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Old 02-23-2013, 04:57 PM   #1
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Atwood DSI WH problem

I have the Atwood MPD 93756. It works just fine on shore power. Not so well on LPG.

Everything is is order, as far as I can tell. Problem is... the burner produces flame while the electronic igniter is sparking. Once the igniter finishes it's cycle, the pretty blue flame goes out. The gas supply is immediately cut when the igniter stops. Whatever it is that tells the gas valve to open and the igniter to spark is not talking to the gas valve after it tells the igniter to quit sparking.

I've bypassed the cutoff switch to determine that is not the problem. What do I need to look at next?
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Old 02-23-2013, 05:24 PM   #2
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Is there a thermocouple that the flame heats that tells the gas valve that the gas lit and is ok to keep the valve open?

Maybe the thermocouple is not located in the flame. They can easily be moved slightly to be in the right spot like bending wire.

I've also read where the TC gets corrosion on it and can be cleaned with scotch-brite.

Could be one of these possibilites.

Keep us posted,
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Old 02-23-2013, 05:43 PM   #3
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Thanks but no thermocouple on a DSI.
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Old 02-23-2013, 06:12 PM   #4
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Hmm,
you would think something has to sense flame is lit.
Is there an electrode? Maybe this is what people are cleaning with scotch-brite.

Sorry, not very much help here.

Someone else should chime in.

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Old 02-23-2013, 06:21 PM   #5
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There is an electrode at the end of the burner tube. This sparks when the switch is activated inside. The spec for the sparking cycle is "6 to 9 seconds" Once the sparking begins, the burner flame ignites instantly but the instant the electrode quits sparking, the burner flame goes out. Makes no sense at all.

My refrigerator and furnace also have auto ignition and they work just fine.
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Old 02-23-2013, 06:54 PM   #6
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http://bryantrv.com/docs2/docs/atwoodwaterheater.pdf

Sounds like the elctrode provides the spark and also has a built in flame sensor.

there's some other safety features in this troubleshooting guide. I am not familiar with them, but it may make sense to you with the unit in front of you.

I was reading the section for heaters with DSI.

Wish I could be of more help.

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Old 02-23-2013, 07:25 PM   #7
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Thank you Doug. That was a lot of help.

Your comments on the flame sensor and the scothbrite pad made me understand something that didn't register before. I'll check out the electrode more closely tomorrow. Maybe it's too crusty to sense the flame.

I'll let you know how it goes.
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Old 02-23-2013, 07:35 PM   #8
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Wil,
I believe that is what some people have experienced.
The flame sensor can get oxidation on it acting like an insulator.

Hopefully you'll get it working.

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Doug
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Old 02-24-2013, 10:50 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by A32319 View Post
Thanks but no thermocouple on a DSI.
Something has to tell it the flame has gone out or the gas would continue to flow... I am sure this is where your problem is..
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Old 02-24-2013, 12:50 PM   #10
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Well, I cleaned the electrodes. They were not bad at all. No change in operation. Once the sparking quits, the flame quits and the thing goes into lockout mode. The lockout light on the control is doing what it's supposed to do.

Could be the flame sensor part of the electrode isn't working. Also could be the flame isn't running long enough to heat the sensor and override the lockout. The flame runs only 5.3 seconds while it's supposed to run 6-8 seconds. This is reflected by the lockout indicator light. You can time it by the flame or the lockout light. I suppose it could also be the continue-to-run side of the dual solenoid gas valve is bad or electrical signal to make it stay open.

I guess it will take me some time to sort it out. I hate to start throwing parts at it until I know what's wrong. It's probably not all that complicated for someone fluent in DSI... but that ain't me.
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Old 02-24-2013, 03:55 PM   #11
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Wil,
Wasn't there a section where once it goes into lock-out mode you have to go through a procedure to clear that?

