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Old 06-04-2016, 09:00 PM   #1
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Klassic's turn for solar.

Gathering some solar parts for a 260watt solar system.
Keeping it smallish because of the smallish dollars I want to put into this.
I'm not a 7 day boondocker, maybe 3 at the most if I can't fit into a powered site and have to stay in a non powered site, or we do a 1 or 2 day event somewhere.
I've found having the residential fridge depletes 2 T-105's quicker than I thought
And I love the residential fridge so solar it is.
Most likely after a while I'll end up with a generator, or 2 more batteries.

The Morningstar controller is larger than I thought. I'm searching for somewhere to mount it.


The 260watt panel is 5'5" long. I want to keep it close to the roof connection so I don't have to run wires along the roof. So it needs to go in the middle of the roof near the roof solar connectors...longways across the roof because there is only 5 feet between my AC and the roof vent.
The roof has a pretty good arc over a 5'5" run from side to side...I'm going to make some aluminum "L" brackets and bolt them to a piece of aluminum angle that is bolted along the bottom of the panel frame. This way I can unbolt it easily to scrape off the wasp nests I know will be under there.


So far I think my mounting location for the controller is going to be near the batteries...I need to extend the Jayco prewire 8ga to the battery area. The 8ga is already about 17' long coming from the roof connection. I need to extend it another 15' to the battery area where the controller will be.

Question for the Solar gurus..the panel is about 8.3 amps and 31v. I think the 17' 8ga is about the limit for a 2% voltage loss. Does it make sense to splice a 4ga to the 8ga for the remaining 15' to the controller?
It's either that or mount the controller behind the basement wall (where there is lots of room) near where the 8ga wire from the panel ends. I won't be able to see the controller without removing the wall. Removing the wall is a PITA.
I wouldn't need to see it, though, if I bought the remote moniter, but that is another $200 Canadian
If I mount it behind the wall then I would run 4ga to the batteries for about 15'.

Opinions?
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Old 06-04-2016, 09:24 PM   #2
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Nice components there Klassic! Good call on going with an MPPT controller too.

In my opinion, splicing a 4 ga to the 8 ga will only help a little. I would go with 6 ga or bigger for the whole run if you can. You already spent $ on the system, so keep the wire big.

face value: $.02

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Old 06-04-2016, 09:48 PM   #3
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Thanks jgerhard.
With the residential fridge there is no easy way to run new wires. It would be easy to go down an RV fridge stack. I might be tempted then.

I guess I could go down one of the tank vents.
Hmmm... More to think about now.
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Old 06-04-2016, 10:00 PM   #4
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I see your predicament now. Since you can't run a new wire easily, I would do your original plan and splice 4 to 8 ga. The loss will only be apparent if your batteries were really low. You can always change it later if you notice an issue which I think you won't.
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Old 06-04-2016, 11:37 PM   #5
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Quote:
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I see your predicament now. Since you can't run a new wire easily, I would do your original plan and splice 4 to 8 ga. The loss will only be apparent if your batteries were really low. You can always change it later if you notice an issue which I think you won't.
Looking at a couple of different 24v wire loss charts I see anywhere from about 33-38 feet as being the limit for 8ga w/2% loss so in theory if the OP ran the extra 15' with 8ga it should be OK. If it's easy to splice the 4ga in that would eliminate any uncertainty so I might be inclined to do that as well.
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Old 06-05-2016, 07:09 AM   #6
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Klassic - are you sure that you have 8awg from roof? Mine was wired with 6awg.

ON EDIT: My mistake! I knew that I had 6awg going into my controller. I had forgotten that I extended the factory 8awg with 6awg to get the controller closer to the batteries than the location that Jayco mounted their "suggested" controller location plate.
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Old 06-05-2016, 07:17 AM   #7
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Klassic,
Measure the wire and compare to the chart below to find the wire gauge.

Don
Attached Thumbnails
ELECTRICAL - Wire Gauge by Wire Thickness.jpg  
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Old 06-05-2016, 07:29 AM   #8
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As for controller mounting position, I mounted mine in the basement, in that recess where the factory cord hook was mounted, on the drivers side. I also mounted the 2000w inverter there. That keeps both within 4 or 5 feet from the batteries, yet in a separate compartment (as both the controller and inverter manufacturer recommend).
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Old 06-05-2016, 08:10 AM   #9
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My math was wrong. You are a lot closer ttavasc.
Thanks Mustang.

Instructor, what did you splice with?

