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09-12-2014, 01:51 PM
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#41
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Lost in the Woods
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Woodstock
Posts: 1,128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hitch Pin
I got mine a Amazon, no tax’s and no shipping.
We used it all last week, the park where we camped has very low voltage out put, most people there couldn’t run their ac at all. We was able to run the ac the fridge and the hot water heater and the voltage never went below 116 volts in side the rv with everything running.
If we didn’t have the auto former last week we would have fried just about everything in the rv, most of the other campers didn’t have more than 110 volts in side their rv with nothing running.
So to me it was totally worth what I paid for it.
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the thing is you were bringing the campground voltage down even more running your autoformer...
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09-12-2014, 02:14 PM
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#42
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Southern Ohio
Posts: 463
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nbhybrid
the thing is you were bringing the campground voltage down even more running your autoformer...
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Not So !
This is form Hughes web site.
How Does it Work?
At first we are tempted to say very 'well'. But this may not be the answer you are looking for!
Autoformers are used in industries to stabilize voltage and lower the operating cost of equipment. The Autoformer has 5 windings: 2 primary and 3 secondary. All models have surge and spike protection. When the unit is in Automatic and the park or input voltage is 116 volts or below, the output is 10% over the input. When the input is over 118 volts, the output is 2% over the input.
The Autoformer DOES NOT take power from the park.
It does not affect the park or input voltage, or make electricity.
What it is doing is changing the voltage - amperage relationship, lowering the amperage and raising the voltage. Since appliances run better on higher voltage, lower amperage, less overall power is used from the park, and better service is enjoyed from your RV
An Autoformer running at full output (50amps) will use 1 amp, but will cause appliances to cycle more often and run cooler. This will use less total power from the park.
Enjoy Your Autoformer Knowing You Are Doing Your Part For The Environment.
__________________
2015 Jay Flight 23 RB
2014 Silverado LT 1500 with a 5.3 V8 Ecotec3
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09-12-2014, 03:01 PM
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#43
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Site Team
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: DeWitt, MI
Posts: 1,212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hitch Pin
Not So !
This is form Hughes web site.
How Does it Work?
At first we are tempted to say very 'well'. But this may not be the answer you are looking for!
Autoformers are used in industries to stabilize voltage and lower the operating cost of equipment. The Autoformer has 5 windings: 2 primary and 3 secondary. All models have surge and spike protection. When the unit is in Automatic and the park or input voltage is 116 volts or below, the output is 10% over the input. When the input is over 118 volts, the output is 2% over the input.
The Autoformer DOES NOT take power from the park.
It does not affect the park or input voltage, or make electricity.
What it is doing is changing the voltage - amperage relationship, lowering the amperage and raising the voltage. Since appliances run better on higher voltage, lower amperage, less overall power is used from the park, and better service is enjoyed from your RV
An Autoformer running at full output (50amps) will use 1 amp, but will cause appliances to cycle more often and run cooler. This will use less total power from the park.
Enjoy Your Autoformer Knowing You Are Doing Your Part For The Environment.
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The autoformer looks like a much better option for the money.
__________________
MODERATOR
2007 Jayco Feather 19H
2008 Ford Explorer SportTrac
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09-12-2014, 03:58 PM
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#44
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Brandon, FL
Posts: 348
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I like mine. I do not pop circuit breakers as much as I used to.
__________________
Ken Smith
2016 Heritage Glen 272RLIS
2017 Dodge Ram 2500 6.7 CTD
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09-12-2014, 05:01 PM
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#45
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Michigan
Posts: 9,424
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hitch Pin
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Never knew the product existed for RV use, interesting read.
Bob
__________________
2016 GM 2500HD 6.0L/4.10
2018 Jay Flight 24RBS
2002 GM 2500HD 6.0L/4:10 (retired)
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Reese HP Dual Cam (Strait-Line)
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09-12-2014, 06:42 PM
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#46
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: NY Southern Tier
Posts: 105
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So it appears it does everything an EMS does, except protect against high voltage. Does it shut down if voltage goes above 132v and also check for open ground and other faults?
