Generator Recommendations?

[geezerbob]

How about a Kohler 2.8 kw inverter

[bansai]

Originally Posted by geezerbob

How about a Kohler 2.8 kw inverter

Looks like it's loud.

Comparison -
Honda EU3000iS - 58 dB(A) @ rated load, 49 dB(A) @ 1/4 load

Kohler - Sound level @ 7m 65.0 - 68.0 dBA


10dB is a HUGE difference in noise level.

Edit - I just looked up the specs on my current (old actually) Champion generator.. It's not an inverter generator, I bought it a long time before I got into the RV thing... It's also rated at 68 dB - and it's WAY too loud to use in camping grounds. I'd pass on the Kohler. If noise really isn't an issue, you can get a 4500 watt generator like mine that is rated at the same noise level, but only costs 400 bucks.


Kohler DOES make an inverter generator that is closer in specs to the Honda's / Yamahas, etc.. but it's not the 2.8kw. It would be this one -

http://power.kohler.com/powerequipme...oduct/pro2.0is

[sportsmen]

Bansai. What is the payload on your F150 ??

[bansai]

Originally Posted by sportsmen

Bansai. What is the payload on your F150 ??

1806 lbs

I'm getting a 250 in the spring (possibly a 350). I'm still under my limits, but I want more truck) Not to hijack the thread, PM me if you want more info.

[Hohenwald48]

Originally Posted by BuddyRay

But Hohenwald48, you comments about covering the genny when running threw me. I guess I could rig up something to cover it - but why can't it run in the rain? I've watched contractors run their generators in downpours. As long as the air intake/filter is protected it should be fine, Yes?

I know of no generators designed or recommended to run in the rain. Contractors do a lot of things I wouldn't do. I've even seen folks refuel while the generator is running and with a cigarette in their mouth. But I ain't gonna' do it.

I doubt if the inverter control circuits on any of the generators we're talking about are rain proof or even rain tight. Not saying you can't (although Honda says you can't) but I would never do it. Electricity and water seldom make a good combination.

I had plans for all kinds of fancy covers but have found a beach umbrella to be a simple solution. It keeps the generator dry while still allowing the air flow necessary for proper cooling. However, I can't run my generator while going down the road in the rain. So far this hasn't been a problem.

[Duke_26]

Hi Everyone!

Been researching like a mad man the last couple of weeks and I'm torn between the Honda EU3000is or (2) EU2000i (one would be the companion).

For me, I want the absolute quietest generator possible that will run my 15K AC when needed.

I currently have a 2016 Jay Flight 26BH with the 15K AC.

I've read that many people have no problems running the 15K AC with the EU3000is.

I know there are many pros and cons for each of the two options. I have a couple of quick questions:

1) Does anyone know if the newer AC's like what I have on my TT come with the hard start capacitor from the factory?

2) Which of the two generator options will be quieter when running the AC? I know the 3000 is quieter than the 2000 by a couple of dB by itself but will the two 2000's be quieter than the 3000 when running AC?

Even though the 3000 is much heavier than the (2) 2K's put together, I like the electric start option as well as some of the other features that don't come with the smaller units. Whatever I end up with will also be used as a back-up for the house. I have a fiberglass cap on my truck so I could keep the heavier unit in the back of the truck. I'm not getting any younger and this purchase would be a lifetime purchase so I also have to think about when I get older being able to move these around.

I don't have access to either of the genny's to hear them or check them out so I am hoping that I can get some help with my questions and deciding which way to go.

Thank you all in advance for your help and sharing your experiences!

Cheers [emoji482]

Duke


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[sennister]

A single 3000 will be quieter than two 2000. When running an AC those 2000 will be at high output so they will be ramped up. So if one is louder than the 3000 they are talking about that ramped up sound.

The biggest benefit is that the 2000 when run single has lower fuel consumption for when you don't need the AC. The 2000 are nice because they are easier to load since they are lighter. Getting older is a valid concern. Not sure what the 3000 weighs but I have the Yamaha version of the 3000 and it is a two person lift at about 100#. Not a big deal, I have a front end loader on my John Deere for moving my generators around. My Father in law has the pair of Honda 2000 and they are really nice. If it means anything, I am considering borrowing them when they are not using them rather than loading and running my 3000. My 25BH also was upgraded to the 15K AC and wish it wasn't. I don't know if my Yamaha can ever run it. I have read about the high capacity cap and have a buddy in refrigeration repair that can swap it out for me if it doesn't have one. We pick up our camper later on the in month and once I get the generator out of storage I can try it.

