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07-24-2017, 10:58 AM
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#1
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Cloverdale
Posts: 12
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Hard time climbing hills
Having a hard time climbing hills in my Redhawk 23XM. It seems to want to hesitate when going up a hill it kinds of lugs like its trying to find the right gear or something. Should I be putting it in tow haul mode for going up hill.When I take my foot off the gas a little bit it seems to smooth out and help a bit. Thanks
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07-24-2017, 11:19 AM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Orem
Posts: 113
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Check Your Filters
Check your air and fuel filters. My dirty fuel filter slowed me down so much once, all of the semis were passing me like I was standing still.
Won't happen again as I change them so often.
__________________
2008 Jayco 24 RKS
2012 Suburban
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07-24-2017, 11:30 AM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: FL
Posts: 11,281
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I certainly would try tow/haul mode. It signals the computer to change shift points etc. It might not help, but then it might and there's nothing harmful with trying it.
__________________
Sherm & Terry w/rescue Eydie (min Schnauzer) & Charley (std Poodle)
SOLD:2015 Jay Flight 27RLS, GY Endurance (E), Days: 102 '15, 90 '16, 80 '17, 161 '18, 365+ '20
SOLD: 2006 Ford F350 PSD, 4WD, CC, LB, SRW, Camper pkg., 375,000mi
Full timing: Some will think you're crazy, some will be envious, just enjoy the freedom!
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07-24-2017, 11:33 AM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2014
Location: North Western West Virginia
Posts: 671
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What year is your Redhawk? If it has the 6 speed transmission, you won't need tow/haul. We had a 23XM, and it did fine on hills.
Have you checked the air filter?
__________________
The Logan's
2018 Jayco Alante 31v
Me, Dear Wife,
2 Bluetick Hounds
1 Newfoundland
1 Newfoundland / Black Lab Mix
1 Cairn Terrier
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07-24-2017, 11:46 AM
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#5
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Orange County
Posts: 644
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Depends on how steep the hill is. Any time the trans wants to shift out of overdrive, you ought to be using tow/haul. Every. Single. Time. That is precisely what tow/haul is for. You will pay the price for not doing that.
As for keeping air filters clean, that's also great advice. You are hauling around an extremely heavy load with your rig, and anything you can do to help a gasser keep up its torque and horsepower will result in improvement. A screaming engine that's having to not only pull the load up a hill, but struggling to overcome a dirty air intake filter is a severely overworked engine. I don't know how many miles you have on your rig, but if it's more than 25 thousand or 3 years, you ought to consider a tune-up as well as a trans fluid change. More often than your daily driver, because it's asked to work much much harder than your daily driver.
__________________
2006 Jayco Seneca 34SS
2006 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon Toad
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07-24-2017, 04:15 PM
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#6
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Cloverdale
Posts: 12
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Its a 2015
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07-24-2017, 04:47 PM
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#7
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Vermilion
Posts: 17
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Wouldn't think you would need to do that with that small of a rig. how big of hill are we talking about? Is it out west mountain pass?? Your not towing car, trailer are you?? I have yet to need the tow/haul unless I am towing the car with me. In my 29MV , I have seen a few hills an have not needed to use tow/haul.
__________________
2016 Greyhawk 29MV.
My wife & I , And Ruger The GSD!!!
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07-24-2017, 05:12 PM
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#8
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Cloverdale
Posts: 12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thatsme
Wouldn't think you would need to do that with that small of a rig. how big of hill are we talking about? Is it out west mountain pass?? Your not towing car, trailer are you?? I have yet to need the tow/haul unless I am towing the car with me. In my 29MV , I have seen a few hills an have not needed to use tow/haul.
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The hill was big going threw the north cascades. I wasn't towing my car this time. But it did the same thing when i was towing my car up a smaller hill close to home. It seems to be trying to find the right gear or something like i said when i let my foot off the gas a little bit it seems to smooth out.
