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Old 07-23-2013, 11:43 PM   #1
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Question Can I increase the tire size on my Jayfeather Sport 165?

Hello,

I have a 2011 Jayfeather Sport 165, that has 13" wheels, both of which have already worn out without much use. The wheels seem unusually small for a rig this size, and I'm wondering if I can purchase 14" or 15" wheels for this rig? There seems to be ample room for at least a 14" wheel--which of course I would test before using--but am wondering if I did increase the wheel size what the implications of this would be on other factors, such as tongue weight. I realize it would increase the overall height of the trailer, which is fine given that I sometimes take it on some rough forest service roads and can adjust the height of my trailer hitch on my vehicle easily.

So, if anyone has any experience or thoughts on this, I would be grateful for hearing from you.

Thank you,

Richard in Bozeman, Montana.
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Old 07-24-2013, 05:47 AM   #2
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I looked into this when I was shopping for new (and possibly larger) tires. Look up into the wheelwell above the tires. These isnt much room there for a larger tire/14" wheel when you think of the suspension travel etc. If you get the Dexter lift kit for the torsion axel you should be OK with a 14" setup. Heres the thread..

http://www.jaycoowners.com/showthrea...orflex-10-axle
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Old 07-25-2013, 05:01 PM   #3
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Hello,

Thank you for the reply: I was hoping that the 14" wheels would work without any lifters, but if these are required, this is good to know!

Richard
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Old 07-25-2013, 08:16 PM   #4
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No Prob. These particullar models are designed to ride low so cars/mini-vans are able to tow them.
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Old 07-28-2013, 10:13 PM   #5
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Can I increase the tire size on my Jayfeather Sport 165? Yes!

Increasing the size of the wheels has no effect on tongue weight. With that noted, I bought a 2010 Jay Feather Sport 165 in May and the first thing I did was to buy 14 inch wheels and tires for it. I didn't like being right at the limit of weight carrying capacity for the 13-inch wheel/tire combo and I also don't like the very limited selection of 13-inch tires. The old tires were 185mm bias ply. I bought three 14-inch wheels and Carlisle Radial Trail RH tires in size 215/75R14. So far I've been to Custer State Park, Badlands NP, and Rocky Mountain NP (roughly 1000 miles) and I have had no issues. The only thing that's different is that it's a little more difficult to fit the 14-inch wheel/tire assembly because it is larger and the clearance is a little tighter. For me, a lift kit would present more liabilities (expense, effort, higher vehicle profile, increased wind resistance) than benefits (marginally easier to remove and install the wheel/tire assembly).
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Old 07-29-2013, 07:15 AM   #6
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When you say worn out, what do you mean? The tread on the tires? Also, I'm curious to know what problem you are trying to solve?

Just a couple of things to keep in mind, you cannot increase the load capacity of the trailer by putting bigger wheels on. You are still limited by the axle capacity. Also its a myth that larger wheels are going to last longer or somehow be better. We had a Jayco Kiwi 17A, single axle, 13in wheels. Over 10 years, we put many thousands of miles on those wheels and tires. We towed it on one cross country trip to California and back, and out to Yellowstone from WI. Never blew a single tire, never had any trouble.

What I'm saying is that you probably won't gain much if anything by going to a 14 in wheel.
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Old 07-29-2013, 09:58 AM   #7
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Can I increase the tire size on my Jayfeather Sport 165?

These axles (Dexter #10) are available in 4 ride heights. Mine is a zero degree model. That means the pivot arm is supposed to be parallel to the ground at full load.

I'm looking into how much a 22 or 45 degree axle would lift it. A full axle with brakes is about $350, but I'm looking for one that's bare. Should be $150 or less.

I have the 14" upgrade and do like not being right at the limit of the tire.
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Old 07-30-2013, 09:59 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by DocBrown View Post
What I'm saying is that you probably won't gain much if anything by going to a 14 in wheel.
Unlike DocBrown, I had two blowouts and one tread separation in three years of owning my old trailer, so perhaps I am over-sensitive to the subject. My old trailer was a single-axle unit with 13-inch wheels and it only weighed 2150 pounds empty.

Tire failure is an expensive, time-wasting nuisance and it can be extremely dangerous. Changing a tire on the side of a busy road is intimidating. Replacing a tire can be expensive if you are in the middle of nowhere, not to mention the damage a blowout can do to your trailer.

