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Old 08-30-2015, 07:39 PM   #1
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Novice questions #3 and #4

In a previous post, I asked two questions about our "new to us" 1206KB (1996). We're hoping that we're close to understanding how everything works, and making the necessary repairs and getting the maintenance done so it can be ready to go for next weekend. We have the pump working, the water system sanitized and everything is working there. The hot water heater is tested and works (after a scary flare up from the clogged burner tube!). Everything works on 120 just fine. The fridge we just got figured out on propane and tested. Brought the fridge down from 80 to 65 in about an hour, so I figure that is working as well. The manual is somewhat helpful, but it has a lot to be desired when it comes to giving ALL the info!

Now, for the couple questions: Question #3 from this novice: Are the receptacles (like you'd plug your toaster into in the house) supposed to work while running 12 v? The lights work fine on 12 v. so I know I'm getting power to the converter. Just don't know if there is an issue that needs to be worked out with those receptacles or if they were never meant to be operational while on 12 v power. Would be awfully nice to be able to have a little clock and/or a night light at the very least. If they ARE supposed to work, are these running off the 15 amp fuse in the converter? What else should I check?

Question #4: The furnace. I get the blower to come on, but no heat. Thermostat is turned up all the way to 90 (and it's not that warm out), the power switch on the thermostat is in the ON position and the switch under the vent cover inside the camper is in the ON position as well. I am assuming that the switch under that cover is an electronic switch to open the gas valve from what it looks like. I have cleaned the 4 electrical contacts going to the gas valve. Not sure what else to try at this point. Like I said, the blower is working, just no heat, so it sounds like the burner is not igniting. There is a little tiny black switch/button on the right side of the furnace under the vent cover that says 5 amp next to it. I don't know if this is a reset button of sorts or a circuit breaker or what. It pushes in a little but it doesn't stay in, although I didn't try pushing it in while the system was powered up. This was all checked while running on 12 v power from the fully charged, new battery. Can someone enlighten me on what to check with the furnace?
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Old 08-30-2015, 07:45 PM   #2
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Q#3 the 120VAC outlets only work when you are plugged into shore power.

#4 does your furnace have electronic ignition or use a standing pilot flame?
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Old 08-30-2015, 08:36 PM   #3
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Q3: Thanks. I guess we now don't need to be trying to fix what isn't broken! Crud. I guess that means no blow dryer or toaster!

Q4: Electronic ignition...no pilot.
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Old 08-30-2015, 09:25 PM   #4
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Is your gas turned on and if multi bottle is the regulator set to use the bottle that you have open? After sitting for an extended time air will replace the gas in the line. I usually make sure I can light a burner on the stove, once that works I know I have gas to the furnace and it will come on. If the stove works {if you have one} and the furnace still doesn't come on you may need to have your system looked at.
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Old 08-30-2015, 09:52 PM   #5
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#4. You also need to be either a). hooked up to 120 volts or b). your batteries need to be close to fully charged as there are a series of switches before you get heat. The fan will run until it depletes the batteries.

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Old 08-31-2015, 05:32 AM   #6
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Also for #4 there is a time delay from when the blower starts and when the heat ignites (30 seconds or so). Are you waiting long enough for this?
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Old 08-31-2015, 05:54 AM   #7
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Stove has been lit, hot water heater has been lit and run for a while (to test if it was working), refrigerator has been lit on propane and run for an hour or so (to test it). Yes, the gas is working just fine. ;-) Propane is a two bottle system that hooks up into one regulator, and it's delivering gas to the other appliances just fine. We've only opened one of the bottles so that we'll know where we are on LP consumption while the camper is being used. When one gets empty, we'll close that and open the other.

Battery is brand new and works the lights and the water pump just fine. It also runs the fan on the furnace just fine as well.

