Is this right?

[Camping Couple]

Today I took our trailer to the CAT scales for a prospective buyer of our TT. I followed the guidelines in the sticky for weighing a TT/TV combo. The only exception is the TT and the TV is empty, we are selling it. I am not a pro at this, but before I sell this TT, I want to be sure the buyer can tow it safely. Between the two of us we are figuring things out. Keep in mind the TV used today is my 3/4 ton Silverado. He does not have a WDH set up yet. The buyers TV is a 2014 Jeep Cherokee with the towing package installed from the factory. The TT propane tanks are about 1/2 full (2-20lb tanks). Here are the numbers from the CAT scale certificates:

TV Only: Steer axle 3680
Drive axle 2920
Gross weight 6600

TV/TT WDH engaged: Steer axle 3740
Drive axle 3180
Trailer axle 3600
Gross weight 10520

TV/TT WDH NOT engaged: Steer axle 3460
Drive axle 3620
Trailer axle 3460
Gross weight 10540

I am coming up with a tongue weight of 700lbs. Other than actually putting the tongue jack on a scale platform, am I figuring this right? Also, the yellow sticker on our TT states from the factory with full propane etc. says 3890lbs. The weight today puts the TT at 430lbs lower than the sticker. What am I missing? I also noted that with the WDH engaged the rear axle load goes down 440lbs. Am I correct saying the tongue weight remains the same?

Rustic? Or anyone have any recommendations on a WDH set up for the buyer?

[nbhybrid]

well you have to add the axle weight and the TW to come up with the total trailer weight

total gross was 10540-6600 empty =3960lb trailer weight

I get tw of 480lbs approx

[nbhybrid]

is it a Cherokee or a GRAND Cherokee...there is a big difference

Cherokee will be at max and the grand cherokee should have no issues

[nbhybrid]

I personally would never tow anything without an Equalizer hitch..I love it.

they can go on Equalizers site and fill in the blanks to determine what they need but likely an E4 with 1000lb bars

[Camping Couple]

Originally Posted by nbhybrid

is it a Cherokee or a GRAND Cherokee...there is a big difference

Cherokee will be at max and the grand cherokee should have no issues

its the cherokee. I am all confused now....lol I thought with the trailer on the platform, the weight of 3460 would be accurate. I think im really missing something here. i am sorry if i sound ignorant...lol. i told the buyer a 700lb tongue weight.

[Camping Couple]

Originally Posted by nbhybrid

well you have to add the axle weight and the TW to come up with the total trailer weight

total gross was 10540-6600 empty =3960lb trailer weight

I get tw of 480lbs approx

Im sorry NB. what axle weight am i looking at? I have the certs right in front of me. how did you come up with the 480lbs? I just subtracted the 3620 from the 2920 = 700lbs. wow I blew this one.

[nbhybrid]

I am sure he ran. If you look at the weights without the WDH you loaded the rear axle by 700lbs but you unloaded the front axle by 220.

If it is the smaller new Cherokee they only have a 4500lb tow rating...I am at my max 3500 with mine but unsure whether he wants to be

[Camping Couple]

Originally Posted by nbhybrid

I am sure he ran. If you look at the weights without the WDH you loaded the rear axle by 700lbs but you unloaded the front axle by 220.

If it is the smaller new Cherokee they only have a 4500lb tow rating...I am at my max 3500 with mine but unsure whether he wants to be

So i just figured it out wrong? thats it? Wow! I have to read the guidlines again...i am embarassed.

[Camping Couple]

Originally Posted by nbhybrid

I am sure he ran. If you look at the weights without the WDH you loaded the rear axle by 700lbs but you unloaded the front axle by 220.

If it is the smaller new Cherokee they only have a 4500lb tow rating...I am at my max 3500 with mine but unsure whether he wants to be

So answer me this..... if my trailer is sitting on the scale unloaded but on the hitch ball, it weighed 3460lbs but you came up with 3960, where did that come from? wow im having a senior moment and i shouldn't be having them

[nbhybrid]

Originally Posted by Camping Couple

So answer me this..... if my trailer is sitting on the scale unloaded but on the hitch ball, it weighed 3460lbs but you came up with 3960, where did that come from? wow im having a senior moment and i shouldn't be having them

the 3460 is just the weight of the trailer that is on the "axle"...there is still weight on the tongue that has to be added to it

[Camping Couple]

Originally Posted by nbhybrid

the 3460 is just the weight of the trailer that is on the "axle"...there is still weight on the tongue that has to be added to it

NB.....I'm sorry, everything just slapped me in the head. I just re-read the sticky slowly and carefully again. I ran all the numbers and it all makes sense. No, the buyer didn't run but I'm more concerned about their safety than just selling my trailer. And it may be me over analyzing everything. They are new to camping and I would like this to be an enjoyable experience for them.