For those of you who are not familiar with the 2010 Jay Feather Sport 165, the GVWR is 3500 pounds, but it weighs 2910 pounds empty and 2982 pounds with propane. A full tank of fresh water chews up another 249 pounds. That leaves a measly 269 pounds for cargo. My original sidewalls showed the tires were rated to carry 1660 pounds at 65 PSI (total 3320 pounds). Stamped into each wheel was the same 1660 pound rating. Keep in mind that the GVWR is 3500 pounds, but the GAWR (as indicated on the sticker on the trailer) is only 3300 pounds. I assume it's because part of the weight is on the tongue, but how much is really on the tongue? My weight distributing hitch is designed to take weight off the rear axle of the TV and distribute it to the TV's front axle AND the trailer's axle. In short, even with a minimal amount of cargo, I am essentially at the limit of my trailer's axle rating, as well as the ratings of my wheels and tires. I am not comfortable running my components near 100% of their rated capacity and I don't know why anyone would be. So, what did I gain with my swap? Some peace of mind. I am no longer running on the bleeding edge. My new wheels are rated at 2040 pounds each. My new tires are rated to carry 1870 pounds each - and I get to run 'em at 50 PSI, not 65. Because they are larger, my new tires rotate 10% slower. That can't be bad for the tires or the wheel bearings. They also have a larger contact patch. Finally, D-rated 13-inch tires are not easy to find, especially if you are out on the road. By comparison, C-rated 14s are ubiquitous.
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Old 07-31-2013, 06:43 AM   #9
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Finally, D-rated 13-inch tires are not easy to find, especially if you are out on the road. By comparison, C-rated 14s are ubiquitous.
AMEN! Went to 6 tire shops looking for them and all I got was a chuckle and a "nope". Even CW dosent have them. Ended up ordering from E-Trailer online. Very happy so far.
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Old 07-31-2013, 07:14 AM   #10
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Unlike DocBrown, I had two blowouts and one tread separation in three years of owning my old trailer, so perhaps I am over-sensitive to the subject. My old trailer was a single-axle unit with 13-inch wheels and it only weighed 2150 pounds empty.

Tire failure is an expensive, time-wasting nuisance and it can be extremely dangerous. Changing a tire on the side of a busy road is intimidating. Replacing a tire can be expensive if you are in the middle of nowhere, not to mention the damage a blowout can do to your trailer.

For those of you who are not familiar with the 2010 Jay Feather Sport 165, the GVWR is 3500 pounds, but it weighs 2910 pounds empty and 2982 pounds with propane. A full tank of fresh water chews up another 249 pounds. That leaves a measly 269 pounds for cargo. My original sidewalls showed the tires were rated to carry 1660 pounds at 65 PSI (total 3320 pounds). Stamped into each wheel was the same 1660 pound rating. Keep in mind that the GVWR is 3500 pounds, but the GAWR (as indicated on the sticker on the trailer) is only 3300 pounds. I assume it's because part of the weight is on the tongue, but how much is really on the tongue? My weight distributing hitch is designed to take weight off the rear axle of the TV and distribute it to the TV's front axle AND the trailer's axle. In short, even with a minimal amount of cargo, I am essentially at the limit of my trailer's axle rating, as well as the ratings of my wheels and tires. I am not comfortable running my components near 100% of their rated capacity and I don't know why anyone would be. So, what did I gain with my swap? Some peace of mind. I am no longer running on the bleeding edge. My new wheels are rated at 2040 pounds each. My new tires are rated to carry 1870 pounds each - and I get to run 'em at 50 PSI, not 65. Because they are larger, my new tires rotate 10% slower. That can't be bad for the tires or the wheel bearings. They also have a larger contact patch. Finally, D-rated 13-inch tires are not easy to find, especially if you are out on the road. By comparison, C-rated 14s are ubiquitous.
I sympathize with you. It sucks to have to deal with blown tires on a trip. And peace of mind is a valuable thing. But tread separation and blow outs are not the result of the tire size. There are hundreds of thousands if not millions of 13 in tires on travel trailers. I very rarely see trailers on the side of the road with blown tires. Heat is a tire's enemy. Tire quality, tire age, under pressure, running over the 65 mph rating, are all things that contribute to heat build up and tire failure. If you are running over weight, sure your bigger tires will be less prone to fail, but unless you swap out that axle, you are still "on the edge".

When you say "I get to run 'em at 50 PSI, not 65", are you saying your old tires didn't take 50 PSI? Or that you ran them at 65PSI? I've never seen a 13 in ST tire that takes 65. They all take 50PSI. Maybe you mean that you 14 in take 65? That would make sense.

Our old hybrid was also running the weights right the their limits. 3450# GVWR and the same tires as you, and likely the same axle.

