Payload vs Hitch weight

MikeG0351 · 11-24-2016, 11:59 AM

First, Everyone have a great and safe Thanksgiving day....
I have the 2016 Ram 2500 6.7 Diesel.
I'm interested in the Jayco 32 BHDS with a hitch weight of roughly 1000.
My Payload is roughly 3000.
So my question is, Payload and hitch weight one in the same....
Thanks in advance for any replys....

Sundancer330 · 11-24-2016, 12:13 PM

If your payload is 3000# and hitch is 1000# then you are left with 2000# of payload.

Subaru297 · 11-24-2016, 12:51 PM

1200lbs for the hitch weight or tongue weight is probably more realistic for that trailer but with 3000lbs of payload you won't have any problems with that. Unless the back of your truck is already full of 2000+lbs of stuff.

What is the payload from the sticker on your drivers side door jamb? Same sticker as your recommended tire pressure. I would be surprised if you have 3000lbs in a 2500 with the diesel. The diesel weighs a lot and takes away from your available payload. But even with 2400 or so lbs of payload you are still in good shape.

Cheers

need-a-vacation · 11-24-2016, 01:59 PM

Mike,

As mentioned, plan on a more realistic tw of 1200lbs +. As a reference, with empty tanks our tw is ~1400lbs. Was 1400lbs on the nose, but have added some things, which may have changed it a little. The Jayco factory rear frame mounted cargo hitch for our bike rack and 4 bikes being one of the changes since weighing.

I would suggest 1400-1500lb wd bars depending on the brand wdh you buy. 1200lb bars will probably be to close, or possibly even under rated.

The 32 is an awesome floor plan!!! Good luck deciding!!!

Overloaded · 11-24-2016, 06:14 PM

Take your truck with everything in it that you would take camping. That includes spouse, kids, dog, kayaks, bikes, coolers, full tank of fuel and put the hitch in the bed. Take all that to the scales. Subtract that weight from your gross vehicle weight rating that is your available remaining payload. That is the amount of tongue weight you may have. Should not be an issue but also watch your rear axle weight rating as to not go over on that rating.

campingn.c. · 11-25-2016, 07:36 AM

Just hook up and go. Forget about going to the scales yada yada yada. You will literally not know it's back there.
As said though, plan on 1500lb spring bars. I would also recommend if buying all new to go ahead and get a 2 1/2 inch receiver instead of using an adapter.
Guessing you have a standard cab configuration with that high of a CC ? Mine's only 2,100lbs on a CCLB.

Marcm157 · 11-25-2016, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by campingn.c.

Just hook up and go. Forget about going to the scales yada yada yada. You will literally not know it's back there..

Famous last words and very dangerous advice. Regardless of your rig setup, you should know your weights and where you stand...

bansai · 11-25-2016, 10:09 AM

Last I checked, it was 11 dollars to use the CAT scales and it only takes a couple minutes. The only excuse to not do it is just being lazy.

https://catscale.com/

Marcm157 · 11-25-2016, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bansai

Last I checked, it was 11 dollars to use the CAT scales and it only takes a couple minutes. The only excuse to not do it is just being lazy.

https://catscale.com/

Agree 100%

Levinehikeski · 11-25-2016, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcm157

Famous last words and very dangerous advice. Regardless of your rig setup, you should know your weights and where you stand...

I have no issues not knowing exactly what my camper weighs, (it's an 8' box popup, towed with mid sized truck, 6000lbs towing capacity). I would worry if I was towing with a smaller vehicle or heavier trailer.

Anyone dragging a 10,000lbs+ trailer should know exactly what they weigh.

RPreeb · 11-25-2016, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marcm157

Famous last words and very dangerous advice. Regardless of your rig setup, you should know your weights and where you stand...

