Done with Jayco!

[Tunce the traveler]

[QUOTE=Grumpy;545467]Yep, the new millenial thing is full timing and home school.

Yes, we've noticed an up-tic in the number of units that are working while on the road. The age of the computer seems to have given them the freedom to live the world. The 1 month stay discount price is an enjoyable way to work and play and the kids seen to thrive in this type of environment.

[jasum]

Come back and let us now how good your new Grand Design turns out...........

[Marcm157]

Originally Posted by redsnapper

I have had very good luck on getting an under warranty camper, attended to by the selling dealer.

The key is to develop a "friendly" relationship with the service manager.
Case in point, I had called the dealer (Johnnie Walker RV Las Vegas) and spoke with a generic service writer about a few minor issues.
This generic service writer told me.....6 weeks before we can get you in.
I had the service managers email and cell phone.
One email to him and I got the response...."bring it in, we will take care of it"....despite being "swamped"

On a day that was convenient to me, I took the camper in and it was ready to roll the next day.

Like most interpersonal relationships, yacking up about fishing trips, hunting trips, kids and life history, goes a long way to form a relationship and the subsequent goodwill that comes of that.

I'm not sure I'd want my repairs squeezed in to a shop that's "Swamped" just saying... I do the majority of my own repairs on everything I own simply because I am very particular about how I want things done. I have had 2 very minor issues with my Jayco and took care of the repairs myself spending less than $100 on parts. To me it was well worth the out of pocket price even though it should / would have been a warranty issue..

[Craig B]

I own a 2017 32BDSW my hot water heater quit working on our last outing a few weeks back. However I can get mine to work by lighting it manually, still a problem with these atwood water heater's. Feel for you with all those issues, and how long it takes to get fixed by your dealer. I plan on taking mine in after the season and dropping it off for the heater and a couple of other things. See how long it takes to get done when we don't need to use it.

[sennister]

Originally Posted by Iraqvet05

To be fair, the circuit board is probably Atwood's fault, not Jaycos. That's like blaming Ford for bad tires. Most of us here are happy with our Jaycos but sometimes a lemon slips into the mix.

Yeah, good thing Jayco is the company out there that uses Atwood so he would be able to pick any other manufacturer and be freed from this headache...



It is interesting when people complain about Jayco but really the complaint is quite often a direct result of the dealer's crappy service department or appliances that Jayco uses. Sure Jayco has some faults here and there but all the companies do.

[DownTheHighway]

I own a FR TT and our Atwood water heater only works on propane, had it in the shop 3 times for it and yet still has the issues. Is it Forest Rivers fault, is it Prime Time's fault, nope, (the band of FR I own), is it the dealers fault, nope, It's Atwood products and their issue. Jayco, just like Redwood, Montana, Grand Design, etc. are all brand wrappers that are wrapped around little parts of other brands and manufacturers. If one took 2 of them apart and laid each piece down, you would see that 99.99% of everything in these campers these days are from the same companies. The only true real difference you see is the branding on the outside of trailer, even the QC has gone down over the past couple of years. They're pumping out more trailers these days then they were say 10 years ago. Even if you order one, its still in the same production line as ones going to the dealers for general sales.

[Danno]

Unfortunately RVing has become a leisure for owners that have some mechanical abilities especially if you go out and purchase the consumer grade crap that is sold nowadays. I read some posts on here that just make me shake my head, like asking how to change an inline fuse, FFS !! I have never, or ever will depend on a dealer to fix my RV !! The reality is that if you don't know which way to turn a screwdriver, then maybe hotels would be a better choice for a vacation.