You must boon dock a lot. That's the only reason I can see for carrying water. We never carry water. Why tow all that weight and eat up our cargo capacity?
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Old 07-31-2013, 11:51 PM   #11
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I sympathize with you. It sucks to have to deal with blown tires on a trip. And peace of mind is a valuable thing. But tread separation and blow outs are not the result of the tire size. There are hundreds of thousands if not millions of 13 in tires on travel trailers. I very rarely see trailers on the side of the road with blown tires. Heat is a tire's enemy. Tire quality, tire age, under pressure, running over the 65 mph rating, are all things that contribute to heat build up and tire failure. If you are running over weight, sure your bigger tires will be less prone to fail, but unless you swap out that axle, you are still "on the edge".
I know that tire failure is not the result of the tire size and I agree that heat is a tire's enemy. However, I also think that the tire will be less likely to overheat if it's not running near 100% of its rated capacity. The only way I can do that is to decrease the trailer weight (not practical), or increase the carrying capacity of the tires (which I did). I never overload, I always check the pressure, and I use a non-contact thermometer to check the temperature at every stop (both tire and hub temperatures). One Akuret blew after two years and the other got a goose egg on the sidewall the next year. I noticed it and changed it. I heard it blow a couple of hours later while it was on the spare tire carrier The tread separation was with a Goodyear Marathon.

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When you say "I get to run 'em at 50 PSI, not 65", are you saying your old tires didn't take 50 PSI? Or that you ran them at 65PSI? I've never seen a 13 inch ST tire that takes 65. They all take 50PSI. Maybe you mean that you 14 in take 65? That would make sense.
By saying, "I've never seen a 13 inch ST tire that takes 65 PSI", you made my point perfectly about the poor selection of 13 inch tires, especially out on the road. As you can see in an earlier post, member "exjay1" agrees. My original ST185/80D13 tires were Load Range D and rated for 1660 pounds at 65 PSI max. If Camping World doesn't have them (as exjay1 noted), imagine the likelihood of me finding them out on the road somewhere. If I were forced to fit the same size tires in LRC (rated to carry only 1480 pounds at 50 PSI max), I'd lose 360 pounds of carrying capacity and be overloaded.

Oh, also, what I've seen with trailer tires is that Load Range C tires typically run at 50 PSI, D at 65 and E at 80. My ST215/75R14 tires are "only" Load Range C, but they are rated to carry 1870 pounds at 50 PSI max.

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You must boon dock a lot. That's the only reason I can see for carrying water. We never carry water. Why tow all that weight and eat up our cargo capacity?
Agreed, I don't carry water unless I have to and I wait until the last possible time to fill. Depending on my destination, I might haul it 30 or 40 miles.

As you can see, I've given this situation a lot of thought. I considered the pros and cons of going to 14-inch wheels and tires and frankly, I couldn't come up with any cons, so I made it happen. If I run into any problems, I will be happy to post them.
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Old 08-01-2013, 10:49 AM   #12
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I also think the 14" upgrade makes sense, since it is very difficult to find the D rated 8 ply 13" tires that the 165 uses (they do run 65PSI), unless you order online.

14" ST tires are readily available around the country and based on everything I have read, they do run cooler. I did install the dexter lift kit though. I do mostly boon docking and some of the sites are a bit rough to get into. The Jayco 165 has very low ground clearance and the lift kit makes a big difference. I still have the 13" tires on the camper but plan to go to 14" once these tires get old. With the lift kit I did some measurements and could actually go to a 15" wheel / tire if wanted, but I think that is a bit of overkill. Will probably go with the 215/75 R14's.
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Old 08-01-2013, 12:08 PM   #13
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I have no idea if the 14s run cooler. If they do, great! When I measured the temperature of my tires in South Dakota after running 100 miles, they were 115 degrees F. To me, that seemed reasonable on a 90 degree day. I didn't think to measure the temperature of the road surface

I think some people forget that lifting the body won't help if the axle won't clear an obstacle. I got an inch or so of lift at the axle (and at the body as a result) by going to 14 inch wheels and ST215 tires. In my case, I couldn't justify the lift kit, but if helps for your type of camping, I say, "Go for it".

I did not consider running 15 inch wheels because upgrading to 14s addressed my issues. The lift kit might be required with 15 inch wheels to ensure clearance in the wheels wells, but those wheels would provide some serious ground clearance for boondocking. It would be cool if you had a buddy with some 15s so you could mount them and see. I'm curious as to how a lifted 165 with 15 inch wheels would behave in crosswinds.
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