Yes, I am aware of the fact that there is a delay before the heat actually fires. In the few times we've tried the furnace, we let it run for 2-3 minutes each time. That should be enough time to realize SOME sort of warming, shouldn't it? The fan doesn't blow very hard, that I will say. I also do not hear clicking or attempt at firing up. All I hear is the fan running.

I will get a couple of photos of the unit today and post them. Perhaps someone will see something that we are missing.
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Old 08-31-2015, 06:01 AM   #8
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If you can get the make and model # of the furnace The do a search for the manual. You may have to pull the furnace and check the fan to see if it is clogged and also check the sail switch to see if it closes. I would also check the high limit switch as it can cause the furnace not to light.
Post the make and model number.


I had a similar problem with an older furnace and found the fan was clogged.
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Old 08-31-2015, 06:22 AM   #9
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Hydro-Flame model FA7916-11

I have no idea even what or where this "sail switch" or "high limit switch" is.

Is it possible to get into the fan without removing the whole unit (which I believe would entail disconnecting the gas line)?

I have the user manual, as well as I believe the installation manual.
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Old 08-31-2015, 06:40 AM   #10
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The sail switch detects that the fan is actually moving air past the firebox. The high limit switch detects that the firebox has overheated.


When they work properly, you'll never know they're there.
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Old 08-31-2015, 06:45 AM   #11
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And yes you would have to remove the furnace to get to them. You say you have the installation manual if so see if it has the wiring diagram in it. If it does you will see the sail switch and high limit and the they are wired in series with the gas valve. If you don't have the wiring diagram send me a PM with your e-mail address and I will send you a copy.
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Old 08-31-2015, 06:50 AM   #12
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Thanks bedrck. I'll head out to the camper here shortly and see if there is a wiring diagram in the packet of papers I have for the camper. I am pretty sure the installation manual is in the packet. We've been working with everything (literally) in this camper, so it's hard to remember what papers are there. Fortunately, this is the ONE system that we don't *really* need for the next couple weeks, so the repair can wait for a while if need be.
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Old 08-31-2015, 07:20 AM   #13
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After the blower on the furnace has been running for 30 seconds do you hear a clicking? that is the sparker trying to ignite if you hear that then there are several other possibilities. 1) the sparker is out of adjustment and too far from the gas. 2) the thermocouple is defective and needs replacing 3) blocked burner tube from spiders..
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Old 08-31-2015, 07:50 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outrider View Post
Would be awfully nice to be able to have a little clock and/or a night light at the very least.
I keep reminding myself, that is why we've got an RV, we're willing to rough it and I can't expect all the luxuries of home all the time. We actually like to camp w/out any hook-ups - we do have generators to keep the battery charged. Here are some solutions ~ you just have to adjust to a "new normal":
~ Clock? Check out this battery clock - it is great in the TT. For a nightlight, check-out emergency power failure lights that go on when the outlet power is off. In our case, the blue light from the entertainment center is sufficient!
~ Toaster? How about the old tried-and-true cooktop/campfire toaster - works in a pinch. Alternatively, you can toast/grill bread in a fry pan. Even fancier, cut a hole in it for your egg!
~ Hair-dryer? Go natural (tough for me to do - got curly hair that never behaves) or get a 12-volt cigarette-plug dryer to run off your vehicle battery or get a "75W Power Inverter DC 12V to 110V AC Car Inverter DC Adapter Car Cigarette Lighter with AC Outlet" so you can use your current dryer.
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Old 08-31-2015, 07:51 AM   #15
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Old 09-01-2015, 05:55 AM   #16
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Hattie,

Thanks for the info. Can't do toast over a campfire...no campfire! We are not going to be at a campground. We're using the camper as lodging at a sporting event that we are both involved in. "Camp" is made at the venue where the event takes place. It is not a place that camping normally takes place, but they set aside an area for participants to "squat" while there for the match. Totally dry camping, no holes, no hookups, no fires. We're essentially in the middle of a field.

