Time to buy a Diesel...help?

SparkDr · 01-19-2016, 06:23 PM

Decided to buy a used diesel tow vehicle under $25k. Never owned one before and need help dialing in a model year segment to shop within. My current truck is a 2010 GMC 5.3L Ext Cab 4WD standard bed gasser. I am looking for the same setup in a 2500HD diesel (GM product, Ext Cab, 4WD, standard bed). Hearing some discouraging things about the newer diesels and want to have a simpler, reliable one in the stable as a secondary vehicle. My current truck will remain the daily driver. I've heard some good things about the 2007 era trucks of this genre and would like some confirmation before seriously shopping. Current trailer is a 2016 WhiteHawk 27DSRL, and I expect to keep the truck long enough to graduate to a couple's 5th wheel in about 3 years. I jus't can't do a Ford or Dodge, but all other opinions are welcome.

SouthCo · 01-19-2016, 07:09 PM

I went from a 2010 1500 GMC Sierra 5.3 to a 2007 GMC Sierra Classic 2500 Duramax. The Duramax Allison is a great combo. Mine is the LBZ Duramax. No DEF or DPF. But I wouldn't shy away from a 2012 or newer one either. I believe the 2012 and newer got a stronger frame. It's been a great truck.

nhfire152 · 01-19-2016, 07:35 PM

I picked up my 2015 Duramax Crewcab a year ago in June. This truck is an absolute powerhouse and is a pleasure to drive as my daily driver, tows my fiver without a problem and pushes snow like its a tank.

Just curious, what did you hear that was bad regarding the newer ones?

Stingray75 · 01-19-2016, 09:20 PM

If your looking for the occasional hauler and can find a 2006 or early 2007 with the LBZ engine, you should be able to stick to your budget. They're popular so don't hesitate to check it out. The negative stuff you hear on the newer DMax is a blend of folks resistant to change and some 1st year problems (2011). Some of us remember when unleaded fuel was mandated - "that crap will ruin your engine"

My 2011 has had sensors replaced under warranty and other than a code or three, been trouble free for 120k miles. It pulls stronger than my LBZ, gets better mileage, carries more and, light bulbs in the steering wheel controls haven't burnt out.

Bassdogs · 01-19-2016, 09:34 PM

Picked up a 2010 2500 HD Duramax a couple years ago for $40k with 62000 miles. Great truck and good ride. It is also a crew cab.

dalebra · 01-19-2016, 10:42 PM

Used are hard to find. I started by looking at used first but found very little available. I ended up getting a new 2015 2500HD Duramax last June and very happy with it. It's a great ride and pulled my Octane T26Y TT loaded through the Colorado Rockies last July like it wasn't even there. You would not believe that Allison transmission and the exhaust braking works great too.I have not seen much for negative comments on the new Duramax so I'll be listening.......

Fairenatic · 01-19-2016, 10:53 PM

I know you can not "do" a Dodge but if you want a tried and true diesel, does not get more reliable than a Cummins TD.

P.S. And this is coming from a dyed in the wool Chevy fan!

clubhouse · 01-19-2016, 11:03 PM

Not sure how much research you have done, hopefully this is helpful.

In GM Duramax the engine RPO code is commonly how these trucks are referred to. Some still talk year, but RPO is more specific.

The first generation Duramax (01-04) was LB7, then LLY (04.5-05), next LBZ (06-07), LMM (07.5-10) and currently LML (11-current).

Why does this matter, because each generation of engine added more and more emission crap. The LBZ is generally considered the best. They are only available in the "classic body style" but are getting harder and harder find to find. The LBZ essentially only has an EGR, no DPF to get clogged or DEF (urea) to buy.

I have an LMM, this is the first generation to add the DPF but still no DEF required. I love mine and have had only one "sorta serious issue". My ECM (computer) failed which prevented any electrical. It cost $800 to get a new one, have it flashed and installed. I have had to replace two glow plugs too - $90 each if I recall correctly.

The newest DMAX adds DEF to the emission equipment. That is enough for me personally to stay away. But it also is the first with a grade brake -- my Allison will downshift and hold the lower gear in T/H mode very nicely, but it certainly isn't a true exhaust brake.

I think you should be able to find a decent LBZ or LMM in your budget. Either would make you an excellent tow vehicle and back up truck.