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07-24-2017, 05:59 PM
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#9
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Vermilion
Posts: 17
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In that case yes use tow/haul. On steep grades if not using tow/haul it will search for a gear. Can't hurt to try.
__________________
2016 Greyhawk 29MV.
My wife & I , And Ruger The GSD!!!
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07-25-2017, 06:58 AM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Orange County
Posts: 644
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So, the longer version, since I didn't have as much time yesterday.
What happens when you are on flat ground, or going downhill, and the gasoline engine begins to labor, but you want to keep up your speed, is that the transmission module controller senses more work being done. You may be pressing harder on the accelerator, or the cruise control may be doing that for you. At some point when it's sensing enough torque/work/fuel use/speed vs throttle position, the transmission module makes the decision to downshift. This is for two reasons. First is that it is protecting the clutches in the transmission from overwork, heat, and slipping, since the rpm is dropping otherwise, and the torque converter will at some point slide out of lockup condition. Secondly, it's protecting the engine from lugging. About the worst load you can place on a gasoline engine is to work it hard at low rpm. Lugging. They don't like that. Most engines, especially today's high-revving smaller displacement V8s, like a bit of rpm to develop their torque and horsepower. If you're going to load them heavily (and, yes a 23 ft motorhome is a heavy load on a 425 cubic inch modern V8), they are far happier at or above their peak torque and/or Hp rpm. Not lugging down around 1700 or so.
So, the transmission first drops out of overdrive, and then may even select a lower gear again, based on workload/throttle position/rpm. Not only does too high of a gear stress the engine and the clutch pack/torque converter in the trans, but it begins to "hunt" between two or more gears. Every time you scream the engine to increase your speed on an uphill, then lighten up on the throttle as you approach the speed you think you ought to be traveling, the transmission senses that as the top of the hill, and upshifts again to the too-high gear you were in before (maybe even overdrive). So, it bounces back and forth constantly between two gear ranges. That wears out the valve body in your transmission, in addition to placing the whole drivetrain under very heavy loads. Add heat of summer, and you have the perfect recipe for premature failure of whatever turns out to be the weakest link.
So, as you start uphill, and your drivetrain computer senses additional load, then shifts out of overdrive, lock out your overdrive so it can't hunt between normal range and overdrive. If you are driving on anything but a straight flat or slight downhill stretch of highway, I would not even take it out of tow/haul. In fact, with my Allison in the Seneca, it has the Allison 100-MH. The MH stands for motorhome model. What that means is that they don't even give you the option of switching OUT of tow-haul, because that transmission is always pushing a heavy load. It's never simply pushing an empty pickup truck down the highway. It's always got a 20,000 lb load it's handling. So, you cannot take it out of Tow/haul. If you want your drivetrain to last, you want to learn to let the trans controller select the gear it's going to use for the load that is present, then lock it down in whatever that gear is, and just climb the hill without screaming the engine.
If there are more hills coming, either uphill or downhill, just leave it in Tow/haul until you're on the flats again. Don't get in a hurry, or you'll once again be tempted to take that transmission to a higher gear, and you'll be right back where you started overstressing your drivetrain. Of course, it's always good to have fresh engine oil, clean filters, and fresh trans fluid.
__________________
2006 Jayco Seneca 34SS
2006 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon Toad
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07-26-2017, 12:39 AM
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#11
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Cloverdale
Posts: 12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dustdevil
So, the longer version, since I didn't have as much time yesterday.