I'll check into the other things though. I can keep a little flashlight next to the bed I guess and turn it on when I need to get up during the night. I don't like turning on bright lights in the middle of the night, as I don't get back to sleep very easily if I do. Our little LED flashlight should be plenty of light for the "midnight trip". LOL!

....my hair doesn't "go natural" without looking positively HORRIBLE (and I'm not overly vain). I need to do something with the bangs at the very least, because they have a total mind of their own. I can probably go to the clubhouse and take care of the hair. Was just hoping to not have to, as it's quite a ways away from where the camper will be. We actually do have a power inverter, but I don't think it's enough to run a hair dryer. Tried to use a pump to blow up air mattresses last year when we were tent camping and even that wouldn't work.

As far as adjusting to a "new normal". I'm totally ok with having to do without. The pop up is a HUGE step up from the tent camping that I normally do. I mean, a fridge? Heat? Running water? Not having to zip the door closed when I make the "midnight run" to the porta john? Heck.... not having to go OUT to make the "midnight run"? I'll manage!



Quote:
Originally Posted by Hattie View Post
I keep reminding myself, that is why we've got an RV, we're willing to rough it and I can't expect all the luxuries of home all the time. We actually like to camp w/out any hook-ups - we do have generators to keep the battery charged. Here are some solutions ~ you just have to adjust to a "new normal":
~ Clock? Check out this battery clock - it is great in the TT. For a nightlight, check-out emergency power failure lights that go on when the outlet power is off. In our case, the blue light from the entertainment center is sufficient!
~ Toaster? How about the old tried-and-true cooktop/campfire toaster - works in a pinch. Alternatively, you can toast/grill bread in a fry pan. Even fancier, cut a hole in it for your egg!
~ Hair-dryer? Go natural (tough for me to do - got curly hair that never behaves) or get a 12-volt cigarette-plug dryer to run off your vehicle battery or get a "75W Power Inverter DC 12V to 110V AC Car Inverter DC Adapter Car Cigarette Lighter with AC Outlet" so you can use your current dryer.
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Old 09-23-2015, 11:47 AM   #17
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Ok, we pulled the entire unit. Pulled the squirrel cage out and gave that a good cleaning. It wasn't very dirty, just a few small clumps of dust stuck to the very edge of the blades. It's all clean now. We found the sail switch. Pulled it out and did a continuity test on it and it passed when closed (button depressed by sail). Next step after cleaning everything else we could reach on the outside we bypassed the sail switch by jumping a wire between the two contacts that connect to it. We do not have the unit installed and hooked up to gas at this point, so not sure if we should be expecting to hear clicking or not. There isn't any though. The on/off switch, I am assuming that should cut power to the entire unit if flipped to the off position when it's running, correct? As in an emergency cut off? I flipped it while it was running and the blower continued to turn. So what is next to try here? We'd really love to have the heater working! When this is in operational condition, does it blow very little or should we be expecting a good amount of air to come through? Right now, it's not more than what there'd be if you exhaled after a deep breath.
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Old 09-23-2015, 12:53 PM   #18
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...snip.. When this is in operational condition, does it blow very little or should we be expecting a good amount of air to come through? Right now, it's not more than what there'd be if you exhaled after a deep breath.
The air flow should be fairly strong. A piece of paper held from the top edge should blow to almost straight out.

Did you have a chance to observe the fan motor running while it was disassembled? Its a fairly high-speed motor. If it is laboring, the motor or bearing are bad. Or the squirrel cage is binding.
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Old 09-23-2015, 01:26 PM   #19
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We ran the fan motor while it was completely out of housing. We're definitely not getting much air movement, as you say, enough to hold a piece of paper out. It didn't seem to be laboring or making any unusual noises. However, if you push the sail switch in so it's making contact, shouldn't it try to ignite? We're not hearing any clicking or anything. Just the whir of the motor.
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Old 09-23-2015, 01:32 PM   #20
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...and it is still partially disassembled and out of the cabinet. If anyone has some thoughts on what to test (and how), that would be great!
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