[3'senough]

Originally Posted by RollingDownTheHighway

I own a FR TT and our Atwood water heater only works on propane, had it in the shop 3 times for it and yet still has the issues. Is it Forest Rivers fault, is it Prime Time's fault, nope, (the band of FR I own), is it the dealers fault, nope, It's Atwood products and their issue. Jayco, just like Redwood, Montana, Grand Design, etc. are all brand wrappers that are wrapped around little parts of other brands and manufacturers. If one took 2 of them apart and laid each piece down, you would see that 99.99% of everything in these campers these days are from the same companies. The only true real difference you see is the branding on the outside of trailer, even the QC has gone down over the past couple of years. They're pumping out more trailers these days then they were say 10 years ago. Even if you order one, its still in the same production line as ones going to the dealers for general sales.

X's 2.

The fall down in the OP's issues was with a bad dealer and components.

Just a thought here. Do any of you having failed "boards" use an EMS system?

All these components nowadays will succumb to electrical hi's or lows and fry them.

I know someone who's Dometic double wide fridge will not go below 43 degrees on a Montana and now he's replacing it with a Residential Fridge on his dime. Not the RV assemblers fault, but the fridge yes.

My Scwinteck slide motor failed last week, so I blame Lippert for that not Jayco.

The grass is not always greener...so proceed with caution.

[01tundra]

Originally Posted by Danno

Unfortunately RVing has become a leisure for owners that have some mechanical abilities especially if you go out and purchase the consumer grade crap that is sold nowadays. I read some posts on here that just make me shake my head, like asking how to change an inline fuse, FFS !! I have never, or ever will depend on a dealer to fix my RV !! The reality is that if you don't know which way to turn a screwdriver, then maybe hotels would be a better choice for a vacation.

That's the truth.

Luckily I'm overly mechanically incline and enjoy working/tinkering with our TT. I was taking stuff apart within an hour of bringing it home from the dealership because I like things be be how I like them. Working on it and maintaining/upgrading/modifying is my hobby, but I'm like that with everything I own.

I get a chuckle out of people proclaiming on this site how they're done with Jayco, like it's going to persuade someone else to go out and sell theirs or hurt feelings.

Newsflash - they're all junk. And no, I'm not saying it's right, but it's reality. If you plan on buying an RV and not doing any work to it, plan on spending a lot of seat time running back and forth to the dealer and no so much time out camping and enjoying time with your family. I do agree that it can be frustrating experiencing a failure while you're out camping, but I don't let it ruin my trip. The TT is no more of a frustration than buying a new truck and having to take it to the shop shortly after purchase for repair. Or better yet, go buy a boat...any freaking boat and then report back .

To me it's not what happens, it's all about how the particular dealership/manufacture responds to the issue. You can change brands 10 times, but if you unfortunately end up with a poor dealership all 10 times the outcome will be the same......

I'm in no way encouraging people not to share experiences good or bad, but proclaiming your hate for a brand and that you're "done" will not yield as much help from other members as throwing the particular issue out there for discussion/help.

[Danno]

Originally Posted by 01tundra

I'm in no way encouraging people not to share experiences good or bad, but proclaiming your hate for a brand and that you're "done" will not yield as much help from other members as throwing the particular issue out there for discussion/help.

I've given up on giving help on this forum. Last time I tried, I was labeled as a know it all. I'll just keep reading the forum and keep the things I've learned for myself.

[bankr63]

One other little point. Referring to any RV as an investment is a bit of a misnomer. Purchase yes, investment, no. A bottomless box into which we throw large amounts of money; better description.

[doo800XRS]

I can't quite grasp the concept of defending Jayco when the components they chose to put In their trailers fail. I've been in the service industry for nearing 30 years and if I tell a customer that a part we put in failed, they don't care if we manufactured the part or if we outsourced it. It failed and that is all that they know or care about.

If we use a part with repeated failures you can be sure we'll source the parts elsewhere. The kool aid some people drink lol.

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[clutch]

We bought our Jayco new in 2011 and spent the first 18 months getting things fixed. Some issues were never totally repaired but we like the floor plan and live with it. Jayco paid for every repair and the 2 year warranty was a money saver for us. Would I buy another Jayco????"? Possibly, I know that they all dont have the issues ours had.
Next year when we replace our 22 ft Sunny Brook with something bigger it could be a Jayco.