Electric start is nice but it is another thing to go bad. I have a big Yamaha 6800 with electric start and it is a bear to pull start which I normally do because the battery is dead. It is only used for backup power at the house. Also what is better than electric start, is remote electric start so you don't have to climb out of the camper to fire it up. But I don't think the 3000 has that. There are some Champions out there in that size range with it.

As for powering the house. What is your intent there? Are you going to run extension cords to specific appliances like a fridge or freezer? I ask because as I mentioned I run my big 6800 for my house. We live in a rural area so we are on private well and septic. That means I need 30A 240 to run my well pump and power to run my septic lift pump. We also have above ground power around here so a storm can knock us out for several days or a week which is why we have a big generator. I have a bypass panel which is the only safe way of doing this unless you do the extension cord method. That panel powers certain circuits for what I call critical appliances. The well, the kitchen, some outlets in the basement for the freezer, the lift pump on the septic, our bedrooms and lights. Oh and my keggerator. The point of this is if you do a bypass either unit is lacking. You can't power anything 240V. Maybe you are in town so it isn't an issue. You have to add a bypass panel which isn't cheap and you will have to load up a lot of critical (and probably thirsty) appliances all on one leg because you don't have 240v. Because of this, with either option I would say skip the bypass panel and do the extension cord method. If doing this where are your key appliances that you would want to do power cord runs? For me it would be better to have a generator up front of the house and another in the rear. That would be better accomplished with two of the 2000 generators than a single 3000. Again that is my house. Maybe not yours.

So, I have made very little cases for the 3000 for me. And I own a 3000 just not the Honda. If I buy a new generator because I find the 3000 isn't big enough, I would love a pair of 2000s but odds are I would look at a single 4000 Champion but that is me. I think my FIL paid about $2500 for the pair by the time be bought the generators, the parallel kit, the aux fuel tank, caps and lines. It is a sweet setup but it is going to be while before I can fork that out and have other projects fighting for those dollars. Just me though. Besides I have access to a pair of 2000 from time to time for free.

[Duke_26]

Originally Posted by sennister

A single 3000 will be quieter than two 2000. When running an AC those 2000 will be at high output so they will be ramped up. So if one is louder than the 3000 they are talking about that ramped up sound........

Sennister, Thank You very much for taking the time to write the very detailed response. This helps tremendously!

If it wasn't for the fact the the EU3000is is quieter than the EU2000i, I think it would have been a much easier decision. Actually, some reports I've read say the Yamaha 2000 is actually a little quieter at 1/4 load than the Honda, but it is a little louder at load and they also have a couple of features the Honda 2000 doesn't like the fuel shut off's, fuel level indicator or gage, and hour meter. Not knowing a lot about generators, I was thinking that the paralleled 2K's wouldn't need to work as hard as the 3K while running the AC, so I thought that they would have been quieter since the 3K would have had to ramp up more to produce the same power. Thank you for clearing this up.

I think part of the reason I am interested in the Honda's is because on a camping trip last year to a state park, I was out riding my bicycle with my kids going around the park and someone had a Honda EU2000i in use about 5ft from the road and I could not believe how quiet it was, I could barely hear it. I think they were probably using it to charge the battery so it was not ramped up. I have never heard a EU3000is run but a guy I work with has one and he said there amazingly quiet as well, that it just purrs like a kitten. His FIL is currently using it so he doesn't have it handy to let me check it out.

There are often times where I take the kids camping and get set up by myself because DW has to work or has classes and she meets us at camp later on, so the (2) 2K's would be much easier to load and unload by myself, especially during spring and fall where the AC isn't needed and I would only need one unit. Like you said, one 2K would use less fuel. Also, I think it would be easier to transport the (2) 2K's in the TT over the axels to keep the weight down in the bed of my 1/2 ton truck. The 3K would have to ride in the back of the truck which I believe it weighs close to 150lbs with oil and fuel, which reduces my TV payload.

You make great points about using them as back up power at the house. I was planning on eventually putting in a transfer switch that only included the "Critical" circuits. But maybe the extension cord method would be the better way to go. I was thinking the refrigerator (possibly alternating with a chest freezer), oil burner (would still need some sort of transfer switch) and a few lights, no sump pump. We could always use the outdoor grill to cook on if need be since we have an electric stove. Fortunately at this time, our house is located in town, I have town water and we rarely lose power and when we do it comes back on quicker than other areas since we are close to the local hospital. Our house is set up where one generator location could cover the critical appliances with the extension cords. However, there is a possibility that we might decide to move or build a new house in a more rural area of town in about 5-10 years. Another thought too was if I had the dual set-up that I could always lend one to a family member in an extended power outage if it came down to it.