As to that, I'd say that "It depends." I believe in overkill when pairing a TV with a TT. I'm towing 2 tons less TT than you are with essentially the same vehicle minus the RAS. I towed it 150 miles home from the dealer in strong crosswinds with no WDH and no detectable sway. When I head out next spring for my first camping trip, it will have a Husky Centerline TS properly installed, and unless I actually experience issues, I'm not going to bother with weighing the rig (I have a Co-op elevator about 5 blocks from my house, and one of my friends is the manager there, so weighing is easy if I decide to do so). I'll be at less than half the TV's rated towing capacity, and if it handled the load without a WDH, putting the hitch on will just make it that much safer. If I was hauling a 30+ foot behemoth, or if I was trying to tow my 4500 lb TT with a Honda Civic, then I'd be more concerned.

If you are pushing the limits of your TV and TT, then by all means, you need to know where you stand and how close you are to those limits. You may even need to rethink your loading plans. But if you aren't even close to the limits, and if you know how to load your rig for safe towing, then knowing the actual weight over each axle shouldn't be necessary.

bansai · 11-25-2016, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Levinehikeski

I have no issues not knowing exactly what my camper weighs, (it's an 8' box popup, towed with mid sized truck, 6000lbs towing capacity). I would worry if I was towing with a smaller vehicle or heavier trailer.

Anyone dragging a 10,000lbs+ trailer should know exactly what they weigh.

That's a fair point for sure, advise was directed towards the OP, not a pup I could probably tow with my Ford Focus

MikeG0351 · 11-25-2016, 10:54 AM

Thanks for all of the reply's....
I just wanted to know if the Hitch weight and the Payload.
If my Payload is 2100 it doesn't matter if it's on the hitch are in the bed of the truck....

bansai · 11-25-2016, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeG0351

Thanks for all of the reply's....
I just wanted to know if the Hitch weight and the Payload.
If my Payload is 2100 it doesn't matter if it's on the hitch are in the bed of the truck....

Yep, that's a true statement. There's a little more to it, but you don't want to exceed your payload number regardless of where that weight is positioned in the truck. That's probably the first, and most important rating to know you are not exceeding. The other thing to consider is if almost all of the weight your truck is carrying is on your back axle, where that weight is positioned in your truck does matter.. your rear axle cares anyway, so it has a separate weight rating that is helpful to know about. Is it possible to be within your cargo rating, and still max out your rear axle? It's somewhat rare in my experience, and you'd have to crunch those numbers to know for sure if that is even mathematically possible in your truck. A trip to the Cat scale will help you work all of that out. 11 bucks for peace of mind is hard to come by. I *think* you are fine with your tow vehicle and that trailer. I'm certain I am closer to my limits than you are with your combination and I do fine, but that gets into comparing apples and oranges.

Hohenwald48 · 11-25-2016, 11:26 AM

Where that "payload" is loaded makes a significant difference. #1000 on the rear bumper is a lot different from #1000 in the back seat. Staying within all the weight specs can still result in unloading the front axle. You have to pay attention to all the weight ratings. So, payload and hitch load are not the same thing. Put a trailer on there with a #3,000 tongue weight and the front axle might be off the ground.

goducks · 11-25-2016, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeG0351

First, Everyone have a great and safe Thanksgiving day....
I have the 2016 Ram 2500 6.7 Diesel.
I'm interested in the Jayco 32 BHDS with a hitch weight of roughly 1000.
My Payload is roughly 3000.
So my question is, Payload and hitch weight one in the same....
Thanks in advance for any replys....

No Ram 2500 CTD has 3000lbs of payload. More like 2000-2200lbs.
The 32BH has a dry brochure TW of 955lbs. Add some gear and stuff in the front and you're likely around 1200+lbs. That leaves around 900lbs for truck cargo and passengers. Anything that goes in or on the truck regardless or where, counts against the payload.

Those that say just hitch and go are ignorant or foolish. You'll definitely know that TT's there. Yes you'll have the power to pull any grade but you still have to stop it and control it in windy conditions.
My 5er is 9000lbs and I tow it with a 12 Ram CTD 2500. 5ers tow better but I still feel the 5er back there. Guessing your 32BH will come in near 9000lbs all loaded up since you probably have kids.