[cariboocreek]

Originally Posted by doo800XRS

I can't quite grasp the concept of defending Jayco when the components they chose to put In their trailers fail. I've been in the service industry for nearing 30 years and if I tell a customer that a part we put in failed, they don't care if we manufactured the part or if we outsourced it. It failed and that is all that they know or care about.

If we use a part with repeated failures you can be sure we'll source the parts elsewhere. The kool aid some people drink lol.

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Who else makes the components? Virtually no-one. The component industry is made up of only a very few manufacturers. All of the rv industry is dependent on those few component providers. When you find a better component manufacturer let Jayco know.

[RAurand]

Originally Posted by bankr63

One other little point. Referring to any RV as an investment is a bit of a misnomer. Purchase yes, investment, no. A bottomless box into which we throw large amounts of money; better description.

x2 ON THE ABOVE!

RV's are like boats (I know, I owned both several Boats last being a 24 foot cruiser owned for 20 years and RV's)

Boats are a hole in the water you throw money!

[Lifespalette]

I can fully understand the OP's frustrations. We too bought our 1206 PUP from Southaven RV, and quickly discovered that they were more than happy to sell the camper to us, but weren't really interested in fixing any of the defects. Warranty work isn't high on the priority list there. Our plan was to stay in it full time (4-6 weeks) in our backyard driveway while renovating our home (full gut job). Long story shortened, the 4-6 weeks turned into 4 and half months....by the end of the first month both dinette benches collapsed....Southhaven said 6 weeks to repair once I brought it in. Did I mention we were living in it full time while the house was being renovated.....took me half a day to rebuild them properly, the way they should have been done in the first place with bracing and support ledges glued and screwed. Unless you opened them up you would never know they had been rebuilt. Within the first year (2 long weekend camping trips) after moving back into the completed house. The furnace control board went out, the lower hatch/step door wouldn't stay closed (off square opening cut out in the side panel) and it took them 3 weeks to trouble shoot and fix.....like I said, warranty work isn't high on their priority list.



I don't blame Jayco for that, that's a lousy dealership with a lousy service department. I do blame Jayco though for the subgrade quality workmanship on their product. Yes, every other brand has the same crappy assemble and quality control problems....that's what happens when you mass produce products to keep the cost as reasonable as possible....that doesn't make it right. That's just the realities of capitalism. Thankfully, I have the hands on skills, knowledge and background to properly repair anymore problems with the PUP (thank you 30+ year career in Architecture and Construction).



And yes, I do blame Jayco for the quality of the vendor supplied items for thier product. I have designed, managed the projects and constructed projects that were in the hundreds of millions of dollar in construction cost. Every trade uses vendor supplied products in their field of construction responsibilities that I as the Architect either specified or approved as submitted. Or, as the GC I or the subs supplied products and components as specified by designers. If a product was sub-standard or failed, the chain of responsibility started with the vendor, the sub, the GC and then the Architect/Engineer and the resolution followed that path back to the vendor for the correction. If the gasket on the window wall unit was defective, the client didn't call the window frame manufacture, he/she called the Architect, who called the GC, who called the sub, who called the vendor and fixed the damn thing.



Jayco (the industry as a whole) has the most FUBAR warranty thing going. They purchase the product from some vendor with a warranty that gets wrapped in under the Jayco warranty as an add on, Jayco installs said component and when it fails, the fingers start pointing. Throw in some components that are installed at the dealership and now you've got another point of blame.....and it seems to go round and round and round......so it takes 6 weeks to fix a collapsed bench seat that only takes about 2.5 hours per bench to totally rebuild properly.



