1/2 Ton Miracles and Magic

[FeatherFam]

Increasingly we see and read about 1/2 ton trucks towing very substantial fivers and travel trailers. We are just trying to get our minds around this. The trucks are RAM, Silverado, and F150. When we talk to the owners, they tell us things like, "It 'idles' up steep grades," "Tons of power for passing," "No problems with brake fade," and "Doesn't effect the suspension at all." If 1/2 tons are all that, why not just eliminate the category? They sound like 3/4 tons.

Personally, I find all of this very hard to believe. Our fully tow-equipped RAM Tradesman HD is not the truck that I would choose for towing these lengthy, weighty trailers, definitely the 3/4 ton (+) for safety, performance, and vehicle wear and tear. We also have never understood all of the "Don't even know it's back there" talk. I have always "known it's back there" whether I tow a Ditch Witch, a small cargo trailer, a PUP, or our TT.

[Gman1372]

150s are cute little trucks. You can take your girlfriend out on Friday night, rolling down the highway with your low profile tires and 20" rims avoiding mud puddles. Don't remember when pick ups became fashionable, prolly 10 years ago. Now it seems every Tom D.ck and Harry is driving one. Dodge advertising $299 a month leases makes it easy to be a cowboy

[BigJohnD]

Yeah, the don't know it's back there and doesn't affect suspension are lines that aggravate me. You see what I tow with, and how small of a RV, and it obviously affects the suspension, and I can feel it back there. If your senses work like mine, you can feel anything hooked on to it. Boat, cargo trailer, whatever.

For those that can't "feel" it, go find a good cross wind.

I don't understand why they keep upping the tow ratings on a 1/2 ton. Just buy a 3/4 or 1 ton for the same money. Pretty much same money unless going with a diesel.

[Marcm157]

I am one of those F150 guys that tow a larger TT. I will never say "I don't even know it's back there" and agree 100% with the fact that there are many out there that don't understand how trucks operate. I also didn't buy into the Ford sales guy who told me my truck would tow 11k. What I do know is my F150 has a greater payload then SOME 3/4 tons out there. What I also know is I am within the weight limits of my truck because I scaled out with some room to spare.

I am however in that category of owner that bought my truck first and camper second. I am very mechanically inclined, do all my own vehicle maintenance / repairs in my home shop and know and respect the abilities of machines. With all that being said, if I had it to do over again, I would buy an F250 /F350 just for the ability to have a bit MORE breathing room and the ability to upgrade to a sizeable 5th wheel when ready. Had I known I was going to sell my boat and buy a camper I would have done it from the get go.

I have no problem with my current setup and will continue to drive my "Cute little truck" just wish it had a sunroof, so I could wear my 10 gallon cowboy hat while driving...

[LiftedAWDAstro]

At least my "cute little truck" was built in Texas so I could wear a cowboy hat...if I had one!

That said, I get very annoyed at the guys who say the "can't even feel the trailer back there". Really? Pull your head out of your sphincter and pay attention! I have always felt the trailer behind me whether it is my 900# utility trailer or 10,000# worth of ditch witch and trailer.

[Witt74]

For some reason, trucks have gotten popular in the last 10 -15 yrs. A lot of people that drive trucks just ride around in them, don't use them to haul stuff of tow anything. The downside to this is the increased demand for pick ups, and increased prices for the trucks. The upside to this is improved comforts in the trucks, improved power, towing capacity, payload, etc.. While waiting for DW to pick me up from dropping my 06 F250 off for service, I looked at a 16 F150 XLT crew cab baby bed that was on the lot. Over twice what I paid for my diesel super duty new in 06. Have to hope mine holds up for a long time.

[RPreeb]

I guess I have to say that I like my "cute" F-150, but I have no intention of stretching it out to anywhere close to the factory tow ratings. My TT has a 5500 max rating, and it's unlikely that it will ever be loaded even close to that. I expect to be more like 5000 lbs when loaded for a typical 3-5 night trip, and most of that is water, propane, 48 lb generator, and battery. We don't haul a bunch of toys with us - my "toy" is my camera, and that whole kit doesn't weigh 35 lbs.

To the other part of the rant, of course you can feel the trailer back there. I think that comment is made as more of a comparative statement, measured against a comparable vehicle from 10-15 years ago. My TT follows along nicely with no WDH on the freeway in a strong cross wind, so when I get my Husky hitch set up it will be just that much better, thus working towards that same sort of comparison. I'll still know it's there, but my truck and trailer are a very disciplined and easy to manage marriage.

As to the "cowboy" reference, I'm not one, but half my friends are either ranchers or farmers. After living 10 years in Montana and 43 years in Colorado (and now living the rural life out on the high prairie), most of the people I know have some ties to the land.

[North of 49°]

My F-150 is also my daily driver, so I feel it's a good compromise between that and the dozen or so times a year I need to tow with it. The only time I "don't notice it's there" is when it's not moving. The rest of time time, I know I'm dragging around a 3 ton boat anchor. The truck tows our ~6,000 lb trailer adequately, and even though it's is rated for half again that much, I really don't want to put it to the test. I wouldn't be comfortable with it, and I'm not interested in dealing the the increased wear and tear on the truck. If we were towing more often, or longer distances, then I could justify a larger 250/2500 vehicle, but this one does what we need it to do.

[FishAr]

Even if a lighter truck has a high payload, it's still a light truck pulling a heavy object.

