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Old 12-03-2016, 11:40 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by mtb4life View Post
How'd you figure out your 940 TW? I think for you to get an accurate tongue weight with the scale, you have to weigh 3x. You're missing the number for the Front Axle, trailer hooked but WD bars disengage.

I have a also have a 25BHS but a 2015 and the dealer set me up with only 800lbs WD bars. I have not weighed my trailer yet but I sure hope that my TW is not over 800lbs.
I literally put the tongue of the trailer on the scale sitting level to the ground. It weighed a 1080 before I took out half the stuff that were heavier items like my Coleman 10x10 canopy, chairs and some other stuff that I put in the compartment on the slide out by the dinette. You would be surprised if you check your tongue weight I think a lot if people here would be surprised. I understand from reading other forum posts about going through 3 times to check various weights. But if you want to know tongue weight then wouldn't just putting it right on the scale tell you exactly what it is? Am I missing something here? I was looking at different home tongue scales at etrailer and they do the same thing. One of the main reasons I wanted to know is because I read a lot of threads with people that have tongue weights that make sense and some that just don't, so I wanted to kniw what exactly mine was for sure without guessing. On the Jayco site it puts the tongue weight on a dry 2016 WH at 5645lbs having a TW of 680lbs. This is one with no options. My yellow sticker on mine is 6115lbs dry so taking 13% puts it at 795lbs before putting the 2 7.5 gallon 55lb propane tanks and I have 2 batteries on the tongue. Both of which came with the trailer when I bought it off the lot. Someone else pre-ordered it and got cold feet so I got it fully loaded with these options. I even have a fridge in the front compartment which is nice but by no means not necessary. I also have the 2016.5 model which they made changes to by adding 2 extra windows in the slide out and a couple of other minor changes. Also all pictures I see online of this trailer have 5 gallon propane tanks and one battery. The propane tanks alone is a 38-40 lb difference and when I'm splitting hairs that is half the weight of my dog lol

Your trailer is much different because they made a lot of changes in 2016. The specs on a 2015 is 4925lbs dry with a 590lb TW. That is 90lbs lighter just on the tongue weight alone and what do you have for propane tanks and batteries?

What I may do is I have an extra 5 gallon propane tank so I will get one more and swap them out since I went all summer on 5 trips only using one tank cause I don't dry camp yet and take one battery off. If I decide to dry camp I can swap them out real easy. It will save me close to a 100 lbs right there.

Anywho this stuff is giving me a headache but it is what it is and I need to make sure I save every pound I can

Have a great day everyone.
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Old 12-04-2016, 01:11 AM   #22
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Counting the pounds...lol

Well I took off one battery which is 40lbs and I switched one tank out keeping keeping a 30# and using a 20# which gives me about 18-20 less lbs for a total loss of 58-60lbs.

Now my TW should be just under 900lbs . Which is much better because when I didn't know what I had I was at a 1080 when I weighed the first time last weekend now I should be around 880...yeah! Lost 180-190lbs in a week...wish it was that easy for myself... I could use a little weight reduction haha.

Now that leaves me a little over 500lbs left for the family and a little firewood. Plus I'm sure there is a few extra pounds if needed cause the lawyers for the Ford manufacture are extra cautious with the payload numbers for liability reasons but I'm not willing to put them to the test though.

Lessons learned again with this new trailer life. I love having a trailer but I can see why now when I read a quote a while back "after buying a trailer there will be a 50/50 chance you will either hate it or love it" well even tho this has been a trying and painful learning experience I still love it and can't wait till this summer!
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Old 12-04-2016, 08:13 AM   #23
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The first few trips were very stressful for me, but now that I have everything dialed-in, setup and breakdown are second nature. Take your time and try to be patient until you get your setup dialed-in, after that it should be smooth sailing. Either way, your wife and kids will have a blast and that is what its all about.

I have two 30lb tanks and go through one per season, I think two 20lb tanks would cut your tongue weight down further. It is also easier to get them filled, lugging around the 30lb tanks is not so easy.. It seems like your unit was spec'd heavy with two 30lb tanks and two batteries.

Some advice to reduce your stress level:

- Make sure your wife does a second check of the trailer and TV before you leave. It is very easy to miss something, like a raised TV antenna, and having a second set of eyes on things has saved me from a few mishaps.

- Come up with a clear set of verbals instructions so that your wife can help you back-up without getting into a giant argument. There are some nice tutorials online about how to "setup" your trailer before actually backing-up.