I don't get it......you all wouldn't accept that type of response from your doctor, or your tow vehicle dealership, or your contractor who built your house..........but you'll make excuses for Jayco (or any other RV manufacture} right and left. You might as well just say "ah heck, their chain saw musta been broke....".....why not, any excuse is as good as another. The ugly truth is Jayco is no worse nor no better than any other manufacturer out there mass producing camping trailers. They all look pretty on the surface and are plagued with poor quality workmanship and cheap as possible construction details that's why they can turn out a unit in approximately 6 hours.



I've come to two conclusions....1. Owning a camping trailer is very much like owning a boat....get used to burning hundred dollar bills while standing in an ice cold shower. It does no good to complain about it....nobody held a gun to my head to buy it. When I get tired of dealing with it I'll either sell it or rebuild it from the frame up. 2. I won't buy another one, Jaycy or otherwise. I'll buy a trailer frame and build my own to my own standards and for my own needs.

[webbeyes]

I teach business in a bricks&mortar university...but no, I'm no "expert".

Supply chain, supply chain, supply chain. Cannot emphasize those words enough.

Hundreds of well-known (and high-quality) companies have suffered due to supply chain (Dell Computers, GM, Ford, McDonalds, Target, Toyota, etc.).

In many industries, becoming part of the supply chain is challenging (see Porter's 5 forces model if you want more details on why). Toyota says "yeah, I'd love to buy airbags from someone else ... but someone else either doesn't exist OR will raise the price of my car by $2,000". Jayco says "yeah, I'd love to buy part X from someone else ... but someone else either doesn't exist OR will raise the price of my trailer by $2,000." Sometimes they can't dump a supplier for OTHER reasons (see Ford/Bridgestone back in the 50's/60's, etc).

Many manufacturers that rely on supply chains are really between a rock and a hard place.

The auto industry often suggests that for even the best manufacturers, 10% of their vehicles have issues. This is on average across ALL manufacturers .. Porsche, Volvo, GM, Ford, Jaguar ... but our perception is that GM/Ford have more problems because they sell more units. If you sell 100,000 cars, that means 10,000 have problems. If you sell 10 cars, that means 1 has a problem. You'll hear far more about GM/Ford problems than Jaguar.

Same thing with the RV industry, but likely a higher % of problems.

The main difference is that Auto manufacturers have recognized that they make more profit by return and regular service at a dealership than on the car itself. RV world is still in a "make craploads on the sale..." mentality. Since Car dealerships have more at stake in their reputation/ties to the manufacturer, they play along nicely. RV dealers are independent and can do whatever the hell they want.

Any one of us could buy an RV with issues from Jayco today. Because of the odds, any one of us could buy an RV from (insert crappy-manufacturer) and end up with zero issues. We could then believe that (crappy manufacturer) is better than Jayco simply because we got lucky.

How do you fix it?
- better supply chain competition?
- manufacturer-owned dealerships?
- better product regulations?

None of these will occur tomorrow.

The reality is that the RV buyer of today is buying "design and functionality", and rolling the dice that the dealership is one of ethics and quality. The manufacturer will in cases like Jayco, uphold their warranty - and THAT is what will set them apart. They will exert what little pressure up the supply chain, but with no supply competition, they have little power. Spread the word about GOOD dealerships, and they will thrive - but the problem is, that will make them busier!

[RAurand]

Originally Posted by webbeyes

i teach business in a bricks&mortar university...but no, i'm no "expert".

Supply chain, supply chain, supply chain. Cannot emphasize those words enough.

Hundreds of well-known (and high-quality) companies have suffered due to supply chain (dell computers, gm, ford, mcdonalds, target, toyota, etc.).

In many industries, becoming part of the supply chain is challenging (see porter's 5 forces model if you want more details on why). Toyota says "yeah, i'd love to buy airbags from someone else ... But someone else either doesn't exist or will raise the price of my car by $2,000". Jayco says "yeah, i'd love to buy part x from someone else ... But someone else either doesn't exist or will raise the price of my trailer by $2,000." sometimes they can't dump a supplier for other reasons (see ford/bridgestone back in the 50's/60's, etc).

