RV Quality based on the Job Market

[GretasDad]

The job market is great these days for job seekers with unemployment at almost historical lows and some indications that everyone who wants a job - has one. Wages are starting to rise because employers need to attract or retain good people. But in many ways the improving jobs situation is not great for employers which brings me to my observation relative to the RV industry.

RV manufacturers appear to be desperate for employees based on the job postings on Indeed.com. Jayco is actively recruiting. Forest River has a lot of postings. But the interesting thing is they are now recruiting for people with zero experience ("will train") and even part time and short term ("summer") help. As a retired employer, I sympathize with their plight. But...

Think about the build quality of RV's coming off these lines. Many of these employees building our "next" RV have no experience and/or are not long term employees. Do they really understand or care how well that slide-out is installed, how the plumbing was connected or the roof was built? RV's are selling well these days so production volume needs to be high. How much training time do you suppose is being given before that new hire is put on the line?

A lot of screen time here is dedicated to the challenges we all experience due to the quality of the RV's coming off these assembly lines. My gut tells me the future is not going to see improvement on this issue.

[Crabman]

If you watch the video below in post 1 it shows the shortage of labor in the Elkhart area, where most RVs are made. Anyone with a warm body is needed......


https://www.jaycoowners.com/forums/f...oom-55661.html

[wags999]

When I visited the Jayco plant (s). I found it interesting that the units are built by "teams". Teams of workers who work on incentives, number of units built and number of warranty/quality issues. They earn a base pay with incentives for units built, including when the scheduled # of units are built they can leave. This does two things, peer pressure to work as quickly and efficiently as possible for the good of the team. Also if your quality is poor the team gets "punished" in the form of incentives taken back...again peer pressure.

So as this new employee comes "online" they will be one of a team of experienced workers. Trained or groomed to work quickly and with quality in mind. Will they make mistakes, of course were all humans and we all make mistakes. But, it appears to me, this team concept is a good one. One for all, all for one. It works in the Marine Corps and it will work at Jayco.. Is it perfect, probably not, but it's a way to make sure everyone is on the same plan. If a new worker is a slacker he won't be in that position long. I would assume they start new workers offline, building components until they are capable of moving to the line, where they can earn more $$. It's in everyone's interest to get the best possible workers on the line, since a good worker adds to everyone's bottom line, same as a bad worker deducts from the bottom line, of the team

It's always difficult finding good employees, I know I went through my share over the years. But this system brings everyone in the plant into common interests. If the components are not correct and ready when needed the line is slowed..If appliances are not staged correctly, the line is slowed. And with incentives, peer pressure to do a good job, plus management doing their job, it's about as good as it can be.

If you really look at the complaints on here, many, if not most, are components Jayco doesn't make but rather just installs. Ie Furnaces, Ac, water heaters, slide outs etc.. Much of those are not under Jayco's control.. the installation yes, but not the product themselves. I'm sure they charge back warranty claims, which, brings those component mfg into the same team concept. Produce a good product at a reasonable cost and with as few issues as possible and everyone wins..

I don't think anyone WANTS to build a poor quality product. Do I think some minor things could be changed to improve quality, of course. Something as small as using longer nails in trim, ,or using adhesive (which typically they use very little) could improve the finished product, and maybe they are looking at that. Longer or slightly larger guage nails would hold better and perhaps, less trim would come loose.


Overall I think the industry does a reasonably good job, producing a good product at a reasonable price, knowing their product typically is use a few weekends a month and maybe two weeks a year. Most of us on this forum use our RV's more than is typical, were "into it". They state very clearly the units are NOT designed for Full time use.. there is a reason for that. A higher standard is needed for full timers or even half timers like myself. I understand what I purchased, I don't expect the quality I have in my stick and stucco home. I know my RV will require more maintenance than most, since I use it more, and components will not last the lifetime, even flooring, because of my usage. it doesn't mean Jayco builts a crappy product, just that I'm not using the product as they designed it. And I'm too cheap to pay the cost for a unit designed for full time or half time use, its not worth it to me. Ill put up a piece of trim falling off when I put the slide out in or out, and I'll repair it with adhesive and longer nails as needed.

If the market was full timers or half timers, who are willing to pay more for a better quality, the market will meet that demand.. but being humans, we want the best but pay the least. We have to accept we the buyers are part of the issue. When a Pick up is $50,000 but a class C is $80,000 there's not a lot of room for the mfg to build in higher quality components. If you have the $$ you can always find an RV that will meet ALL your expectations...but that's still, and most likely will always be a small segment of the market..