SparkDr · 01-20-2016, 05:06 AM

Clubhouse has pretty much confirmed most of what I have already read and heard. The Duramax LBZ seems be be my target. The 06-07 model years should be at or near my budget which is very important to me as I have decided to pay cash for this purchase. There's $2k-$3k in wiggle room there if I find the "perfect" truck. Sorry about the Dodge-Ford thing, but I have been the loudmouth "GM rocks and everything else sucks guy" most of my life. While this opinion certainly doesn't hold true any more, my ego just isn't ready for the relentless harassment if I was to make the switch. For now, I can stay GM and satisfy my needs. Thanks to all for the help so far. I really do appreciate it.

ROC-REQS · 01-20-2016, 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SparkDr

Decided to buy a used diesel tow vehicle under $25k. Never owned one before and need help dialing in a model year segment to shop within. My current truck is a 2010 GMC 5.3L Ext Cab 4WD standard bed gasser. I am looking for the same setup in a 2500HD diesel (GM product, Ext Cab, 4WD, standard bed). Hearing some discouraging things about the newer diesels and want to have a simpler, reliable one in the stable as a secondary vehicle. My current truck will remain the daily driver. I've heard some good things about the 2007 era trucks of this genre and would like some confirmation before seriously shopping. Current trailer is a 2016 WhiteHawk 27DSRL, and I expect to keep the truck long enough to graduate to a couple's 5th wheel in about 3 years. I jus't can't do a Ford or Dodge, but all other opinions are welcome.

Hi SparkDr,

I've had both a 2006 GMC 2500HD D/A Crew Cab 4x4 (LBZ engine) and now a 2014 GMC 3500HD D/A Crew Cab 4x4 (LML engine).

In both the GM Duramax Diesel was awesome. No problems.
There are features on the 2014 that were not on the 2006, like the exhaust brake that is very nice for towing. Also the 2014 Duramax has more torque and get's better millage then my 2006 got.
Not sure what year GM started to include the exhaust brake, but that's a very nice feature to have when towing.

When looking I would not rule out looking for a 3500HD also, if the price is right. Ride between the 2500HD and 3500HD is the same, just more payload with the 3500HD. Plus if planning to upgrade to a FW in the future, a 3500HD will give you more options on the FWs you can look at.

When we bought our FW I had to upgrade the truck from the 2500HD to a 3500HD because the FW we wanted overloaded the 2500HD.

Hope this helps.

Bookemdanno · 01-20-2016, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SparkDr

Sorry about the Dodge-Ford thing, but I have been the loudmouth "GM rocks and everything else sucks guy" most of my life.

I had the same opinion with regards to Ford. Always had one and always drove one. When I was looking at getting a diesel, the wife convinced me to drive the big 3...afterwards, for whatever reason, the Ram won me over hands down!

Dan

Fairenatic · 01-20-2016, 07:58 AM

What I find interesting is that Dodge split off a division for their trucks and it is just RAM. And Chevy and Ram do not even use a GM or Dodge motor, but someone elses. Ironic. And when you dig into where all the parts come from, you may come to the conclusion that they are neither any more.

P.S. In my experience, it is not the motors that are the weak link anyway. It is the transmissions. Most of the motors will do 500K but the transmissions won't. And at least for Ram, no one rebuilds the Aisons.

KYCAMPER · 01-20-2016, 08:33 AM

I have a 2015 GMC DMAX with a 27DSRL. Driving down the road I have to remind myself there is a camper back there! Pulled through the Rockies this summer no problem. Unless there are a lot of hills I don't use Tow/Haul and the thing goes down the road at 1400RPM about 65MPH with no downshifting. Not sure about the older diesels but I have been very happy with mine. If you can find a 3500 its not much more $ for lots more payload. I bought my TV with the intention of upgrading to a larger 5er in a year or two. Went to the Tampa RV show last week and there wasn't a 5er on the lot (except for some toyhaulers) that exceeded my truck's payload.

Tom_OC · 01-27-2016, 09:56 PM

I was never ever a Dodge guy, but a wise old man( 86 year old friend of a friend) told me not to rule it out and to take a look at the RAM before I buy my Chevy I wanted. I looked into it and couldn't be happier. Wife still makes fun of this Chevy guy driving a RAM. She loves it as much as me

cariboocreek · 01-27-2016, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairenatic

What I find interesting is that Dodge split off a division for their trucks and it is just RAM. And Chevy and Ram do not even use a GM or Dodge motor, but someone elses. Ironic. And when you dig into where all the parts come from, you may come to the conclusion that they are neither any more.

