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Old 11-13-2012, 03:51 PM   #1
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Battery care over winter

I took the battery home for the winter and planned on keeping it in the garage on a trickle charger.
I purchased this from Harbor Freight http://www.harborfreight.com/automat...ger-42292.html
After reading the instructions I'm told to prevent battery damage don't use if my battery is a gel lead acid battery or AGM. I'm also told not to connect it if the voltage is less than 12 volts. Turns out I don't know exactly what I'm doing
1) I can't really tell if I have one of those batteries (it's not written anywhere on the battery so I'm thinking no)
2) I don't know if the voltage is less than 12 volts (I took it home off a full charge about 1 month ago) Do I use a multimeter or a voltmeter to find this out? Is it easy? Could you recommend one if it's necessary?
3) Is the trickle/float charger I purchased acceptable? Do you have other recommendations?

That's about it I'm sure that should do for one of the experts out there. A basic guide to caring for my battery through the winter would be great.

I thought this would have been much easier... could be me though, I tend to make things more difficult

Thanks again for everyone's help on here. You've really helped make my first year a success.
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Old 11-13-2012, 04:20 PM   #2
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If your battery is the one that the dealer provided with the TT, I would doubt that it is a AGM or gel lead acid. An easy way to tell, are there caps that can be removed on the top to add distilled water? Typically there are 2 rectangual caps when removed show 6 holes. If you have that then it most likely is a traditional wet (flooded) cell battery.

Secondly, you can use a multi-meter to check the battery charge. But even beter is a battery hydrometer.

Not sure if the harbor freight float charger you has is acceptable...I use the Battery Tender Plus.

If by chance you do have a gel cell, Battery Tender also as a Battery Tender Plus GEL product that would work for you.

Also, FWIW I keep my batteries on the Tender when ever not in use...it isn't just a winter time thing for me. And, if you do find you have a wet cell battery, you need to keep the fluid levels up. Typically I check every couple months and add ONLY distilled water when required....not Tap Water.

I am sure others will be by with more information. Good Luck.
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Old 11-13-2012, 04:22 PM   #3
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I doubt that your battery is an AGM or a gel. A multimeter or a voltmeter would work to find out. Yes it is easy. I have a "battery tender" that I use over the winter. I use the camper batteries as a back up for my pellet stove. I would think the one you bought would work. If you have anything that you could connect to your battery to drain it. Then you would know that it was below 12 volts. If nothing has been draining it, it may be at or above 12 volts now.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:31 PM   #4
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Personally, I would return the Harbor Freight battery charger. I do not know the one you have, however what I have heard and read, they are known not to be good for extended use, as the will boil the battery. I bought mine (do not recall the brand) from Fleet Farm, after talking with a few people. A neighbor has a few of the exact same ones, which he has on each motorcycle all winter, with no issues.

I charge mine up, then disconnect the battery maintainer. Every few months I recharge, which takes about 24hrs.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:36 PM   #5
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This is what works for me, and I leave connected all winter: http://batteryminders.com/details.php?prod=12117

Bob
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Old 11-14-2012, 08:54 AM   #6
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Thanks everyone. I really appreciate the responses.
Rustic Eagle,
I like that. I don't understand how it hooks to the battery though. Would I need the battery condition indicator for that?
or this http://www.amazon.com/Battery-Tender...gy_auto_text_y
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:48 AM   #7
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Russell,

The BatteryMINDer comes with (1) 2’ Battery Clip Cord Set with Quick Connector and (1) 2’ Fused Ring Terminal Cord Set with Quick Connector, no need to purchase anything else. Look down the web page under "Included Accessories". You can see what they look like by checking out page 10 of the instruction manual (pdf file): http://batteryminders.com/forms/manuals/plus_models.pdf

Also, the Battery Condition Indicator and Digital Multi-Meter are free gifts.., you get to choose one of them depending which BatteryMINDer is purchased. Run your 'cursor' over the Battery Condition Indicator on the web page it explains.

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Old 11-14-2012, 01:21 PM   #8
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I use the Battery Tender on all my batteries. Never had an issue with it. One thing I've read is that whichever charger you use, don't place it higher than the battery. Apparently that makes it easier to overcharge or something. I just sit mine on the workbench in my garage and plug it in. It's basically level with the battery.
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Old 11-14-2012, 02:06 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueHaul View Post
snip......One thing I've read is that whichever charger you use, don't place it higher than the battery. Apparently that makes it easier to overcharge or something.....snip
Interesting, I never heard that before.

I do know that it is not recommended to place a charger "directly above" the battery to avoid gases from the battery corroding the charger.

