Towing Problem with SUV

[azimuth551]

Hello,

I just got back from a nice camping week in Northern California. The issue I am having is with my tow vehicle. I am towing a Jayco X213 with a 2003 Chevy Tahoe with 120K on the od. The package struggled on the steep mountain roads and hitting grades of 7-12% taxed the Tahoe. It did make it and my Trani temp stayed below 220 when it was 45deg out side. But I saw RPM's in the 4k range and I assume that is almost maxing out the vehicle.
The trailer weighs roughly 4700# and I have the Tahoe 4x4 with 5.3L and the 3.73 gears in the rear. I think I am going to have to get another vehicle due to all of our mountains but I do not know if just getting a truck if I will end up the same thing or to go all out and get the expensive diesel.
I need some good advice from seasoned campers that tow in the North West, you are aware of the grades that must be climbed. Thanks in advance for your input.

Brent

[drfife]

Sounds like you need a 6.0 ltr gasser or diesel if you plan to tow that terrain regularly.

[cablerum]

The 2003 Tahoe says it's rated to tow 7400 lbs. You are not even close to maxing out your weight. My friend has a 2007 Sierra with the 5.3 and tows a trailer much heavier then 4700 lbs with no issues. Maybe your engine is tired and not developing the power that it should.

I remember when a buddy and me had our boats which weighed about 8000 lbs on a trailer. He was towing them with a 2004 Ram 5.7 Hemi with 3 of us in the truck. We could gain speed going up hills, no shortage of power. A properly working 5.3 should handle 4700 lbs with ease.

Hopefully someone driving a 5.3 can chime in with their towing experience with that motor. The reason your rating is 7400 lbs is because your limited by the SUV chassis. A 1/2 ton pick-up with that same motor is rated to tow even higher loads. Its says the Sierra with the 5.3 can tow 8600 lbs.

I'm not sure that 4000 RPM climbing a steep hill is a big deal. I guess it depends on the feeling you were getting. Could you gain speed or did it feel like a struggle and you were not going to make it?

[Crackshot]

Do you have a way to switch off the OD? I know I have to tow our trailer with OD off.

[29BHS ECO]

azimuth-- Sounds like you truck shifted down to 2 nd gear which, under the circumstancs (grade & weight) it did what it had to do to keep going. As I have said before the weight is the weight, but the drag is the killer. I don't know if your tv needs a tuned up but that probably woudn't change anything. i guess you could buy a another tv, with more power, but if you don't hold up traffic sounds like your good to go. Larry

[Wyotraveler]

Many of the RVers in the east get by with the small engines. If you live in the west and pulling steep grades you need a larger engine. I find my 6.8L V10 is acceptable. My TT is light but I pull stock trailers and just yesterday was pulling a fertilizer spreader that weighed about 15K loaded, I might add, with no trailer brakes or lights because it is a farm trailer from Simplot. If I was going to get another vehicle, and no longer being able to get the V10 on a 3/4 ton truck, I would be looking at diesels. Although I have always preferred Ford, I would be looking at the Dodge diesel. I have heard Dodge Cummins is the only vehicle that passes EPA without the urea system on it.

[cablerum]

Keep in mind that it's not just power, but gearing is an important part. Chances are an 80hp farm tractor could pull a 400hp pick-up truck backwards. It's all in how it's geared and how the power gets to the ground. Your 5.3 SUV is probably geared higher then a 5.3 (or any other motor) pick-up truck. SUV's are primarily made to move people where as pick-ups are made to work. If you have a tow/haul mode you should use that. It will allow the motor to rev higher in between shifts and lock out the overdrive shifting. There are also mods you can do to get more power out of your 5.3 which would be cheaper then buying a new TV. But if you're able to maintain speed as mentioned above and your not redlining the engine I would not worry too much about it.

[azimuth551]

Thanks for the input. That is correct that the Tahoe will pull all day long with no problems on small grades to flat. I did tow in 3rd and I had the tow haul mode activated. It does change the shift points as it should. The truck runs excellent and I have always done the maintenance on it as well as add an after market tranni pan. A lot of the roads which were steep slow going, the truck went up them fine. But it is like it was almost bogging down at 2500rpm or going all the way to 3500 or 4000rpm. I guess that is going into a much lower gear. Tranni temp was climbing pretty good even though the temps were generally cool and I wonder what would happen in the dead of summer.

[exjay1]

put a tranny cooler on if it dosent have one already. Also, does the tow/haul mode eliminate the need to drop it in 3rd? My parents have an '03 tahoe 5.3 2wd and never really hauled anything too heavy with it but nice to know how it would handle these situations. I agree, gearing can be an issue but also look and other possible performance mods (chip/tuner, exhaust, tuneup etc) before going off and getting a bigger TV unless your in the market for one.

[Rustic Eagle]

Originally Posted by azimuth551

snip....... Tranni temp was climbing pretty good even though the temps were generally cool and I wonder what would happen in the dead of summer.

