Victron Battery Charger

DonBr · 09-11-2022, 02:11 PM

In another thread, a couple of us were discussing Victron chargers and lithium batteries, and I thought I would break it out into its own thread. I have their IP22 30A unit, but had not documented its operation until now. The manual says that they charge lithium at 14.0, and then absorption at 13.6. In actual use, it charges at full bulk until it reaches absorption voltage, which is 14.2, then holds that voltage. For testing, I used my inverter and the microwave to drive the batteries down to 93%, then turned the charger on (and the inverter off). Picture below documents the sequence. Conditions are heavy overcast and smoke, so the solar is only putting out about 4 amps, and there are a couple of amps of parasitic load, hence the slightly above 30A combined charge. Both the manual and Victron Connect app say that it will reach absorption voltage at about 95% of charge, but that is not what happened. The remaining thing to learn is what the batteries would have to drop to, in order for it to go into bulk again, although that could be easily triggered by power-cycling the charger.

Forester2 · 09-11-2022, 02:39 PM

Any reason for the Victron vs. Progressive Dynamics which Battleborn seems to recommend?

DonBr · 09-11-2022, 03:39 PM

Nicer package, bluetooth.

TomC_AZ · 09-11-2022, 11:57 PM

Don how many AHs/batteries do you have?

DonBr · 09-12-2022, 08:45 AM

2 @ 100AH each

Forester2 · 09-12-2022, 09:03 AM

If I recall, you both added inverters. Just wondered for what uses besides microwave.

01tundra · 09-12-2022, 09:10 AM

How long did you wait once the batteries reached 100% SOC? The charger won't immediately drop to float voltage. You want the charge voltage to stay at 14.2V for a little while once they hit 100% to top balance the cells.

Just because it says 100% SOC doesn't mean that they're fully charged, they were still taking in over 8A. What is you 100% charge voltage set on in the BMV?

The manual now states 14.2V Bulk / 13.5V Float for the Li setting.

https://www.victronenergy.com/upload...230-VAC-EN.pdf

TomC_AZ · 09-12-2022, 09:30 AM

Forester ours is mainly the Microwave and a hairdryer but also a small toaster oven that we carry as well since we dont have ovens. It works great for frozen pizzas, cookies or cinnamon rolls. Mine is also setup such that it can run my AC, I am limited on batteries but will run for about 2hr without totally depleting them. When any one of those big items is running nothing else 120v can be used as I am limited with the 2000w inverter but it sustains the AC just fine. I wanted a 3000w but well I got this for $340 couldnt pass it up.

DonBr · 09-12-2022, 09:36 AM

01tundra, the Victron manual is still behind when it comes to what they are actually doing. The bluetooth app tells you, and experience yesterday says it is correct, that absorption is 14.2 and there is no float. It pushes bulk until the 14.2 is hit, then stays there. The 14.2 is configurable in the app if you have a battery with some other recommended value.

DonBr · 09-12-2022, 09:38 AM

Microwave was main impetus for inverter, but it is useful for other reasons, when all outlets are connected. Coffee pot, Toaster, DirecTV Stream box, laptop plugged in, etc.

Forester2 · 09-12-2022, 10:00 AM

My 'gotta get list' keeps growing: soft start, heavier converter and now inverter. Wish bank account grew that fast. Heading to the big RV show in Hershey tomorrow; hope theres some good specials.

01tundra · 09-12-2022, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonBr

01tundra, the Victron manual is still behind when it comes to what they are actually doing. The bluetooth app tells you, and experience yesterday says it is correct, that absorption is 14.2 and there is no float. It pushes bulk until the 14.2 is hit, then stays there. The 14.2 is configurable in the app if you have a battery with some other recommended value.

Stays there, how long? Indication from the manual that if certain conditions existing, it could take 8 hrs to go into float, which seems long. But a majority of the converters I've worked with can take up to 4 hrs to go into float.

This is especially true if you're not using a Victron BMV that's networked with the charger. If that's the case, the charger can't look at battery conditions to adjust charge and has to rely on preprogrammed charge profiles.

My IP43 charger takes battery data directly from my BMV to adjust charge and determine which charge mode to be in based on battery conditions, but there's a statement in the manual that makes me believe that my charger could take up to 24 hrs to go into storage mode at 13.5V if it wasn't sensing the batteries.

TomC_AZ · 09-12-2022, 11:36 AM

Forester, there is always something else to buy :-)

I would bet the prices at the show is much higher, for example the inverter I got is currently $700 but I was able to get a Amazon return "like new" one for $340. Here is the next model up from what I have and it has a 50amp charger built in. (so it takes care of two of your concerns)
https://www.amazon.com/Xantrex-Freed...s%2C673&sr=8-7

They go for $892 but they have a returned one for $612.... so good chunck off. There are of course other models/mfg etc.. Just look at what you really want to do and then plan out what you want. Honestly what we need and wanted it for ours works really well and has never let us down. It would be really nice to have the 3000w version just so we can run other things at the same time, however at $1000 more... For now we will save the money and use it elsewhere, like for gas. The 2000w does everything we really need it for.

DonBr · 09-12-2022, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 01tundra

Stays there, how long?

May be indefinite. The IP22 is not a networked model, and in any case is the only Victron unit I have. It, like my solar charge controller, is blissfully unaware of anything else on the 12V system. As you can see below, the output is zero because the voltage is above the absorption value (caused by the solar controller being at 14.4V). The second shot, unchanged from default, shows that there is NO float voltage regardless of what the manual says.

TomC_AZ · 09-12-2022, 12:42 PM

Don, does that charger allow you to modify those charge rates in its settings like the solar controller does?

DonBr · 09-12-2022, 01:29 PM

Yes. Charge rate can be set to 7.5A, 15A, or 30A in lithium mode. Changing to user mode makes all numbers settable.

01tundra · 09-12-2022, 02:10 PM

Leave it alone for a few hours and see what happens.

DonBr · 09-12-2022, 04:03 PM

OK, at some point with no amp output it went to storage mode, which is listed as 13.5V but as you can see it is kept up by the Solar Controller. I put it under heavy load (microwave with inverter) and within 10 seconds it transitioned to bulk mode. Turned the inverter off and the voltage rose in about 15 seconds to 14.2, at which point it transitioned to absorption mode. I don't see anything to define how long it takes in absorption before it goes to storage when there's no output. Sunny today, so I've got about 12A from solar.

DonBr · 09-12-2022, 04:07 PM

I've mentioned elsewhere here that I'm powering the charger from the water heater circuit, and calculated that together with 30A charging I'm maxing out the 15A breaker. As a result I expect my regular operating procedure to use only 15A charging. If I'm on shore power that's 360AH per 24hrs, against very little usage (microwave and all other 120 would be powered from shore power). If I'm on generator it would be simple to turn the water off (or to propane) and set the charger to 30A to refill faster and cut generator time.

TomC_AZ · 09-12-2022, 04:49 PM

Not sure if you have tried it or have some way of monitoring how much it uses like a WATT meter or a watchdog surge suppressor etc.. I would bet you would be fine on the 15a braker and charging 30a. The reason for this is that the draw on the 120v side should be pretty low compared to the 12v 30a output side.

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