Many manufacturers that rely on supply chains are really between a rock and a hard place.

The auto industry often suggests that for even the best manufacturers, 10% of their vehicles have issues. This is on average across all manufacturers .. Porsche, volvo, gm, ford, jaguar ... But our perception is that gm/ford have more problems because they sell more units. If you sell 100,000 cars, that means 10,000 have problems. If you sell 10 cars, that means 1 has a problem. You'll hear far more about gm/ford problems than jaguar.

Same thing with the rv industry, but likely a higher % of problems.

The main difference is that auto manufacturers have recognized that they make more profit by return and regular service at a dealership than on the car itself. Rv world is still in a "make craploads on the sale..." mentality. Since car dealerships have more at stake in their reputation/ties to the manufacturer, they play along nicely. Rv dealers are independent and can do whatever the hell they want.

Any one of us could buy an rv with issues from jayco today. Because of the odds, any one of us could buy an rv from (insert crappy-manufacturer) and end up with zero issues. We could then believe that (crappy manufacturer) is better than jayco simply because we got lucky.

How do you fix it?
- better supply chain competition?
- manufacturer-owned dealerships?
- better product regulations?

None of these will occur tomorrow.

The reality is that the rv buyer of today is buying "design and functionality", and rolling the dice that the dealership is one of ethics and quality. The manufacturer will in cases like jayco, uphold their warranty - and that is what will set them apart. They will exert what little pressure up the supply chain, but with no supply competition, they have little power. Spread the word about good dealerships, and they will thrive - but the problem is, that will make them busier!

very well said!

[sodbuster]

Does anybody remember how bad the US automakers products were in the 70's? They were building and selling crap! Then the Japanese started building quality vehicles and sending them over here and we started buying them. This woke the US automakers up and all of the sudden we get better mileage, better fit and finish, longer lasting engines, and just better cars all the way around. I think we need an RV built somewhere overseas and sold in the US to show our RV industry how to build them! This idea won't be popular with a lot of people but sometimes the truth hurts. On a side note I've had the same problem with my Atwood water heater and I just ordered a new board from Amazon and paid for it myself (even though it was still in warranty). Lots of times it is easier to just fix stuff yourself rather than trying to get in to a dealer.

[doo800XRS]

Originally Posted by cariboocreek

Who else makes the components? Virtually no-one. The component industry is made up of only a very few manufacturers. All of the rv industry is dependent on those few component providers. When you find a better component manufacturer let Jayco know.

It's not always a parts issue sometimes it's a QC issue. Our first two trips in our 2016 Jayco ended up with flooding due to a leaky water valve on the first trip and the second a loose connection to the outside sink which backed water up into the bathroom. Where's the quality control there? A .29 cent shut off valve caused hundreds of dollars in damage that Jayco deemed not necessary to repair. A better quality valve would have prevented this. The loose connection on the sink could have been caught as well.

In my opinion you shouldn't have to buy a camper, car or anything for that matter and re engineer it in your driveway to make it useable and reliable. When I hear 2-3 month wait at the dealer for repairs tells me it's a widespread problem, one that will not go away as long as we keep defending their shortcomings with "its not their fault"

My previous camper was my families 1969 Banner 19' that my parents brought brand new and was used until the mid 90's when my father passed. It had real wood cabinets and was built to last. I sold it to a young guy who started camping with his young family. He stopped a year later and said that he plugged it in everything still worked after sitting for years. All he did was a thorough cleaning and inspection prior to using. On a 25 yr old camper.

Now the other side of the coin is that it's a rolling box getting jostled and banged around when in use so I agree one must be diligent in their PM but to have issues right out of the factory in such high numbers is not acceptable. At least not to me. Did anyone see the youtube video that Jayco has about the assembly line? I think they are actually proud of it lol.

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