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Old 03-27-2015, 05:47 AM   #11
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I'd suggest you pop over to the Ford forum and talk to people towing with your ford. Know the numbers of your truck. I got mixed opinion here on our Tundra some said not enough truck others said its fine, others said I was flirting with the line. The people pulling with Tundra's we able to tell me what they are towing with, how its going and give me tips for our TV.
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Old 03-27-2015, 09:53 AM   #12
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I am towing an Eagle 284BHBE (slightly heavier with same design and similar tongue weight) with a 2010 F150 with a Maxtow package. As you observed, it is not that hard to keep the trailer under the gvwr of the trailer and remain under the rated tow capacity of your truck. Your limiting factor will be your payload.


My trailer's posted dry weight is 6600 with a dry tongue weight of 630 lbs. Delivered according to the sticker on the door is 7200 lbs due to some added options, propane tanks and batteries and the tongue weight dry is 850lbs.


My F150 has a Maxtow package which increases the payload to 1650 lbs and increases the towing capacity to 11,100 lbs over the base model. In 2010, there was also an HD payload package that I wished I had ordered to increase my payload to approximately 2200 lbs so I would be able to carry some additional items. I put only lightweight items in the box of the truck and do not carry large amounts of water so I remain well under my tow capacity and remain within my payload capacity but the payload is close and I cannot load everything I would like to in my truck. I also invested in Propride WD anti-sway hitch which I believe is one of the best available for preventing sway.


When you say 500 lbs of passengers, I presume "the truck" that you have or are planning on purchasing is a Crewcab and these normally have between 1300-1500 lbs of payload depending on options and configuration. If your payload is on the light end, you will likely be overweight no matter how you pack. If you are on the higher end of payload, you will be very close and the only way to get the real picture is to go to a CAT scale, although this may be impossible before the truck or trailer are purchased and going to the CAT scale after the fact may be too late.

Try to ignore the repeated "gotta have a 250/2500" for anything more than a lightweight garden trailer comments, otherwise you put your family and everybody else on the road in danger even if you are well under your half-ton's rated capacities. Remember even if you are 120 lbs over you payload on a 5500 lb truck, that is only 2% over the rated payload of the truck. Despite what many of the barstool lawyers on this forum have said about cancelled insurance or denied insurance claims, I defy someone to provide an actual case where this has occurred. There are many cases where someone is grossly overweight and therefore negligent. Is your dealer/manufacturer going to rely on the 2% overweight to deny your claim ? They might but if you are able to show that whatever failed part was not related to the 2% over weight the dealer/manufacturer would not be successful. If you are towing a lot and in the mountains then the extra torque (800 +) of the big diesels in the 250/2500's might be well worth the additional cost over the currently available torque (300-400) in half tons. Recent head to head tests have shown that the gas motors that are optional in 250/2500 will not climb hills when towing any better than the eco-boosts in Ford half-tons.

The 150's/1500's of today are a completely different machine those of 10 to 15 years ago and are payload and tow capacity rated to safely tow more than older 3/4 tons when properly configured. If you have not yet purchased the truck, look into getting an HD Payload package which is more difficult to find used. I have been drooling over the 2015 F150s which have approximately 3000 to 3300 lbs of payload with an HD Payload. That doesn't mean I would be comfortable carrying the full 3000 lbs, but I would be more comfortable carrying 2000 to 2500 lbs, which my current truck is not capable of. Sorry for the long winded explanation, but your question doesn't permit a simple yes or no answer.
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Old 03-27-2015, 10:53 AM   #13
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increases the towing capacity to 11,100 lbs over the base model.
That sounds like a lot. What was the towing capacity of the base model?
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Old 03-27-2015, 11:46 AM   #14
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I'm doing it with a GMC, and I have many posts in this forum about this combination. It can do it, but I'm over on payload, and I won't say it does a "good" job. Adequate? Yes. Safe? I believe so. Good? No.

A lot of it has to do with your comfort level and your intended usage. If you've always towed heavy and have experience, then you understand what to expect and how it should feel, you may be just fine. If you only tow on flat level terrain, and for short journeys and you watch how you're loaded and are meticulous about adjustments and setup, that helps too.

On the other hand, if you're like me and you've towed a lot, but never something this big and heavy (when I started) then you don't have an accurate expectation of what it feels like to be maxed out. As has been said on this forum before, (and I can attest to it first hand) just because the numbers work, doesn't mean it's right for you.