You should be fine if you watch you trucks payload and get a good WDH with built in sway control. A 36' 8500-9000lb TT is a good load for even a 3/4 ton truck.

campingn.c. · 11-25-2016, 04:06 PM

Are you guys seriously implying that a 32BHDS or any TT period is a questionable load for a modern 3/4 truck ??? That's a first for even the most extreme weight police.

bansai · 11-25-2016, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by campingn.c.

Are you guys seriously implying that a 32BHDS or any TT period is a questionable load for a modern 3/4 truck ??? That's a first for even the most extreme weight police.

Not what I'm doing or implying, I'd argue that nobody is suggesting that actually. It's just simple math and we're trying to help the OP understand where hitch weights and cargo capacity come into play. Exceed your payload and it really doesn't matter if your Tow Vehicle is a US Army deuce and a half. You have x amount of weight to deal with, and y ability to carry it. Stay within the constraints, and you're golden. Can't speak for others, but that is seriously the only point. The difference in capacity between a half ton and a 3/4 ton can be quite trivial depending on the build... a couple hundred pounds.

More importantly, The OP was interested in learning about tongue weights and how that number impacts cargo capacity and if the 2 numbers are interchangeable. I recommend hitting the scales so you know what those 2 numbers really are, regardless of how beastly a person *thinks* their tow vehicle is and several of us explained what those numbers mean. It's actually easy to overload a 250/2500 with a 10,000 lb TT, a family, and all of their stuff. It's not 'weight police' it's just math.

Ironically, his modern 3/4 ton has maybe 200 pounds more payload capacity than my 150. That's the difference between taking my father in law along, or making him drive himself. When you are that close, I can see how hitting the scales would be beneficial, but am not suggesting it is too much camper for his truck, but could it be? Perhaps yes. Most of the posts are just suggesting to weigh... not have blind faith in a 3/4 ton that is a little lacking in the payload category.

If his truck payload max is less than 3000 lbs, and it sounds like it is closer to 2000, there are 150's that can out tow it (some of the 2017 models have 3200 lbs+ max payload) so I know for sure I'd want to hit the scales. Why not? Anyway, if it was my posts that made you think I'm suggesting the camper he's talking about is too much for his truck, that's not what I'm saying at all. He'll most likely be fine. I would though argue against the (your) assumption that you can tow any TT with any 3/4 ton by default and could clog up the thread with plenty of examples where this is not the case at all.

goducks · 11-25-2016, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by campingn.c.

Are you guys seriously implying that a 32BHDS or any TT period is a questionable load for a modern 3/4 truck ??? That's a first for even the most extreme weight police.

No one's implying that he can't tow it. From your statement it's obvious you don't adhere to weight ratings. Look up payload capacities for any 3/4 ton diesel and you'll see that they're 800-1000lbs less than a gas version. The diesel engine weighs that much more and takes away payload.
There's not hardly any TT's that most 3/4 ton diesel trucks can't tow. It's when the tongue weight, passengers and tons of gear get thrown into the truck that things become dicey as far as payload goes.

bansai · 11-25-2016, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goducks

No one's implying that he can't tow it. From your statement it's obvious you don't adhere to weight ratings. Look up payload capacities for any 3/4 ton diesel and you'll see that they're 800-1000lbs less than a gas version. The diesel engine weighs that much more and takes away payload.
There's not hardly any TT's that most 3/4 ton diesel trucks can't tow. It's when the tongue weight, passengers and tons of gear get thrown into the truck that things become dicey as far as payload goes.

Amen, you said in 2 paragraphs what took me an essay, but agreed 100%.

Heck, if my mother in law were still around, I'd need a 450 just to haul her with us. There's a lot more in play than the dry weights of a camper and the empty payload capacity of any given TV.

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