- Check and adjust your truck and trailer tire pressures often with a digital gauge. While you are doing this, inspect your trailer tires periodically for bubbles and other indications of eminent failure. I take along a large high pressure bicycle pump on my trips, much more convenient than an electric pump. If you have the standard P-rated tires, you want to pump them up to maximum pressure for better tracking on the highway. I switched to LT-rated tires for stiffer sidewalls, but the unloaded ride is relatively rough.

Remember, this is supposed to be fun, so take your time and try not to stress out. I bet you will be smooth-sailing by next season!



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dropnaduece View Post
Well I took off one battery which is 40lbs and I switched one tank out keeping keeping a 30# and using a 20# which gives me about 18-20 less lbs for a total loss of 58-60lbs.

Now my TW should be just under 900lbs . Which is much better because when I didn't know what I had I was at a 1080 when I weighed the first time last weekend now I should be around 880...yeah! Lost 180-190lbs in a week...wish it was that easy for myself... I could use a little weight reduction haha.

Now that leaves me a little over 500lbs left for the family and a little firewood. Plus I'm sure there is a few extra pounds if needed cause the lawyers for the Ford manufacture are extra cautious with the payload numbers for liability reasons but I'm not willing to put them to the test though.

Lessons learned again with this new trailer life. I love having a trailer but I can see why now when I read a quote a while back "after buying a trailer there will be a 50/50 chance you will either hate it or love it" well even tho this has been a trying and painful learning experience I still love it and can't wait till this summer!
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Old 12-04-2016, 07:00 PM   #24
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Yup yup - we had a blast this last summer but I just want to have things dialed in so that it removes as much strain on my tow vehicle as possible over the years. I have already 6 places reserved for the next summer cause if you don't you AOL because it is like buying tickets to a hot concert when they become available 9 months in advanced. I'm putting on BFG KO2's for my x-mas present at the end of the month and I don't care about the stuffer ride when unloaded.

Thanks for the tips I actually have the wife walk the dog and my two boys do the set up. She rather not be involved because she takes care of the inside and that's the way she wants it, if she wants to start learning to back up a trailer in a tight spot in the dark then I will teach her but for now I'm teaching my boys who are 12 and 16 and they love to help.

Happy trails.
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Old 12-05-2016, 06:28 PM   #25
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Mine are 3 years and 6 months, so I got some time before they can help...happy trails!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dropnaduece View Post
Yup yup - we had a blast this last summer but I just want to have things dialed in so that it removes as much strain on my tow vehicle as possible over the years. I have already 6 places reserved for the next summer cause if you don't you AOL because it is like buying tickets to a hot concert when they become available 9 months in advanced. I'm putting on BFG KO2's for my x-mas present at the end of the month and I don't care about the stuffer ride when unloaded.

Thanks for the tips I actually have the wife walk the dog and my two boys do the set up. She rather not be involved because she takes care of the inside and that's the way she wants it, if she wants to start learning to back up a trailer in a tight spot in the dark then I will teach her but for now I'm teaching my boys who are 12 and 16 and they love to help.

Happy trails.
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Old 01-16-2017, 05:25 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Dropnaduece View Post
F-150 Lariat with Ecoboost fully loaded max tow 6.5 bed

Yellow sticker:
Payload 1620
Front GAWR 3600
Rear GAWR 3800
GVWR 7050
GCVWR 17100
Tow limit 11,400

Trailer WH 25BHS
Dry 5160
I believe max is 7200 doesn't matter I'm way under.

TV unloaded with full tank, myself, RAS, and roll up bed cover.
Front 3280
Rear 2480
Total 5760 - which would leave me 1290 left for payload

TV & TT hooked with WDH - also mini fridge in front storage, 2 batteries, and 2 7.5 gallon tanks.

Front 3080
Rear 3680
TT 5900
TW 1080 - I put the trailer tongue directly on the scale

I have a lot of storage space in front with this model and I ended up moving some of the heavier items to over the trailers axle but it's not a lot. What am I missing here??? I only have 210lbs of payload left for my wife, 2 teenage boys, 85lb dog, and firewood in the bed. What the heck I have been pulling all summer this way with no problems but I ask do I have a problem with the numbers I have?

Thanks
Besides payload, you're within 120 lbs of your rear GAWR and close on your truck hitch max tongue weight as well. The hitch is probably rated to 1,140 lbs (typically 10% of tow rating, check the hitch mount itself for a data plate to confirm this). If your loaded weights are before your wife, sons and dog climb on board (I'd guess that's another 500 or so lbs), then you're likely over on payload/GVWR and close/over on rear GAWR.