P.S. In my experience, it is not the motors that are the weak link anyway. It is the transmissions. Most of the motors will do 500K but the transmissions won't. And at least for Ram, no one rebuilds the Aisons.

FYI Ford only began building their own diesel engines in 2011. Prior to that Ford also used a contract engine builder. At one point a few years ago Ford was even a minority share holder in Cummins.

DesertJayco · 01-27-2016, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bookemdanno

I had the same opinion with regards to Ford. Always had one and always drove one. When I was looking at getting a diesel, the wife convinced me to drive the big 3...afterwards, for whatever reason, the Ram won me over hands down!

Dan

Quote:

Originally Posted by SparkDr

"GM rocks and everything else sucks guy" most of my life. While this opinion certainly doesn't hold true any more, my ego just isn't ready for the relentless harassment if I was to make the switch. For now, I can stay GM and satisfy my needs. Thanks to all for the help so far. I really do appreciate it.

Laughed a little when I read your posts. Ive been a "GM rocks guy" forever. My previous truck was an 04 Chev HD 2500 crew cab 4x4 Long bed. 120kmiles. Awesome truck. Over time they made the HP and torque better with the newer model trucks but I never had any complaints. But then we decided to get a larger fifth wheel and I needed a bigger truck. Looked at the GMs but the interiors just felt to much the same to me after the last 25 years or so. So my mind started to wander and began to consider becoming a "traitor" to my brand. That Cummins engine is awesome but I ended up going to the Ford. I have been happy with this Super Duty but man do I still get crap from my "friends" for buying something other than a GM. I hate to drive up and see those guys cuz they still won't give my "change of heart " a pass. That being said...get what you want! Climb into that cockpit and feel the roar. If you don't feel "it"...go get into another cockpit...

hboy · 01-28-2016, 07:43 AM

I heard a diesel mechanic say the '09 - '12 Duramax is a good motor. Earlier version of the motor had injection problems.

jal0710 · 01-28-2016, 09:43 AM

2003's had an injector problem, but I think GM probably conquered that going forward. I had a 2003 GMC D/A combo and had the injectors replaced under warranty and used that truck to pull our FW and boat for about six more years until selling it and getting a Ram 3/4 ton diesel with a manual transmission and derated engine. Had that truck for nine months and went back to GMC because of the disappointing mileage and my perception of lack of towing ability compared to the GMC, as well as my not liking to back with the manual transmission when looking over my shoulder as I get older and less flexible. I believe all the diesels are very good right now, I think it comes down to preference for some things like interior, ride and comfort, and price. When I was looking for a vehicle to replace the Ram I bought and sold, I found that, at least around here, the Fords were quite a bit higher in price than the Ram or GM products and I did try to compare the prices with similar equipment.

Derek700 · 01-30-2016, 10:28 PM

We went from an 05 F150 to an 08 Ram 3500 and it has been great for towing our trailer. My wife is far more relaxed when we are driving which makes me much more relaxed. Diesels are great for towing.

tjpolsin · 01-31-2016, 01:46 AM

I have told this story in previous posts. I upgraded from a '96 K2500 suburban in 2010 because we wore it out. I couldn't find a used long bed CC diesel that was worth spending money on. Either wornout and too expensive, or it was a salvage rebuild and not worth the risk. Therefore looked at new.

The 2010 GM model drove just fine, good turning radius and low step-in height. The interior was looked just like my '96, it didn't seat six, and the back seats were small.

The 2010 ford also drove fine, little stiffer and a little taller, and loud. The interior was futuristic, the front seats were too narrow and not comfortable. and small back seat was small and low.

The 2010 Ram was a surprise! Large back seats with lots of leg room. comfortable front seats. Tall ride height like the ford with similar turning radius. AND QUIET

The Ram was the cheapest, and had the best incentive package, and has been sitting in my driveway for 5 years and 70K miles. In the end, how well your butt fits in the driver's seat is the one you should buy.

Tim
2010 Ram 2500 LBCC
2008 JFLT 26BHS

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