the heavy liquids in tanks behind the axle. But be aware that placing that much of the total weight at opposing ends of the trailer does present a problem of inertia. If that trailer starts to come around on you in a turn or a hard stop, it will likely just keep going. If it does start swaying, there is plenty of inertia to keep it swaying. So, you have to be extremely careful with that much weight at the extremes away from the axle. But it's certainly better than a tongue that's too light.

**Midnightmoon** · 08-27-2017, 05:48 PM

Just a quick update to this thread. Moving weight forward under the sofa has helped quite a bit. But the biggest change came from adjustments I made to my Anderson.

When we were backing in to our spot this weekend, my wife noticed that the tension chains on the hitch were unloading as I was backing up a hill and turning in to our site. Sure enough, when the truck and trailer were level, the chains had tension. But as soon as you got the truck turned and or on a twist, one or both of the chains would lose tension. So, to make a long story short, I ended up cutting a link off of my chains and reset my adjustments. Even though it appeared to be ok on level ground, I don't think I had enough compression of the bushings to keep tension on the chains under all conditions.

Sure enough, on the way home, it pulled like a different trailer. Rock solid and steady with the tanks full and on on the way home with them empty. I would have never found it if my wife wasn't spotting me backing up.

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