As you can see here, I'm in a very similar situation with my 28DSBH and 2010 F-150. My solution will be to run with one battery, stow the outside fridge internally during travel, shift some items out of the front storage area as you have, purge the trailer of stuff we don't need/use, and tighten up on the WD hitch to move more weight to my front axle. Doing this should put me within limits on 3 critical weights - tongue, rear GAWR, and payload. I don't like being close, but I know that these vehicles are over engineered. As long as I'm under max numbers I feel safe. I don't like being even one pound over, however - it keeps me up at night.

I see from your weights that your front axle lost 200 lbs and your rear axle gained 1,200 lbs when hitched up. That indicates a tongue weight of 1,000, not 1,080, so if that's the more accurate weight you might have a little more breathing room. Of course, the 80 lb. difference in weight might be your WD hitch/ball (if you weighed the trailer tongue without these).

I'd recommend moving another 200 lbs or so to your front axle but it would help to know what your axles weighed with your trailer hooked up and NO weight distribution engaged. That's the missing set of numbers here. You might already be at >50% Front Axle Load Restoration. Of course, going to 100% FALR is fine, and it would bring your front axle to 3,280 and your back to 3,480, both exactly within 320 lbs of their respective GAWRs. Then again, we don't have weights with your family and gear on board, so you might be closer on these GAWRs when they mount up. You'll remain over on payload, however.

FYI, according to this article, wheel and tire weights do reduce payload. When you add LT tires they'll weigh a bit more than your stock tires, just something to keep in mind. Running with the stock tires inflated to max pressure isn't unsafe and could save you some weight. For example, I run with 275/65R18 116T Goodyear Wrangler AT Adventures, a 6 ply equivalent. They have a weight rating of 2,756 lbs per tire, more than enough to handle my front and rear GAWRs, and I'm satisfied with the ride, wear and handling. It sounds like your towing experience so far has been good as well, and I'm sure the RAS helps tremendously.

All that said, your front and rear GAWR combine for 7,400 lbs, 350 lbs more than your truck's GVWR. Some would argue that if you don't exceed THAT combined weight, you're actually okay on payload. For what it's worth I think you're okay if you make some adjustments. Don't run with wood in the truck or water in the trailer, maybe stow a battery under the dinette and a propane tank in the tub when towing, and keep looking for ways to lighten the trailer load without sacrificing comfort.

Running right at max weights is safe, although it can only cause components to wear out more quickly. And there's no weight to spare to run with your firewood, a generator, some trailer upgrades or two teenage boys who will only become man-sized over time. As I said, I'm in a similar situation, not quite as tight, but almost. I'll probably closely manage weights for another year or two, but don't be surprised to see a super duty in my signature block one day. And yes, I agree that the industry (both truck and RV dealers) often provide misleading info on genuine capacities - don't beat yourself up too much, you're okay!
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Old 01-17-2017, 10:53 AM   #27
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Similar: Bought TV first & TT later with promises from all (dealers & Ford sales) that it would tow fine. 2014 F150 SCAB with 3:31 rear gear & tow package. 5.0 V8. The TT is a Jayfeather 25BH with dry wt 5450 lbs. It is 30 feet long from tip of hitch to bumper. I towed almost 9,000 miles on a cross country trip. It was slow up the mtn passes but no issues with temps ever. Rear gear ratio is holding me back ( I would like to upgrade to 3:73's ) Only issue was sway at times. I have the Reese WDH with anti sway cam system.
MY yellow sticker states 1,803 max wt
Tire sticker max wt F 3600, R 3850
Cats were taken right at the time I started the trip.
Pass 1: TV only, maxed out with full tank, passenger, myself , dog, 2 portable generators, tool box, & other things. Weight was: F 3450, R 3850 , total 6260lbs
Pass 2: TV & TT detached wd hitch but still on: F 3060, R 4020, TT axle 5100 , Total 12180
Pass 3: TV & TT with WDH attached F 3180 R 3640 TT axle 5220 Total 12040
No idea what Tongue wt was but estimated about 860lbs