This is a major purchase for us for sure and like I mentioned I only want to have to do it once. We've been saving up for this purchase for a while. We don't have a local Honda dealer but we can order from the local Home Depot. They sell them separately, $999 for the EU2000i and $1099 for the companion. The parallel kit with RV adaptor is about $50, for a total of about $2150 before tax and oil for the units. They do offer free shipping to the store but do not carry either model in stock. The have the EU3000is for $2000, but I would want a wheel kit and those go for anywhere between $100-$200. So I am right at the same price point for both set-ups.

Electric Generator Depot online has a kit they have put together that includes the EU2000i, the companion, two OEM Honda covers, the parallel kit and (3) extension cords for $2098 with free shipping. This seems like the best deal. They also sell the EU3000is for $2000 by itself with no wheel kit.



So based on everything, it seems like the two smaller genny's are the way to go, even if the 3000 is slightly quieter. It will be probably another month or two before we have all the money saved up to make the purchase, so I am still interested in hearing more thoughts and experiences from everyone.

Thanks again,

Duke


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[sennister]

Depending on where you live, buying them online might save you sales tax as well. 7.125% on a little over $2k buys a little beer. Or will likely cover the cost of the aux tank. Which I would highly recommend. When camping in the spring and fall a single 2K with the aux tank will run all weekend.

If you live in town near a hospital so you get power back pretty quick, then I wouldn't bother with a transfer switch. Some people will throw their main breaker and reverse feed power back to their house through a 50A 240v plug but this is illegal in a lot of places as you can kill someone if you don't know what you are doing and accidentally power it up without tripping the main breaker. This is why they make those transfer switches which is like a sub panel where either your power in from the line into that box and there is another input for the generator. Then some have slots for those critical circuits and a feed over to your main panel. I have and older home so I have a retrofit where I pulled out the "critical circuits". I have a 100A breaker in my main panel that in normal operation feeds those circuits in the transfer switch's subpanel. When I go into generator mode, I flip it over and it separates that sub panel from the rest of the house and the input is on the generator then those circuits are powered from that. I know the power is back on because those non critical circuits will come live. Then I just power stuff off and flip back to main power and kill the generator.

It works good but as I said either option you are looking at isn't 240. I can only pull it off because I have a pretty big Yamaha which can technically run my entire house. So skip all this and if you build a new house and think you might want it, talk to them about adding the wiring when they build the house as it won't be that expensive then. You can get manual transfer switches for $150 or so and then you are talking a little wire and an hour or two extra work as they are doing the circuits. Even if you don't have a big generator it is a good idea to prep for one as it is a selling point later down the road or if you find your power goes out for an extended period you can get heat and stuff. I think I left my furnace off the list but it is also on the critical circuit.

As far as ramping up. I guess I don't pay much attention to it but all the generators have an economy mode that if there isn't much of a load they just kind of drop down to idle. Charging the batteries and such can probably be done at these lower RPMs and as soon as there it is a load they ramp up to full power. Ramping may not be a good description because it is either at that eco (idle) mode or it is wide open. So as soon as the AC kicks in they will go full power with either the 3000 or the pair of 2000. I mention this because maybe you are just running some 110v fans or not full AC. It will still most likely ramp up to full power.

Another reason to go with the pair is 3000 with a 15K AC is pushing it. If you want to use an electric griddle or coffee maker and the AC is on you might overload it and it will kill. The pair will give you a bit more room for other 110v devices while the AC is running. You might not thing it is on because it isn't running but switched on and then fire up a griddle and all of a sudden it heated up the camper enough to trip the AC on and next thing you know you are pulling too much power for it.

Also you don't have to buy them both right now. You could get the main unit now if you are camping now or will be soon. Then a month or two down the road when you were planning to buy the set, it will be getting out and then pick up the companion and the parallel kit so you can run the AC. Maybe if you buy that first one local you can take it back if you don't like it. Then once you determine if you want to keep it, then order the second one and related hardware off the website. Just another option for you if you think you might use it before when you have everything saved up.

