H2O froze at dealer during repairs whose fault?

[Destrtman]

Greetings all;
We have a 2018 Seismic 4116 that we bought new on June 21, 2019. On our way home from Mississippi we were involved in a hit and run with a semi truck at a truck stop in Texas.

When we got home to NM we found a new Jayco dealer in El Paso Tx 180 miles away that could repair it. They had the trailer for a week working on an estimate in July. With $25000.00+ in damage estimated, and a scheduled appointment first week in September for the repairs.

All of the parts were ordered and were in by the end of August. The repairs were to take 2 to 3 weeks.

When we delivered the trailer to the dealer all six holding tanks were empty. The trailer was empty as well, but it still had the new (3 - 31 MH) batteries, and the gasoline tanks were around half full. It had not been winterized yet either, all of the water lines and the hot water tank were full, as well as the water inlets for the black tank flush fittings, and the water control panel.

In October we were informed that the repairs would be taking longer than expected, and that more parts were ordered?. I informed them that the unit had not been winterized yet and at least could they drain the water heater and blow out the water lines and refrigerator. And yes I knew it would cost me to do it.

Fast forward to now January 27, 2020. I had a call from the dealer that all of the repairs to the trailer were completed. How ever they found that the water lines had frozen and the whole system was leaking. They found leaks under all three sinks, and the water lines were supposedly swollen, the water heater had been damaged, and the water manifold has been broken as well. The batteries were completely dead, and they couldn't raise the leveling legs to move it out of their shop until they plugged it into shore power.
?????????
To fix the water lines and damage it should be under $5000.00 and the batteries about $1000.00.
?????????
Oh and by the way the trailer repairs ended up costing $3800.00 more than the quote so I need to pay the $1000.00 deductible plus the $3800.00. And did I want them to fix the water problem and the batteries problem?
????????
Now wait a minute whose problem is this? I am having trouble believing that this is my fault or my problem.

It's my fault and my problem for trusting them to do winterizing and not forgetting to tell the technician working on our Seismic.

[Lake Huron]

IMO, the added $3800 in repairs should have been addressed with the insurance company. Why should you be on the hook for that?
The frozen pipes and dead batteries are the dealers problem.
A. You called and told them.
2. If they dont have enough common sense in their heads to know your trailer has been there since August and something needs to be done with it , that's their problem. Which unfortunately is going to become more (of your) problem down the road because you know they are not going to fix it right. It's going to turn into some cobbled up half a$$ job.
Its hard to get good help these days.

[Grumpy]

Originally Posted by Destrtman

In October we were informed that the repairs would be taking longer than expected, and that more parts were ordered?. I informed them that the unit had not been winterized yet and at least could they drain the water heater and blow out the water lines and refrigerator. And yes I knew it would cost me to do it.

Was it a phone call or email? What does the fine print on the service contract say? Most that I have seen state the "Dealer is not responsible for damage due to a unit not being winterized or food left in the fridge" or something similar. If it was a phone call it would be a "he said--he said".

As Lake Huron said I would be talking to to your insurance company about not only about the extra damage costs, but also the leaks.

[Trapper2020]

Your mistake for leaving the unit un winterized. Call insurance that’s why we have it. Good luck.

Enjoy the journey

[Destrtman]

Thanks for the support.

I will be calling the insurance company after dropping off the Dewdrop at school.

[DonaandDon]

Agree with letting the insurance company fight for your right.

[CAG]

The frozen pipes and dead batteries are the dealers problem.
A. You called and told them.

Unfortunately in the world of law if is is not in writing it did not happen. They may make a good faith offer or you might get really lucky and they pay for it but when their lawyers get it you will probably be dead in the water (pun not intended).

That just really sucks. I hope you get it straightened away to your favor.

[Destrtman]

Thanks for the support.

I will be calling the insurance company after dropping off the Dewdrop at school.

[norty1]

I had to leave mine at my dealers years back to get some work done waiting on parts. It was in winter and I asked upon leaving it if they winterized it. They did for a charge and all the pipes and faucets were marked. Next time I did it, I winterized it and notified them. The batteries were still dead as a doornail when I went back to pick it up cause Jayco did not put a disconnect switch on many models.

A good first mod is a battery disconnect switch.

[Lake Huron]

Originally Posted by Trapperbob

Your mistake for leaving the unit un winterized. Call insurance that’s why we have it. Good luck.

Enjoy the journey

Not really. It was dropped off in August and the dealer said it would take 2-3 weeks, not 4-5 months.
That's the difference between a dealer that cares about its customers and their equipment and ones that dont.
If you drop your vehicle off at the dealer for repairs that they say takes a day and instead takes a week. You go to get it and they lay it on you that you have to pay for a new battery because one of their idiots left the ignition on the entire time that killed your battery. That's acceptable?? Not for me it isn't.

[Flyrotor]

Wow, that is just a bad situation all the way around, unfortunately there will be no winning this, regardless who picks up the bill, maybe look into working a trade-in deal with them on a new unit and let that one go away for good.

[Destrtman]

Thanks all for the support, and good advice.

Well insurance is now involved. My original adjuster is no longer an employee and I have spoken to an other adjuster whom is going to look at the situation and let me know if they can do anything to help me. He is going to call the service manager to find out what happened and get more information.