Happy Camping, the season is upon us !

[GretasDad]

I also toured the Jayco line last year (and have toured some other manufacturers as well) and agree with the comments about the benefits of a team build and incentive program. Peer and monetary pressure can be powerful. I also see two other factors at play in the current environment:

1) Volume trumps everything right now as both consumer demand and stockholder expectations are high.
2) Quality is in the eye of the beholder.

As stated before, it's likely many of us posting here use our RV's more than the average owner. I also suspect that if any of us were hired as the Quality Control Tech at the end of the line we would reject a higher percentage of units, lowering the pass rate, and drawing the ire of everyone from the assembly team members to the CEO.

US automotive quality suffered similarly until foreign competition forced a change. (Why many of us drive Toyota's, Honda's and Lexus now) But that's unlikely in the RV industry and since the bulk of consumers want cheap prices over high quality it leaves many of us continuing to fix and improve these units to our own standard of quality.

[stateboy]

Originally Posted by wags999

When I visited the Jayco plant (s). I found it interesting that the units are built by "teams". Teams of workers who work on incentives, number of units built and number of warranty/quality issues. They earn a base pay with incentives for units built, including when the scheduled # of units are built they can leave. This does two things, peer pressure to work as quickly and efficiently as possible for the good of the team. Also if your quality is poor the team gets "punished" in the form of incentives taken back...again peer pressure.

So as this new employee comes "online" they will be one of a team of experienced workers. Trained or groomed to work quickly and with quality in mind. Will they make mistakes, of course were all humans and we all make mistakes. But, it appears to me, this team concept is a good one. One for all, all for one. It works in the Marine Corps and it will work at Jayco.. Is it perfect, probably not, but it's a way to make sure everyone is on the same plan. If a new worker is a slacker he won't be in that position long. I would assume they start new workers offline, building components until they are capable of moving to the line, where they can earn more $$. It's in everyone's interest to get the best possible workers on the line, since a good worker adds to everyone's bottom line, same as a bad worker deducts from the bottom line, of the team

It's always difficult finding good employees, I know I went through my share over the years. But this system brings everyone in the plant into common interests. If the components are not correct and ready when needed the line is slowed..If appliances are not staged correctly, the line is slowed. And with incentives, peer pressure to do a good job, plus management doing their job, it's about as good as it can be.

If you really look at the complaints on here, many, if not most, are components Jayco doesn't make but rather just installs. Ie Furnaces, Ac, water heaters, slide outs etc.. Much of those are not under Jayco's control.. the installation yes, but not the product themselves. I'm sure they charge back warranty claims, which, brings those component mfg into the same team concept. Produce a good product at a reasonable cost and with as few issues as possible and everyone wins..

I don't think anyone WANTS to build a poor quality product. Do I think some minor things could be changed to improve quality, of course. Something as small as using longer nails in trim, ,or using adhesive (which typically they use very little) could improve the finished product, and maybe they are looking at that. Longer or slightly larger guage nails would hold better and perhaps, less trim would come loose.


Overall I think the industry does a reasonably good job, producing a good product at a reasonable price, knowing their product typically is use a few weekends a month and maybe two weeks a year. Most of us on this forum use our RV's more than is typical, were "into it". They state very clearly the units are NOT designed for Full time use.. there is a reason for that. A higher standard is needed for full timers or even half timers like myself. I understand what I purchased, I don't expect the quality I have in my stick and stucco home. I know my RV will require more maintenance than most, since I use it more, and components will not last the lifetime, even flooring, because of my usage. it doesn't mean Jayco builts a crappy product, just that I'm not using the product as they designed it. And I'm too cheap to pay the cost for a unit designed for full time or half time use, its not worth it to me. Ill put up a piece of trim falling off when I put the slide out in or out, and I'll repair it with adhesive and longer nails as needed.

If the market was full timers or half timers, who are willing to pay more for a better quality, the market will meet that demand.. but being humans, we want the best but pay the least. We have to accept we the buyers are part of the issue. When a Pick up is $50,000 but a class C is $80,000 there's not a lot of room for the mfg to build in higher quality components. If you have the $$ you can always find an RV that will meet ALL your expectations...but that's still, and most likely will always be a small segment of the market..

Happy Camping, the season is upon us !

Good read. I wasn't aware of the team concept that they use to build them (makes sense though) but the other points you made I have heard overtime and bits and pieces. Thanks for the perspective.

[troutslayer]

I would not want to buy a new rv right about now.