The surge protection is significantly less than the Progressive EMS.
Autoformer - 733 joules, 4500 amps
PI EMS - 1790 joules, 44,000 amps
__________________
2015 Chevy Silverado 2500HD LT 6.0L 4.10
2015 Jayco White Hawk 24RKS
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09-12-2014, 08:49 PM
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#47
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Southern Ohio
Posts: 463
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RVer-Bill
So it appears it does everything an EMS does, except protect against high voltage. Does it shut down if voltage goes above 132v and also check for open ground and other faults?
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Yes to all of the above. When I talked to the people at Hughes they said that it does all of that, this unit has a surge and spike Protector built in, if there is a open ground or other faults the amber light will not come on and will not allow any out put to your rv.
Watch the video https://hughesautoformers.com/
__________________
2015 Jay Flight 23 RB
2014 Silverado LT 1500 with a 5.3 V8 Ecotec3
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09-16-2014, 09:53 AM
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#48
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Camlachie
Posts: 146
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Quote:
Originally Posted by us71na
I guess I'm just skeptical. If I am hooked up to a 120 volts source, that consists of a neutral and one side of the 220, How do I get 220 in my 120 volt system? I could understand it if the other side of the 220 came in contact with the neutral, but electrically I don't see how losing the neutral has any effect except losing power to the system. Can someone explain this?
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I have to agree, the only way a 120V 30A supply to an RV could receive 220V is if the neutral was to short against the other live phase of a 220v supply. This would be almost impossible, an open neutral would cause an outage not an overvoltage.
__________________
Ron (Augie)
2015 Pinnacle 38FLSA
2013 Ram Laramie 3500 (Dually)
Curt Q20 hitch
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09-16-2014, 01:13 PM
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#49
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 1,174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nbhybrid
the thing is you were bringing the campground voltage down even more running your autoformer...
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False.
There has been much good information on this thread. It is also inundated with misunderstood concepts.
1. EMS and autoformer perform different functions. They are not interchangeable.
2. EMS is for protection. Autoformer is for voltage boost.
3. Neither device has a negative impact on the park.
I use both devices when conditions dictate it.
__________________
Chuck - Sparta, TN
2012 Jay Flight 22FB, 2 x Honda EU2000i
2013 GMC Yukon XL Denali AWD
EDUCATION is what you get when you read the fine print.....
EXPERIENCE is what you get when you don't.
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09-16-2014, 01:16 PM
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#50
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Lost in the Woods
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Woodstock
Posts: 1,128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnchuck100
False.
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your opinion
http://www.damouth.org/RVStuff/Autoform.shtml
You will draw more amps as the autoformer ramps up the voltage therefor lowering the voltage to the people around you
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09-16-2014, 01:18 PM
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#51
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Senior Member
Join Date: May 2014
Location: VA
Posts: 394
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raugustin
I have to agree, the only way a 120V 30A supply to an RV could receive 220V is if the neutral was to short against the other live phase of a 220v supply. This would be almost impossible, an open neutral would cause an outage not an overvoltage.
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While the circuit you're plugged in to is 120 volt, the campground most likely has a 240 volt feed just like your house. When you lose the neutral the load becaomes unbalanced. One of the 120 volt legs may have low voltage, while the other leg can have over voltage.
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2005 Dodge Ram 1500 Quad Cab 5.7 HEMI
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09-16-2014, 01:26 PM
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#52
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 1,174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raugustin
I have to agree, the only way a 120V 30A supply to an RV could receive 220V is if the neutral was to short against the other live phase of a 220v supply. This would be almost impossible, an open neutral would cause an outage not an overvoltage.
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This may be a little difficult to understand unless you are a qualified electrician.
Consider you have 220 V distribution throughout the park. Half of the 30 amp recepticals are one leg of the neutral/hot and the other half will be on the other leg. If you have a poor neutral connection at the transformer one leg will get an increase in voltage. The other leg will have a decrease in voltage by the same amount. The amount of change is dependent on the load presented on each leg.