I also wished I had a F250 but will be sticking with what I have or just sell TT & downsize.
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Old 01-17-2017, 12:25 PM   #28
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Similar: Bought TV first & TT later with promises from all (dealers & Ford sales) that it would tow fine. 2014 F150 SCAB with 3:31 rear gear & tow package. 5.0 V8. The TT is a Jayfeather 25BH with dry wt 5450 lbs. It is 30 feet long from tip of hitch to bumper. I towed almost 9,000 miles on a cross country trip. It was slow up the mtn passes but no issues with temps ever. Rear gear ratio is holding me back ( I would like to upgrade to 3:73's ) Only issue was sway at times. I have the Reese WDH with anti sway cam system.
MY yellow sticker states 1,803 max wt
Tire sticker max wt F 3600, R 3850
Cats were taken right at the time I started the trip.
Pass 1: TV only, maxed out with full tank, passenger, myself , dog, 2 portable generators, tool box, & other things. Weight was: F 3450, R 3850 , total 6260lbs
Pass 2: TV & TT detached wd hitch but still on: F 3060, R 4020, TT axle 5100 , Total 12180
Pass 3: TV & TT with WDH attached F 3180 R 3640 TT axle 5220 Total 12040
No idea what Tongue wt was but estimated about 860lbs

I also wished I had a F250 but will be sticking with what I have or just sell TT & downsize.
Some interesting things in your numbers...your total weight for truck plus trailer (GCW) was 140 lbs lighter between passes 2&3. In my experience the total should be the same, just spread out differently due to weight distribution being engaged or disengaged. WD can't eliminate weight, just move it. Do you know why the weights were different - typos? Pull something off the scale between weighs?

Comparing passes 2&3, your WD hitch moved 380 lbs off your rear axle but your front axle only gained 120 lbs and your trailer axle only gained 120 lbs.. That's just 240 lbs, again off by 140 lbs.. Where'd that 140 lbs go?

Your truck alone weights are also a little off, must be a typo in one/both axle weights. Your two axle total is listed as 7,300, not 6,260. I'm assuming 6,260-6,300 is correct, that seems typical for that truck. Your rear axle was probably more like 2,850 without the trailer, not 3,850.

Can you re verify your numbers? We can figure out your true tongue weight with these weights when accurate. As near as I can tell with the numbers provided, your trailer weighs between 5,740 (w/WD engaged) and 5,880 (w/out WD engaged). Either one or both of these are off, they both can't be right.

In neither case can I come up with a tongue weight of 860 lbs. Your "w/out WD" weights indicate a tongue weight of 780 lbs.. Your w/WD weights indicate a tongue weight of 640 lbs, the total of all weights redistributed to your truck and trailer axles. The difference between those two tongue weights again is...140lbs. It's really got me curious...

As near as I can tell, you're actually in decent shape either way. You're well within GVWR on both truck and trailer, as well as GCWR. With weight distribution engaged, both truck axles are under their GAWR. Your tongue weight is within the max of your F-150 hitch (double check the hitch data plate but it should be rated for 1,100 or so lbs). With 1,803 lbs available, you've probably got room to spare on truck max payload as well. You could stand to move at least another 60 lbs to your front axle to get to a minimum 50% front axle load restoration (FALR), but that just requires dialing in your WD hitch a bit more. Since you're not overloaded but don't like the way the trailer pulls, this might be why. You might need more weight on the front axle to improve handling.

Your only issue might be exceeding the truck's max tow rating, but even with the 3:31 GR I'll bet 6,000 lbs of trailer are well within the truck's rated capacity. Last guess...since your trailer's dry weight is 5,450, I'd wager the loaded trailer weight of 5,880 is the more accurate number. There's very few trailers loaded for camping with just 290 lbs of cargo.
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Old 01-17-2017, 12:57 PM   #29
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2013 Lariat 150 Ecoboost max tow package & Brake assist package
TT WH 27DSRL
TT empty = approx. 6300lbs but with gear I average just under 7500lbs
Tounge Wt would be around 1125 lbs but with good WDH down to 900


On the flat lands of Texas and the Southeast I have never had an issue


I want to upgrade to F250 diesel when I retire so I can not worry about mountain travel etc.
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Old 01-17-2017, 01:00 PM   #30
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Yes thanks for the analysis. I did mess up the #, THe TV only weight was F 3480, R 2780 Gross weight 6260.
I thought the numbers were screwy also with the weights being different by 140 lbs. I didn't change anything when I did the CATS so something was definitely off. Next time I will read them better before I pull away from the CAT station.
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Old 01-17-2017, 01:20 PM   #31
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Yes thanks for the analysis. I did mess up the #, THe TV only weight was F 3480, R 2780 Gross weight 6260.
I thought the numbers were screwy also with the weights being different by 140 lbs. I didn't change anything when I did the CATS so something was definitely off. Next time I will read them better before I pull away from the CAT station.
Download the CAT app, it sends you an email and PDF after you weigh and you don't have to go inside the weigh station.
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