To splice and make the wire longer I need to buy wire because in the Jayco prewire setup, they came from the roof with 2 wires (+ -) ...then the wires end behind the basement wall.
They continue again to the battery area with only one wire (+) and the negative is chassis grounded right where the roof wires stop and the battery wire starts.
I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be right to splice just the positive wire to extend to the controller and chassis ground the negative wire at the panel input in the controller.
?
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Old 06-05-2016, 08:44 AM   #10
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As for controller mounting position, I mounted mine in the basement, in that recess where the factory cord hook was mounted, on the drivers side. I also mounted the 2000w inverter there. That keeps both within 4 or 5 feet from the batteries, yet in a separate compartment (as both the controller and inverter manufacturer recommend).
Hey now! ... I never looked over there because I have too much stuff in that spot, but that might be the perfect spot if I move a couple things.
Thanks.

I can easily acquire 6ga wire. I think the plan will be to extend with 6ga over to the spot mentioned above. That's within 5' to the batteries and use the 6ga to hook up to the batteries.
As much as I love gadgets, I'm forgoing the overly expensive RM2 moniter and will read battery voltage from my $10 battery voltage moniter from Mustangs thread.

Then I will probably never be on a site without power and never end up using the system.
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Old 06-05-2016, 09:33 AM   #11
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Instructor, what did you splice with?
Probably doesn't meet the electrical code, but I picked up a package of these at the local Home Depot. They sell them in 2-packs for about $6 at the store. I slid a ½" piece of heat shrink tube over one end before making the connection, and that protected it after the joint was made, Wrapped it all up good with electrical tape when done.

Blackburn Type ASR Splicer Reducer with Solid Barrier Wire Stop for #2 Stranded to 14 AWG Wire (Case of 10)-ASR0214-B2-10 - The Home Depot
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Old 06-05-2016, 09:44 AM   #12
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Are you also installing an inverter to run the "house" electric? If so, a 2000w inverter will need bigger cable to run properly than the solar converter needs to supply the batteries. I have the 6awg running from the roof feed to the converter, about two feet of #4 cable from the controller to the connection posts on the back of the 2000w inverter, then #0 cable from the inverter to the batteries. Since my batteries are four 6v, wired in series two make two "big" 12v batteries, then in parallel to combine them, all of the cable connecting the batteries is #0. I used red and black for the pos and negs, but I ordered yellow for the two jumpers that join two 6v into a big 12v.
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Old 06-05-2016, 09:56 AM   #13
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I already have a 1000w inverter for the residential fridge.
This is pretty much the only reason I'm putting in the solar.
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Old 06-05-2016, 10:15 AM   #14
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I already have a 1000w inverter for the residential fridge.
This is pretty much the only reason I'm putting in the solar.
We're spoiled now, having 120v available at any outlet, whenever needed. When I traded my previous trailer, I was disappointed that the dealer wouldn't give me any money for my solar system, and preferred that I completely remove it. Now I'm glad that I did, as it's all installing nicely in the new North Point!
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Old 06-05-2016, 12:16 PM   #15
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Klassic - Are you installing a fuse between the panels and the controller? I have a disconnect switch, but the more I'm reading, it should also be fused. (I didn't have that on my previous installation.)

I looked at in-line cartridge fuses that would connect at the MC4 connections on the roof, but I couldn't find any with a UL rating, and I saw some bad reviews on them failing (melting). Instead, I'm thinking of an AFN/AHN style 30A fuse mounted before the disconnect switch, in the basement. These fuses and the fuse holders are readily available on-line, or at any of the retail places that sell the components of the high-power "boom" car audio systems. (I think that Best Buy has them.)
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Old 06-05-2016, 12:24 PM   #16
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I am using one of those dc breakers in my picture. This way it is on a breaker and I can use the breaker for disconnect too.
I suppose it would make more sense to have the line fused closer to the panel incase the wire shorts, but oh well...I'll risk it.
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Old 06-22-2016, 08:12 PM   #17
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Finally installed.
Not real world tested yet, but this morning at 7 I unplugged the shore power with the residential fridge running, whatever parasitic draws and the roof fan running.
I came home 12 hours later to a completely full battery and everything still running.





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Old 06-22-2016, 08:22 PM   #18
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It is a GREAT feeling when it all comes together and works great. Now for the over night test with no shore power. Get some self leveling Dicore and cover all your mounts for added protection
Don
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Old 06-22-2016, 08:28 PM   #19
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Excellent looking install Klassic! Congratulations on making your motor-home more self sustaining, and enjoy the benefits.
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Old 06-22-2016, 08:37 PM   #20
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It is a GREAT feeling when it all comes together and works great. Now for the over night test with no shore power. Get some self leveling Dicore and cover all your mounts for added protection
Don
I went to my dealer to get some self leveling sealant, I needed beige...they had tons. Brought them to the counter and noticed the bottom said White.
All mislabeled.
Do you think they cared? I'm still waiting, two weeks. Maybe this Saturday.

I put little squares of Eternabond under each mount before screwing. Should be good until I get the caulk.
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