I'm in the market for a new truck because for MY situation, I'm not comfortable. Yours may be completely different. IMHO, I want a 3/4 T truck for that trailer, and am actually shopping for my new truck now.
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Old 04-02-2015, 09:57 AM   #15
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That sounds like a lot. What was the towing capacity of the base model?
That would be a worthwhile option but the ride might be a little stiff Meant to say "increases the towing capacity to 11,100 lbs which is approximately 1300 lbs over the base model.
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Old 04-02-2015, 10:47 AM   #16
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That TT is 1770 lbs heavier (dry) that my 26BH and I hated the way my 2007 1500 towed that weight....the 5.3 and 4 speed transmission just didn't seem up to the task. You can probably do it with a 1500 but it's going to be a two handed (some times death grip) driving experience from underwhelming control. From someone who made the transition from a 1500 to a 2500, you can ignore what I say but I wouldn't want to pull that much weight even with a modern 1500...your are just pushing the limits of that truck.
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Old 04-02-2015, 11:14 AM   #17
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that is only 2% over the rated payload of the truck. Despite what many of the barstool lawyers on this forum have said about cancelled insurance or denied insurance claims, I defy someone to provide an actual case where this has occurred.
I assume you are in Canada? If so, I realize that Canadian's aren't nearly as litigation happy as American's are. In the US, everyone sues everyone for the stupidest things. It gives the lawyers something to do I guess. I bet a full 3rd of our TV commercials are for injury accident lawyers and medical malpractice.

Here's the thing. In the US, most civil suits are settled out of court. That said, settlements are private so there isn't any way to show these cases.

If you are in the US, and heaven forbid you are involved in an accident that results in injury or death, and it is learned that you chose to tow overweight, you will be sued. No doubt about it. The ambulance chasers are very good at investigating these things and signing up new clients. Will your insurance cover you? Sure. Then they will drop you like a hot potato and put you on a black list.

Something similar happened to someone I work with, not a towing issue, but with a trampoline in the year. He called almost 10 insurance companies and all denied him a homeowners policy. All because the first company he called did a site inspection and saw the trampoline. Then every other company knew about it within days. He finally got a homeowners policy when one company told him they'll write it up if he removed the trampoline and they could inspect after the fact. That's how it works here.

I'm not saying this is right. It's not. But because it is what it is, why would anyone take a chance on towing overweight? A lawsuit would devastate most people. So no, I am not a lawyer, not even a "bar stool lawyer". But it doesn't take a lawyer to understand this.

I'm betting Can-Am RV isn't willing to accept liability on overweight rigs they send out the door.

I will never tell anyone that it's OK to be over your capacity. And from personal experience I can tell you that even being close to your ratings is not nearly as comfortable of a towing experience as being well under your margins. To quote Bob, towing close to ratings, "Adequate? Yes. Safe? I believe so. Good? No."
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Old 04-04-2015, 06:49 AM   #18
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Are you talking about a Ram 1500 or a Chevy 1500?
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Old 04-14-2015, 11:19 AM   #19
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That TT is 1770 lbs heavier (dry) that my 26BH and I hated the way my 2007 1500 towed that weight....the 5.3 and 4 speed transmission just didn't seem up to the task. You can probably do it with a 1500 but it's going to be a two handed (some times death grip) driving experience from underwhelming control. From someone who made the transition from a 1500 to a 2500, you can ignore what I say but I wouldn't want to pull that much weight even with a modern 1500...your are just pushing the limits of that truck.
I have towed with a 2005 Chev 1500 with aftermarket trailer brakes etc. and I can assure you it is nothing like towing with a 2010 F150 Supercrew long box with a Max Tow Package and a 5.4 and 3.73 rear end. Pulling a 28BHBE on a weekly basis last summer with a proper hitch (Propride 3P) at no time resulted in a two handed deathgrip. I have driven many miles with father's 2009 -2500HD Duramax and while the extra torque is necessary for some trailers and would be nice for a 6000 lb trailer, it is not necessary for safety or stability.

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I assume you are in Canada? If so, I realize that Canadian's aren't nearly as litigation happy as American's are. In the US, everyone sues everyone for the stupidest things. It gives the lawyers something to do I guess. I bet a full 3rd of our TV commercials are for injury accident lawyers and medical malpractice.