One other consideration that may contribute to elevated tranny temps is the condition of the tranny fluid. TV's that tow often in mountain regions may rerquire the fluid to be changed more often then a TV that tows primarily on the flats. So I have to believe throwing in 7% to 12% grades on a regular basis must add to the fluid degradation as well.

Just thinking out load

Bob

[Seann45]

Cheaper than a new truck change the rear end to 4:11 gears.. mileage will suffer a little but hey you are towing anyway.. if it is a 4x4 then make sure you change the front gears too..

[clutch]

You can change the final gear ratio somewhat by buying a size smaller set of tires for the TV. Keeping out of OD is the way to go and an auxillary transmission cooler would also be good. A lot of towing has to do with driver expectations. If a newer TV is in your future a bigger engine would help. "There is no replacement for displacement".

[clubhouse]

I have a 04 Tahoe 5.3L 3:73 w/ Factory Tow Package & Aux Trany Cooler. Although it isn't our primary TV we use is occasionally to tow our 26BH. Recently weighed ready to camp @ 6080lbs. The Tahoe isn't great but will certainly get up the Mts. On prolonged grades, specifically HWY 168 East of Fresno in the Sierra Natl Forrest, ~7% for about 9 miles...we have to drop to 2nd pull @ ~45mph 3300-3500 RPM. The Temps climb quickly, right to about 215-220 on warm days.

Remember you aren't just pulling your trailer, how full in the Tahoe. You get several adults and gear in the SUV too all together you are learning first hand the limitation of that particular TV.

FYI I have never seen prolonged 4K+ RPMs on my Tahoe.

[chopshop]

Originally Posted by Rustic Eagle

One other consideration that may contribute to elevated tranny temps is the condition of the tranny fluid. TV's that tow often in mountain regions may rerquire the fluid to be changed more often then a TV that tows primarily on the flats. So I have to believe throwing in 7% to 12% grades on a regular basis must add to the fluid degradation as well.

Just thinking out load

Bob

Good point, I think I will have mine changed out soon.

[azimuth551]

That is a good point on the gear change. And come to think of it, I do have bigger wheels on my Tahoe, they are 17" instead of the standard 16" So when I put the larger truck tires on them, that added a difference.
I wonder how easy it is to change out the gears and if it is worth it on a high milage SUV.
Clubhouse, thanks for chiming in on those details. Sounds like yours was very much the same as mine on the long steep grades. Do you have standard or aftermarket wheels? I was specifically climbing various grades on hwy 299 leaving from Nevada to the coast, its a nice road but very steep with hairpin turns and climbs to about 3000ft all slow speed. I had it in 2nd gear and it did okay but it was also 40 deg out side. Some of the grads coming back over and trying to avoid I-80, I was hitting the 4k rpm but I was also trying to maintain a speed.

[clubhouse]

I have standard OEM 16" wheels.

[McMonk]

When I drove across Canada my unit was loaded heavy and we struggled through the mountains as well. I have to admit that I simply decided that I really didn't need to actually reach the speed limit of 100 or 110kmh if the hills wouldn't allow it. I found that the Envoy and trailer did quite fine maintaining about 80kmh in 3rd. That was fine by me, even on the worst of the hills. To make sure I wasn't a hindrance for other drivers, often I'd just slide behind a semi-truck and follow him up the hill. Now...to be fair we didn't have the high outside temps that you had to deal with, but we managed.
I've actually just returned from major service on the envoy - dealer mentioned that the transmission fluid was "black" (probably an exaggeration). Had it flushed & serviced and should be good-to-go. Transmission cooler is a must, as well...

[rwilley]

Originally Posted by azimuth551

That is a good point on the gear change. And come to think of it, I do have bigger wheels on my Tahoe, they are 17" instead of the standard 16" So when I put the larger truck tires on them, that added a difference.
I wonder how easy it is to change out the gears and if it is worth it on a high milage SUV.
Clubhouse, thanks for chiming in on those details. Sounds like yours was very much the same as mine on the long steep grades. Do you have standard or aftermarket wheels? I was specifically climbing various grades on hwy 299 leaving from Nevada to the coast, its a nice road but very steep with hairpin turns and climbs to about 3000ft all slow speed. I had it in 2nd gear and it did okay but it was also 40 deg out side. Some of the grads coming back over and trying to avoid I-80, I was hitting the 4k rpm but I was also trying to maintain a speed.

I've travel the same roads and there are curves and steep grades, you cant get a good start to get up the hills. I have had 6.9, 7.3( non turboed diesels) and a V10 gas. these were great on the flat and small hills but when it came to the mountain driving they were all under powered. You need torque to tow up the steep grades. just my opinion.

[azimuth551]

Having black trani fluid can't be a good sign. You might be on your last miles with your transmission.
I am glad someone wrote in that has traveled the same roads and knows what I am talking about. Even with a V10, it still has limitations. I have decided on getting a Diesel truck, as my Tahoe already has 120K on it, its not worth modifying the gears because I still want to keep it and have a second vehicle to use and to use on those longer trips. Anything less than a diesel and I am just monkeying around. I also noticed coming back into the Reno area at the higher altitude I lost power, especially going up the mountains with a head wind--forget it!