[Jagiven]

Originally Posted by Destrtman

Thanks all for the support, and good advice.

Well insurance is now involved. My original adjuster is no longer an employee and I have spoken to an other adjuster whom is going to look at the situation and let me know if they can do anything to help me. He is going to call the service manager to find out what happened and get more information.

Good Luck

[Destrtman]

Thanks to all I-We the wife Granddaughter and I really appreciate your ideas and advice.

The dealer called Tuesday at 5:00 pm and said the water was fixed. They replaced the split elbows and 'T's, the pump, the water heater, and control valve panel.

The batteries were charged and I was told that they tested good. However at 1:00 pm on Wednesday they were completely dead and would not run any of the lights. I had my 200 amp jumper battery which I used to jump start the generator.

I licked my wounds payed my deductible and left with the trailer in tow behind the Black's truck.

The new insurance adjuster called this morning with his report on our issue. The dealer he said wanted to keep their business and did the repairs without charge.

What a difference they made! Thanks F#%=*@t insurance

I am very satisfied with the repairs to our Seismic the new nose and the entire right side look like it never happened. DW & GD are very happy to have our Home With a Range home.

I will be installing the new batteries tomorrow, and checking the leveling system and the 3 slides. Concerned with the right side living room slide, it has had the actuator replaced, and major repairs.

Saturday and Sunday they are calling for snow. I need to unload the garage of all the old parts, and start loading up the goodies we had to remove before the repairs.

Thanks again Jayco forum!!!!

[Screwby]

Good it worked out for you. The scary part is all the poor people who don’t know better have paid these dishonest crooks for stunts like this. Amazing how when insurance got involved the bill disappeared but had you not fought back they’d have gladly taken your money. Unfortunately that vast majority of RV owners just trust the dealers and have no idea how ripped off they get.

[Grumpy]

Originally Posted by Destrtman

The dealer called Tuesday at 5:00 pm and said the water was fixed. They replaced the split elbows and 'T's, the pump, the water heater, and control valve panel.
..........

The new insurance adjuster called this morning with his report on our issue. The dealer he said wanted to keep their business and did the repairs without charge.

[Destrtman]

Thanks again all

[kblast523]

Originally Posted by Lake Huron

Not really. It was dropped off in August and the dealer said it would take 2-3 weeks, not 4-5 months.
That's the difference between a dealer that cares about its customers and their equipment and ones that dont.
If you drop your vehicle off at the dealer for repairs that they say takes a day and instead takes a week. You go to get it and they lay it on you that you have to pay for a new battery because one of their idiots left the ignition on the entire time that killed your battery. That's acceptable?? Not for me it isn't.

My 2018 Jayfeather 23RL spent extensive time at the dealer in Lubbock (not where I bought it, but where I will buy my next one). I took my rig to Pharr's RV in late November 2018 after the air conditioner quit. Had a short list of other repairs including the front cap that had been punctured from screws being over tightened during assembly, and pointed out during PDI at CW in April when I bought it in OKC. Their response: You can bring it back at your convenience. Short answer-NO! I'm not going to drive 800+ miles (two round trips) to let you work on it later.

Got to Lubbock, they asked if had been winterized, and again...no. We will probably have it well into 'freezing season'. Cost: $145, do it. Stayed at the service department until late February, got the whole list of stuff fixed...it even snowed 16" while it was 'in the shop'.


Went to Phoenix for the spring race. A/C worked fine while parked in Son-in-law's driveway in Scottsdale. Moved to ISM (PIR), and it wouldn't work. Before leaving for home, called Pharr's told them of problem with AC. They ASKED about the other repairs they had done and told me to 'bring it by and I think we can take care of it in an hour or so'.


When I got to Pharr's they did tell me I needed to drop the trailer, but it would be 'in an hour or two'. It was, meanwhile I went to Discount Tire and spent almost a grand for new rubber on the TV. They fixed it in the drive...(loose wire).


It's not who you bought it from, it's who works on it. I'm only 60 miles from Jack Sisemore's Travel Land in Amarillo, and will never darken their door. They are that bad. Only exceeded in 'bad' by CW OKC.


Point is, they ASKED if I wanted to be winterized...coulda said no, but I was smart enough to know I probably wouldn't get it back before a freeze.

[Flight Control]

Thinking back to my business law class in college, in legal terms this is a Bailor/Bailee arrangement. You, the Bailor, turned over your property to the servicing dealer, i.e., the Bailee. In this body of law your dealer has a certain responsibility to preserve and protect your property.

Think about it. If your RV was stolen while in the possession of the dealer, who is responsible? The dealer, of course. What if it was destroyed by a fire in the shop? Again, the dealer. What if it was vandalized. Again, the dealer.

So, if the dealer fails to protect it from the elements, especially knowing full well that freezing temperatures have a destructive affect on your property, they are responsible. And when you gave verbal approval to winterize your RV, that is a verbal contract, and it carries weight in law.

So, from my vantage point as an armchair lawyer, I'm ruling against the dealer.

[LarryJ]

We had our 5th wheel in last fall, what a 2 week repair turned into 2 months. But we winterized prior, lucky us.
But first question dealer asked when brought trailer in was if we had winterized or not...
Your fault, maybe...