__________________
Chuck - Sparta, TN
2012 Jay Flight 22FB, 2 x Honda EU2000i
2013 GMC Yukon XL Denali AWD
EDUCATION is what you get when you read the fine print.....
EXPERIENCE is what you get when you don't.
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09-16-2014, 01:29 PM
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#53
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 1,174
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nbhybrid
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If you split hairs,yes. Theoretically yes. In the real world the effect is negligible. For all intents and purposes insignificant.
__________________
Chuck - Sparta, TN
2012 Jay Flight 22FB, 2 x Honda EU2000i
2013 GMC Yukon XL Denali AWD
EDUCATION is what you get when you read the fine print.....
EXPERIENCE is what you get when you don't.
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09-16-2014, 01:34 PM
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#54
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Lost in the Woods
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Woodstock
Posts: 1,128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnchuck100
If you split hairs,yes. Theoretically yes. In the real world the effect is negligible. For all intents and purposes insignificant.
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perhaps, but you don't know how insignificant it would be. In a low voltage situation where ems systems are shutting down any extra draw on the system by an autoformer is significant.
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09-16-2014, 01:41 PM
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#55
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 1,174
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nbhybrid, you have been posting information without a sufficient understanding of real world electrical characteristics. I am speaking of real world application. Not mathematical theory.
It WILL NOT take a measurable amount of power from others. Fractions of a volt.....MAYBE.
__________________
Chuck - Sparta, TN
2012 Jay Flight 22FB, 2 x Honda EU2000i
2013 GMC Yukon XL Denali AWD
EDUCATION is what you get when you read the fine print.....
EXPERIENCE is what you get when you don't.
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09-16-2014, 02:27 PM
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#56
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Lost in the Woods
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Woodstock
Posts: 1,128
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I apologize to the group. I was unaware I was arguing
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09-16-2014, 03:55 PM
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#57
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Camlachie
Posts: 146
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnchuck100
If you split hairs,yes. Theoretically yes. In the real world the effect is negligible. For all intents and purposes insignificant.
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thanks tnchuck and Howie,
yes you are both correct....an open neutral will result in a series circuit with the resulting voltage drops being based on the connected loads from the open neutral to each the line. This being said, the only way you can deliver 240V to either side is by shorting the ungrounded side of the open neutral to the other 120v line. An open neutral will damage equipment and is the number one cause of electrocutions.
Regards,
Ron
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Ron (Augie)
2015 Pinnacle 38FLSA
2013 Ram Laramie 3500 (Dually)
Curt Q20 hitch
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09-16-2014, 04:48 PM
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#58
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Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Reno (home base) Winter Eloy, AZ
Posts: 988
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Our EMS PI 50amp portable has protected us well over the years.
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09-16-2014, 06:05 PM
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#59
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: NY Southern Tier
Posts: 105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hitch Pin
Yes to all of the above. When I talked to the people at Hughes they said that it does all of that, this unit has a surge and spike Protector built in, if there is a open ground or other faults the amber light will not come on and will not allow any out put to your rv.
Watch the video https://hughesautoformers.com/
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This was in response to my question if the autoformer does everything an EMS does. I just downloaded the autoformer user guide and it appears that the autoformer does not. The manual says that if the voltage drops below 90v the autoformer goes into bypass mode. It does not shut down. Even though it does have some surge protection, it will not shut down at high voltage. An EMS will shut down above 132v and has a higher level of surge protection. Perhaps Hughes has added these featurers, but I haven't seen it. I guess that's why some people use an EMS after the autoformer.
__________________
2015 Chevy Silverado 2500HD LT 6.0L 4.10
2015 Jayco White Hawk 24RKS
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09-16-2014, 09:01 PM
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#60
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Southern Ohio
Posts: 463
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nbhybrid
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I checked out the site above, I must say that I don't agree with all that it says.
An Autoformer running at full output (50amps) will use 1 amp, but will cause appliances to cycle more often and run cooler. This will use less total power from the park.
So if you have a 30 amp Autoformer running at full output it would be less than a 1 amp draw on the parks power.
__________________
2015 Jay Flight 23 RB
2014 Silverado LT 1500 with a 5.3 V8 Ecotec3
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