You also mentioned a great point about the putting the bigger one in the truck vs putting two smaller ones in the camper. I know with our Yukon we are pushing the cargo capacity more than anything else. This is quite a bit of weight which would let me position either in front of or behind the axles to tune my tongue weight. If I take generators that means I am dry camping which means I am running heavy. You can easily rig up a device to measure tongue weight at home. It takes a couple 2x4s, a couple pipes and a bathroom scale. If you know your trailer weight you are all set at balancing things.

[Duke_26]

Thank you very much again @sennister! I really appreciate all of your feedback. Great conversation.

I was also thinking about buying the one 2K now and getting the second one in a couple months when the temps require the AC. My question on this would be can I get the companion 1st so I have the larger plug option and get the regular one 2nd with the cables?

Another thing with buying at Home Depot is the often run specials where you can get 0% financing for 12, 18 or 24 months depending on amount if purchased on their credit card. This could help keep the money in my account where I get the interest and have it to fall back on if needed as long as it is paid for before the end of the promotional period. But I would need to pay the tax up front going this route, 6% here.

Buying online would save on taxes and I would get the extra accessories as part of their "kit" for the same price as just the units at HD. No promotional financing options. In the unlikely event if I wasn't happy it would be more difficult and costly to return.

I hadn't really thought about the separate tank as of yet, but it makes perfect sense. I will definitely have to take this into consideration at some point.

Decisions...decisions...decisions...

All the best,

Duke


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[sennister]

Originally Posted by Duke_26

Thank you very much again @sennister! I really appreciate all of your feedback. Great conversation.

I was also thinking about buying the one 2K now and getting the second one in a couple months when the temps require the AC. My question on this would be can I get the companion 1st so I have the larger plug option and get the regular one 2nd with the cables?

Another thing with buying at Home Depot is the often run specials where you can get 0% financing for 12, 18 or 24 months depending on amount if purchased on their credit card. This could help keep the money in my account where I get the interest and have it to fall back on if needed as long as it is paid for before the end of the promotional period. But I would need to pay the tax up front going this route, 6% here.

Buying online would save on taxes and I would get the extra accessories as part of their "kit" for the same price as just the units at HD. No promotional financing options. In the unlikely event if I wasn't happy it would be more difficult and costly to return.

I hadn't really thought about the separate tank as of yet, but it makes perfect sense. I will definitely have to take this into consideration at some point.

Decisions...decisions...decisions...

All the best,

Duke


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The great thing about the aux tank is you need a gas can anyhow. You can take that to the gas station and fill it and not have to deal with spilling gas because of all these new fancy environmentally safe spouts that spill gas everywhere. Also it is a little safer as you don't spill gas all over a potentially hot generator.

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[Duke_26]

Originally Posted by sennister

You can take that to the gas station and fill it and not have to deal with spilling gas because of all these new fancy environmentally safe spouts that spill gas everywhere.

This is very true [emoji4]

I love my vintage 2-1/2 gallon "Eagle Gasser" gas cans. Not a drop of gas on the ground. They have a low center of gravity and won't tip over.



Any thoughts on buying the companion 1st?

Duke


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[GarlicDude]

I like my Honda 2000i, it will run both the wall mount AC and the microwave in our Jay Feather 18RBM. Super quiet and zero problems. My local Honda motorcycle dealer had the best price, better then any of the online outfits, might give them a look see.

Best,
Steve

[Duke_26]

Originally Posted by GarlicDude

I like my Honda 2000i, it will run both the wall mount AC and the microwave in our Jay Feather 18RBM. Super quiet and zero problems. My local Honda motorcycle dealer had the best price, better then any of the online outfits, might give them a look see.

Best,
Steve

Thanks for the feedback Steve!! I think the closest Honda dealer is about 45 minutes to an hour from me, I'll have to stop by there sometime to see if they have any in stock and what their getting for them or at least give them a call.


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[sennister]

Originally Posted by Duke_26

This is very true [emoji4]

I love my vintage 2-1/2 gallon "Eagle Gasser" gas cans. Not a drop of gas on the ground. They have a low center of gravity and won't tip over.



Any thoughts on buying the companion 1st?

Duke


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Sorry I was running the Pinewood Derby today for our pack so this morning was a bit crazy.

As far as getting the companion, I can't say for certain as I have never tried that. I would imagine that you have a 15 A adapter for your​ camper. So if it were me I would just get the primary for now. Or try and go to Honda and see if you can find an online manual for the companion and see what it says.

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[Duke_26]

Originally Posted by sennister

Sorry I was running the Pinewood Derby today for our pack so this morning was a bit crazy.