Thanks again for clarification on everything. I learned a few things today. who said you couldn't teach an old dog new tricks.

[nbhybrid]

Don't be sorry....That's what this place is for.

[Rustic Eagle]

Camping Couple,

Great job at the CAT scales

Referencing your CAT results, please note the following. You can match the individual weights to your (3) independent weigh-ins.

Tongue Weight: (3,460lbs + 3,620lbs) - 6,600lbs = 480lbs

Gross TT Weight: 10,520lbs - 6,600lbs = 3,920lbs (includes tongue weight)

Gross TT Weight: 10,540lbs - 6,600lbs = 3,940lbs (includes tongue weight)

Note: The delta between 10,520lbs and 10,540lbs is do to CAT scale error, in reality they should be the same gross weight value. CAT scales have an approx. 40lb plus/minus tolerance, so this can effect weights from one weigh-in to another.

Yellow Sticker Comparison: 3,940lbs (CAT) - 3,890lbs (Yellow Sticker)= 50lb Delta

Originally Posted by Camping Couple

snip......Am I correct saying the tongue weight remains the same?

As it's presently set-up, the tongue weight on the hitch ball for the most part remains a constant, the weight over the TV axle is what is distributed (effect of tongue weight being placed on the hitch ball). Since we all have different loading habits, the tongue weight will change once the new owner starts loading the TT.

Originally Posted by Camping Couple

snip..... recommendations on a WDH set up for the buyer?

The 2013 Jay Feather 197 has a GVWR of 4,750lbs, with a CAT weight of 3,940lbs this leaves 810lbs for cargo. Again, we all have different loading habits, but IMO a 500lb cargo load would be realistic for a family (4,440lbs total). If the new owner travels with a full fresh water tank, add another 238lbs (4,678lbs total).

So, I would use the GVWR of 4,750lbs (worst case) for sizing a WDH. RV/WDH manufactures recommend a 10% to 15% loaded tongue weight range (of TT weight), so 475lb to 712lb range......, IMO a WDH rated at 800lbs would be adequate, a 1,000lb rating would be ok if the owner expects to maintain a heavy tongue weight (high end of range).

If it should come up, and the new owner doesn't plan to tow with a full tank, then an "assumed" TT weight of 4,440lbs = 444lb to 666lb tongue weight range, a WDH rated at 800lbs is still a good choice.

Hope you don't mind the detail, thought it might be helpful.

Bob

[nbhybrid]

The extra 50 pounds from the yellow sticker to the actual scale weight is likely the 6 gallons of water in your heater unless you emptied it.

I mentioned the 1000 bars for the Equalizer because they do not have an 800.....600 and 1000 are the choices and 600 is too low in this case

especially since they will be towing at max with a Cherokee they need one of the "best" WDH on the market IMO

[Camping Couple]

Rustic, NB....you guys are awesome! This experience really opened my eyes. We have a 24 FBS on the way and take delivery in 2 weeks. Although I am towing with a 3/4 ton, I still want to know the numbers. I think on our new TT I may have to change out the spring bars. They are rated for GTW 10,000 lbs and TW 600 lbs. I'm not sure what the TW is on the FBS. I'll see in a few weeks.

[Bassdogs]

Just disconnect and the TT weight on the scale will make it clear for you. Posters are telling you that there is weight transfer to the TV when you're on the ball.

[Rustic Eagle]

Camping Couple,

With your knowledge of using the CAT scale I'm confident that your new TV/TT (24FBS) combination will be set-up properly under loaded conditions as well.

Don't forget to post pics of that new TT!!

Bob

[nbhybrid]

There is no question the new trailer will or at least should have a TW over 600 lbs. If your bars are only 600 you should trade up. They unlikely will transfer much weight to the front but with your HD it may not need much.

[gijoecam]

If you would like a spreadsheet to plug & chug the numbers for you, I set one up a couple years ago I'd be happy to email you. It will detail the weights, show how effective your wdh is transferring axle weights, and with the vehicle's axle ratings, show exactly your rig is doing. I leave it in my Google docs file on my smart phone so I can see it on the fly if I need to. Shoot me your email and I'd be happy to send it to you (or anyone else who would find it handy)