Doug
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Old 02-24-2013, 04:56 PM   #12
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I had the same problem with my Atwood DSI WH. Replaced the ECO/Thermostat assembly, and that cured the problem. ECO stands for energy cut off, and both it and the new thermostat comes in a replacement kit that requires about 15 minutes to replace. I got mine on ebay for around $15 or so. You just need to know your Atwood model # to be sure you get the correct kit.
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Old 02-24-2013, 04:58 PM   #13
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I believe to get it out of lock out mode all you have to do is to turn the refrigerator off and then back on.

I had this exact issue recently. In my case, the end of the spark igniter was not in the flame enough. I bent it deeper into the flame by pressing gently on the sparker holder frame. Don't press on the sparker itself as it can easily break. If the end of your sparker is getting red hot (which mine was not) you could just try out a new sparker igniter and see if that fixes it.
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Old 02-24-2013, 05:33 PM   #14
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In the owner's manual it says, "If heater fails to operate due to high water temperature, a lockout condition occurs (indicator light on). After water cools, reset switch in OFF position for at least 30 seconds, then turn to ON position."

Otherwise, you just cycle the switch for another go at it.

When I switch it on, the lockout light is lit. All good there. Then the spark begins and the burner lights. While the burner is going, the lockout light is out. When the spark and burner quit, the lockout light comes back on.

I can hear the solenoid open for the initial start and then I hear it close when it quits. Not sure what a dual solenoid valve is supposed to do but you would think one part opens first for the initial start and then the second part is activated by the flame sensor. Funny thing is there are two hot wires to feed this dual solenoid gas valve but both wires originate at the same terminal on the ECO. switch. If one part of the dual solenoid valve is energized, the other part is also energized at the same time because they're both being fed by what is fundamentally the same wire.

This seems to indicate the flame sensor isn't feeling a flame so all power is cut to the gas valve. I wonder how this flame sensor is supposed to work? There's only one wire leading to this electrode/flame sensor assembly from the circuit board.

I've adjusted the electrode bracket to put the tips further into the flame but I'm pretty sure they're not getting red hot.

Will look for one of those ECO. kits.

Thanks.
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Old 02-24-2013, 08:28 PM   #15
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Sounds like you on the right track Wil.
Some good input.
Keep us posted.
I also found this troubleshooting list concerning the ground.

PROBLEM: Furnace comes on for 7-10 seconds then turns off
Possible Solution:
•Turn off power and gas to the furnace
•Remove flame sensor from its bracket. Lightly clean the surface with fine emery cloth and replace.
•The problem may also lie in a bad ground or the the black and white wires being reversed (reversed polarity) at the junction box or outlet powering the furnace.
•The electronic ignition control module must ensure current flow through the flame sensor to ground and if the polarity is reversed in the circuit there is no voltage potential and the flame sensor does not work and closes the gas valve.
•If the black and white wires are connected correctly and the flame still drops out, then the issue may be a bad ground. Using a volt-ohm meter, measure between the white wire and the ground wire to be sure you have no voltage.
•If this does not work, replace the flame sensor. See Replacing an Electronic Flame Sensor.

http://homerepair.about.com/od/heati...eplacement.htm


Best regards,
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Old 02-26-2013, 01:47 PM   #16
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I installed a new electrode assembly yesterday. No joy.

ECO/t'stat kit will be arriving soon.

Doug: I just saw your edit. There is only a single conductor feeding the flame sensor/electrode assembly. This comes from the circuit board.
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Old 02-26-2013, 02:04 PM   #17
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Wil,
I hope the ECO/t'stat kit does it for you.

After a few purchases, it will still be cheaper than dealer and we'll all learn something.

Keep us posted.

Best regards,
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Old 03-24-2013, 06:33 PM   #18
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The ECO/t'stat kit Atwood sent me was in the pile for a while. I installed it today. No change.
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Old 03-24-2013, 06:44 PM   #19
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Sorry to hear that Wil
Frustrating I am sure.
What are you thinking for a next step? Circuit board?

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Old 03-24-2013, 07:33 PM   #20
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I guess there's only two more things it can be. The circuit board or the dual solenoid valve. I'll see what the Atwood man thinks about it.
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