As far as getting the companion, I can't say for certain as I have never tried that. I would imagine that you have a 15 A adapter for your​ camper. So if it were me I would just get the primary for now. Or try and go to Honda and see if you can find an online manual for the companion and see what it says.

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Ahhh....the pinewood derby, that brings back fond memories of when I was in the cub scouts and would go with my father.

Yes, I do have the 15A adapter so I guess that would be the way to go to get started. It's $100 less than the companion if I was to get one unit at a time.

Thanks again and hope you had a good time at the derby!




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[sennister]

Originally Posted by Duke_26

Ahhh....the pinewood derby, that brings back fond memories of when I was in the cub scouts and would go with my father.

Yes, I do have the 15A adapter so I guess that would be the way to go to get started. It's $100 less than the companion if I was to get one unit at a time.

Thanks again and hope you had a good time at the derby!




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Pinewood went well.

I don't know if it is good or bad but a few years ago I opened my mouth and am now in charge of it. The first year we were there for about 4 hrs and ran 30 cars maybe. Myself and another dad requested that we have an Open Class for siblings and parents if they want to build one. Well they said no so we took over the Pinewood program and we have an Open Class. We noticed right away that the boy's cars look a lot more like a boy built it rather than a parent that kept pushing the boy out of the way. Now with my IT background, I worked out all the computer bugs we always faced to delay the program and we ran 60 cars through in 3hrs from start to end. It was a great time.

Anyhow here is the manual for the companion.

http://cdn.powerequipment.honda.com/...X31Z077000.pdf

Looking at page 11 of the manual (13 of the PDF). It points out the following.

To obtain more than 1.6 kVA from the 30A twist lock receptacle, you
must have another EU2000i generator or EU2000i Companion
generator connected in parallel (see page ). 30

In some searches people seem to be saying the same thing. That the 30A twistlock can be used with a single generator running but don't expect to be able to pull more than 20A or so from it. The nice thing is you don't have to change your plug configuration to go from running a single maybe at night to dual when AC is needed in the day.

So from what I am reading, it would seem you can get the companion first and run just that. The main difference being the companion has a 20A outlet and 30A twist lock outlet. The regular one has two 20A outlets.

[Duke_26]

Originally Posted by sennister

Pinewood went well.



I don't know if it is good or bad but a few years ago I opened my mouth and am now in charge of it. The first year we were there for about 4 hrs and ran 30 cars maybe. Myself and another dad requested that we have an Open Class for siblings and parents if they want to build one. Well they said no so we took over the Pinewood program and we have an Open Class. We noticed right away that the boy's cars look a lot more like a boy built it rather than a parent that kept pushing the boy out of the way. Now with my IT background, I worked out all the computer bugs we always faced to delay the program and we ran 60 cars through in 3hrs from start to end. It was a great time.



Anyhow here is the manual for the companion.



http://cdn.powerequipment.honda.com/...X31Z077000.pdf



Looking at page 11 of the manual (13 of the PDF). It points out the following.







In some searches people seem to be saying the same thing. That the 30A twistlock can be used with a single generator running but don't expect to be able to pull more than 20A or so from it. The nice thing is you don't have to change your plug configuration to go from running a single maybe at night to dual when AC is needed in the day.



So from what I am reading, it would seem you can get the companion first and run just that. The main difference being the companion has a 20A outlet and 30A twist lock outlet. The regular one has two 20A outlets.

Great info! I appreciate the time you have taken out of your day to help a fellow Jayco owner out!

Glad you had a good time at the derby!


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[trento]

Don't mess around .get a Honda.i have a bunch of Honda equipment as I am a pro landscaper.i have a 2000i and its real nice.doesnt gobble fuel and its whisper quiet.i have rented other types like Yamaha,Kawasaki,champion etc.they don't hold a candle to a Honda.you might pay a bit more but it's well worth it

[Atlee]

I would get the companion 1st. When you twin them, you'll need one anyway.

Currently, I have two 2K gennys. I always set both up and pair even on weekends I will not need the AC. We boondock a number of weekends a year at football games. Early in the season, we need to use the AC. The rest of the season we do not. However, when they are twinned, I can alternate generators in order to get roughly equal hours on each.

Originally Posted by Duke_26

This is very true [emoji4]

I love my vintage 2-1/2 gallon "Eagle Gasser" gas cans. Not a drop of gas on the ground. They have a low center of gravity and won't tip over.



Any thoughts on buying the companion 1st?

Duke


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