What happens when you are on flat ground, or going downhill, and the gasoline engine begins to labor, but you want to keep up your speed, is that the transmission module controller senses more work being done. You may be pressing harder on the accelerator, or the cruise control may be doing that for you. At some point when it's sensing enough torque/work/fuel use/speed vs throttle position, the transmission module makes the decision to downshift. This is for two reasons. First is that it is protecting the clutches in the transmission from overwork, heat, and slipping, since the rpm is dropping otherwise, and the torque converter will at some point slide out of lockup condition. Secondly, it's protecting the engine from lugging. About the worst load you can place on a gasoline engine is to work it hard at low rpm. Lugging. They don't like that. Most engines, especially today's high-revving smaller displacement V8s, like a bit of rpm to develop their torque and horsepower. If you're going to load them heavily (and, yes a 23 ft motorhome is a heavy load on a 425 cubic inch modern V8), they are far happier at or above their peak torque and/or Hp rpm. Not lugging down around 1700 or so.
So, the transmission first drops out of overdrive, and then may even select a lower gear again, based on workload/throttle position/rpm. Not only does too high of a gear stress the engine and the clutch pack/torque converter in the trans, but it begins to "hunt" between two or more gears. Every time you scream the engine to increase your speed on an uphill, then lighten up on the throttle as you approach the speed you think you ought to be traveling, the transmission senses that as the top of the hill, and upshifts again to the too-high gear you were in before (maybe even overdrive). So, it bounces back and forth constantly between two gear ranges. That wears out the valve body in your transmission, in addition to placing the whole drivetrain under very heavy loads. Add heat of summer, and you have the perfect recipe for premature failure of whatever turns out to be the weakest link.
So, as you start uphill, and your drivetrain computer senses additional load, then shifts out of overdrive, lock out your overdrive so it can't hunt between normal range and overdrive. If you are driving on anything but a straight flat or slight downhill stretch of highway, I would not even take it out of tow/haul. In fact, with my Allison in the Seneca, it has the Allison 100-MH. The MH stands for motorhome model. What that means is that they don't even give you the option of switching OUT of tow-haul, because that transmission is always pushing a heavy load. It's never simply pushing an empty pickup truck down the highway. It's always got a 20,000 lb load it's handling. So, you cannot take it out of Tow/haul. If you want your drivetrain to last, you want to learn to let the trans controller select the gear it's going to use for the load that is present, then lock it down in whatever that gear is, and just climb the hill without screaming the engine.
If there are more hills coming, either uphill or downhill, just leave it in Tow/haul until you're on the flats again. Don't get in a hurry, or you'll once again be tempted to take that transmission to a higher gear, and you'll be right back where you started overstressing your drivetrain. Of course, it's always good to have fresh engine oil, clean filters, and fresh trans fluid.
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Thanks for all the information. I will make sure I use the tow haul more often when we head out on are next journey in September. Hopefully we will get a smoother ride and no lugging.
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07-26-2017, 11:03 AM
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#12
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Orange County
Posts: 644
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To clarify my confusing scenario above:
"...on flat ground, or going downhill, and the gasoline engine begins to labor..." should read: "...on flat ground, or going downhill, then transitioning to uphill, and the gasoline engine begins to labor...".
__________________
2006 Jayco Seneca 34SS
2006 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon Toad
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07-26-2017, 11:11 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Orange County
Posts: 644
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And sorry for the long diatribe. I do hope it helps with understanding how the drivetrain works to find the optimum condition for the engine and trans. I've been doing this a long time with a number of different RV types and pickup TV types. Not a pro truck driver like a few here, but I've got some long-term exposure to the point even my brain can understand it. I've been lucky enough to acquire one with a diesel and Allison drivetrain, and it is a bit more forgiving. But I still tend to baby it a little. I do not like breakdowns, especially on road trips.
__________________
2006 Jayco Seneca 34SS
2006 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited Rubicon Toad
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07-26-2017, 11:17 AM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Arizona
Posts: 2,324
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We find hitting the bottom of most any hill 10 over speed limit.Helps us keep out of passing gear to get over the top!
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07-27-2017, 08:46 PM
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#15
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Baker city
Posts: 148
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My opinion is you should always put in tow/haul up or down hills!
No different than your car Take it out of overdrive, same thing, much easier on the car and brakes as well.
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