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Old 11-14-2012, 02:08 PM   #10
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I`ve also heard to never store a battery on concrete, that it will drain it. Any truth to that one?
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Old 11-14-2012, 02:21 PM   #11
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Concrete floor..., I remember hearing that a lot back in the early 70's when I worked at a full service gas station...., haven't heard it as often today.... but the station floors were pretty dirty back then! Any truth to it, I haven't the slightest idea.
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Old 11-14-2012, 02:29 PM   #12
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Yep its just hearsay with me as well, but I`ve never stored one on concrete floor just because............
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Old 11-14-2012, 04:19 PM   #13
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Concrete floor.....here's where I think this advice comes from. All rechargeable battery types will self discharge slightly faster when exposed to very cold temperatures. Some types more than others. In the winter here in the snow belt the concrete floors are quite cold, and the battery sitting directly on this will be more cold than if it's sitting on a block of wood. So, the advantage is small, and if the battery is on a float charger (battery tender) that would be more than enough to overcome the risk of cold exposure discharge while sitting on concrete over the 4 or 5 months of winter. Myself, I place mine on a wood block over the concrete floor, just for good measure.
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Old 11-14-2012, 05:32 PM   #14
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Feel free to laugh at me here - I found out where I read about not putting the Battery Tender higher than the battery - it was in the instruction manual! :hihi:

Can't believe I actually read that! But here's the link to the pdf on Deltran's site, and here's the clip I was talking about:

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Old 11-14-2012, 08:14 PM   #15
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BlueHaul. That is funny. I do not think I ever charge with the charger NOT higher than the battery. In my model T there is no way I could place the charger at the same level or below, unless the battery came out which is a pain in the rump. As for the TT batteries, I just charged them as usual. I placed the batteries on a sheet of plywood on the shop floor in their corner and placed the charger on the work bench (wood) that is right next to them.

I guess I broke all the rules.

Here is the rumor I have heard about storing your batteries on the concrete floor. It is from the teens through the 40’s, that the moisture from sitting on a moist floor would create an electrical conductivity path on the lower quality boxes, which allowed the batteries to discharge. No proof to the rumor, but is sounds reasonable.
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Old 11-14-2012, 08:24 PM   #16
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Feel free to laugh at me here - I found out where I read about not putting the Battery Tender higher than the battery - it was in the instruction manual!....snip
Nope, no one was laughing...., I just never heard that placing a charger "higher" than the battery could possibly overcharge the battery.

Looking further into the subject matter, what I found interesting is that your charger instruction manual uses the term "above", and my BatteryMINDer manual uses the term "directly above" when referencing improper charger location. The term "directly above" is pretty specific in location, but the term "above" is somewhat open for interpretation.

From my BatteryMINDer instruction manual: "Never place charger directly above battery being charged; gases from battery will corrode and damage charger".

Bob
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Old 11-14-2012, 08:46 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jagiven View Post
Here is the rumor I have heard about storing your batteries on the concrete floor. It is from the teens through the 40’s, that the moisture from sitting on a moist floor would create an electrical conductivity path on the lower quality boxes, which allowed the batteries to discharge. No proof to the rumor, but is sounds reasonable.
That is another explanation I have heard, which may apply to that era. In those days, I believe the battery case was made with a material called Bakelite (plastic didn't exist). It was a little prone to being brittle and a tendency to develop some cracks. Cracks in the wrong places would of course allow the acid to leak out, or moisture to get in, depending on where the crack was. In recent decades the cases are made of plastic and of course much better mechanical integrity.
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:05 PM   #18
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I looked up this rumour on Snopes.com - a source of info on all sorts of rumored truths. It turns out that yes, old time battery cases were made of a rubber that allowed acid to seep out and cause a circuit that led to discharge.

As well, automotive batteries discharge LESS when kept cold.

The link is below.

http://www.snopes.com/autos/techno/battery.asp
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Old 11-14-2012, 10:46 PM   #19
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Here's what Wikipedia has to say about cold storage of batteries in general.....
=======
"Extending battery life
Battery life can be extended by storing the batteries at a low temperature, as in a refrigerator or freezer, which slows the chemical reactions in the battery. Such storage can extend the life of alkaline batteries by about 5%; rechargeable batteries can hold their charge much longer, depending upon type.[66] To reach their maximum voltage, batteries must be returned to room temperature; discharging an alkaline battery at 250 mA at 0°C is only half as efficient as it is at 20°C.[36] Alkaline battery manufacturers such as Duracell do not recommend refrigerating batteries.[35]"
=======
In my earlier post, I was confusing battery capacity when cold (various degrees of poor), with ability to maintain the cell voltage when cold. I would guess Duracell does not recommend cold storage for a reason.
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Old 11-15-2012, 10:17 AM   #20
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From my BatteryMINDer instruction manual: "Never place charger directly above battery being charged; gases from battery will corrode and damage charger".
That makes perfect sense to me! Call me crazy but if I blow the dust off that part of my brain I seem to remember my high school electronics shop teacher saying something about electricity flowing through wire is like water flowing through a hose - it flows easier downhill. I'll have to do some research on that one and report back what I find!
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