If you are in the US, and heaven forbid you are involved in an accident that results in injury or death, and it is learned that you chose to tow overweight, you will be sued. No doubt about it. The ambulance chasers are very good at investigating these things and signing up new clients. Will your insurance cover you? Sure. Then they will drop you like a hot potato and put you on a black list.

I will never tell anyone that it's OK to be over your capacity. And from personal experience I can tell you that even being close to your ratings is not nearly as comfortable of a towing experience as being well under your margins. To quote Bob, towing close to ratings, "Adequate? Yes. Safe? I believe so. Good? No."

Doc, while normally I would ignore you comments, I do not want others to be mislead by your complete lack of understanding of the legal systems of both Canada and the U.S. Lawsuits in Canada are usually governed by the province where the accident occurred. In Ontario, billboard and TV advertising is just starting in Ontario and is not as prevalent as Wisconsin, New York, Nevada or many other U.S. states, but I can assure you that for accidents involving serious injury, you are just as likely to be sued in Ontario as any other state, regardless of whether you are towing over capacity, under capacity or not towing at all. Being sued often has nothing to do with fault or negligence, being sued successfully has everything to do with fault and negligence. In order for an injured party to successfully sue based on somebody towing at 2% over payload capacity they would have to convince a judge that being 2% over payload capacity materially contributed to the accident and the injuries in question. Put another way, is the injured party able to show on the balance of probabilities, more likely than not, that the accident would not have occurred had the tow vehicle been towing within legal limits ?

Somebody who is A) towing at 60 to 70 % capacity for length and weight and 2% over on their payload and travelling at 50 mph in the right lane with a properly equipped 2015 F150/1500 is far less likely to be sued than B) an F250/F350 at 90% capacity across the board travelling at 75 mph because that is the posted speed limit and the 800 ft/ft lbs of his 6.7PS allows him to whip out and pass at will. Compliance with legal limits does not equate to safety and lack of fault or non-negligence. A) is far less likely to be involved in an accident in the first place or have to worry about his/her insurance coverage. I will take my many years of actual courtroom experience over barstool legal advice any day of the week.

I was not suggesting that it was okay to tow overweight and you are taking one towing criteria, of many, completely out of context. Provided the OP loads conservatively without full tanks, he will likely be under 70 to 75% of his towing capacity. The posted weight of a Jayflight 28BHBE is 6135lbs and a battery and propane tanks might add a couple of hundred pounds for 6335 lbs and the OP does not say there were any added options so this trailer could be camp ready at under 7000lbs with a 12% tongue weight of less than 850lbs. He also does not say that he will be full-timing or towing constantly through the mountains which might also make the extra torque in the diesels a must have. The suggestion that a 2500/F250 is "necessary" to pull the trailer and that a properly equipped modern half-ton is not safe or comfortable to pull this trailer is based on lack of knowledge. They say ignorance is bliss, but not when it is offered as guidance to others.

If the OP had said he was pulling a 12,500 lb dry trailer with a half-ton, I would readily agree that it was too much trailer and even unsafe for the TV, however that is not the case. At the end of the day, it is important to consider the capabilities or ratings of a particular truck and make an informed decision whether the TV actually has the options necessary to be capable for the job or whether his particular application justifies the additional cost of an F250/2500.

Based on my recent review of Ford's tow ratings the advertised ratings usually contain in the small print that the trucks are equipped with tow packages and/or payload packages. An F-150 with a max-tow and HD payload package does not handle the same empty (harsher ride) or towing as a base model F-150 but that is a trade-off I am willing to accept. All of the truck manufacturers advertise their maximum towing capacities in the same commercial as their EPA MPG's although the trucks that have the max tow capacities are not equipped the same as the truck with the advertised MPG.
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Old 04-14-2015, 12:42 PM   #20
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Torque and ratio mean alot. Go with a lower geared ratio if possible. Get a truck with some torque to it. Yeah..you can get a diesel w/800 lb.ft. of torque, but you'll pay for it in every way (cost of the vehicle, maintenance, etc.). There's alot of gas engines out there that can definately do the job. Mine has about 420ft.lb of torque (modified) and 400 hp. with a 3.73 locking rear and 19000lb. GCWR. I have no problem towing my 8700lb trailer (with cargo). It wouldn't hurt to have all the coolers either.(trans, p/s, engine oil)
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