[NVGun40]

The F150s certainly are worthy of respect with their tow and cargo ratings, as are a good number of the other 1/2 ton platforms set up with tow packages. My hat is off to the manufacturers out there. The owners of such vehicles have every cause to be proud of the capabilities of their trucks. As some have said here, today's half ton is not the half ton of our Dad's era. There have been vast improvements to these trucks. While this is all well and good, the 3/4 tons and up are not the same as our Dad's era either. They are much more capable yet again.
The issue I keep noticing touches on something from the OP. Towing these seemingly oversized trailers. Too many half ton owners out there are looking at these huge trailers and their lightweight/ultra lite designations and people fall into a (my opinion) dangerous thought that the trailers meet and/or fall under the weight specifications of the 1/2 ton class. What needs to be realized is that the RV industry is making trailers lighter these days for everything around. It's not necessarily to make the trailer towable for a half ton truck, but to help the 3/4 tons and higher maintain better gas mileage while towing.
Too many half ton owners and tech/spec savvy people out there will crunch all the numbers and decide the weights are within parameters and yet constantly dismiss and refuse to look at the simple physics of size and length and wheel base measurements versus a TV which is too lightweight for the SIZE (not weight) of trailer they are towing.
Many people do not realize what it feels like to comfortably tow something. I have met quite a few people who are unaware they are "white knuckled" towing because they have never experienced "comfortable" towing conditions. Instead dismissing "white knuckled" conditions as just being over vigilant and careful.
I agree with others, I do not like the term, "I (or my truck) doesn't even know it's back there." I have a 610lb, flatbed tilt trailer I haul my snow machine around with. I and my 3/4 ton truck know when the trailer is back there.
I know the comfort and ease and peace of mind of no concern over what gear I take camping. Or how the trailer is loaded, having full water tanks etc. and being able to hook up my RV and just go.



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[dewey02]

Originally Posted by RPreeb

As to the "cowboy" reference, I'm not one, but half my friends are either ranchers or farmers. After living 10 years in Montana and 43 years in Colorado (and now living the rural life out on the high prairie), most of the people I know have some ties to the land.

I'm guessing the "cowboy" reference was actually referencing "urban (or wanna-be) cowboys" who've never had cow sh** or even mud on their boots.

[Paintinfool3]

Well working at a GM truck plant that builds 1500, 2500, 3500, dually and cab chassis trucks I can tell you working in frame1 where the frames begin the building process there is a substantial difference between the 1500 and even the 2500 series and everything from there up gets bigger springs brakes and axles by far. From frame to rotors to leaf springs to rear end everything is different and beefier. I have an F250 and could have probably handled the F350 but decided for a little better ride since it is my everyday driver but I can tell a difference between this one and my older 350 dually

[clubhouse]

Last night while having dinner with a new neighbor, who are quickly becoming good friends, we started talking about getting a new SUV.

Let me interject this neighbor neighbor is a non-camper and has never even towed as much as a small Argo trailer. Total towing novice.

They asked why we are considering dumping our Toyota Highlander for a newer Suburban. I explained we need the seats, as a family of 5 who frequently has one or two more with us the Highlander us just too small. I also mentioned the benefit of the suburban in case we ever follow through on getting a boat or jet skis, that a suburban could tiwnthat easily and we have options beyond the truck.

This is where is gets interesting...

They have a newer Toyota Sequoia, 2014 I think, and asked why not look at the Sequoia since it's rated to tow 9500lbs. I explained to him the cargo weight issue and the door sticker. He didn't believe me so we went into the garage to show him.

That 7 seat large SUV with a 9500lb tow rating only has 1268 lbs or cargo per the sticker. He quickly deduced a typical family of 5 is 1/2 that allowance, add another couple hundred is stuff and you really don't have much left to accomdate any trailer TW.

1500 and large SUVs have their purpose, towing isn't on the short list of purposes engineering designed it for. Just on the marketing short list of features to incorrectly sell.

[Gman1372]

Originally Posted by dewey02

I'm guessing the "cowboy" reference was actually referencing "urban (or wanna-be) cowboys" who've never had cow sh** or even mud on their boots.

Exactly.......Or mud on their tires.
For what it's worth. I like the 150/1500 series trucks. Where I'm at you can drive them on parkways and we have a lot of them. Over a certain weight which it typically 250/2500 and up, your stuck with highway only. My beef was with the fashion driver. The one who doesn't carry 1800lbs of tools daily and shines his low profile tires for his Friday night date. And yes I'm a country boy

[17 Oaks]

Originally Posted by FeatherFam

Increasingly we see and read about 1/2 ton trucks towing very substantial fivers and travel trailers. We are just trying to get our minds around this. The trucks are RAM, Silverado, and F150. When we talk to the owners, they tell us things like, "It 'idles' up steep grades," "Tons of power for passing," "No problems with brake fade," and "Doesn't effect the suspension at all." If 1/2 tons are all that, why not just eliminate the category? They sound like 3/4 tons.

Personally, I find all of this very hard to believe. Our fully tow-equipped RAM Tradesman HD is not the truck that I would choose for towing these lengthy, weighty trailers, definitely the 3/4 ton (+) for safety, performance, and vehicle wear and tear. We also have never understood all of the "Don't even know it's back there" talk. I have always "known it's back there" whether I tow a Ditch Witch, a small cargo trailer, a PUP, or our TT.

You forgot 1 thing...they do all that and still get 28 mpg @ 75 mph.

The Eagle HT line was aimed at the HT (half ton truck). BUT the Eagle HT is only ½ of the equation, the truck is the other half. You better be buying the F 150 with the PROPER configuration in order to pull it and not just any F 150 sitting out there on the lot will do so.

Those that post the most amazing numbers are one of two things: 1) They don't own one, but their brothers best friends Uncle's son etc etc does or 2) they believe Denial is a river in Egypt. They just did not bother to think when they bought the base model of ________ half ton truck and now they are stuck with it...

[ykcamom]

There is no discussion on any RV forum that will get people riled up as quickly as the old "my F150 can tow XXX"! It's always interesting to read 'em.

I am equally amazed at the size of trailers we've seen F150's tow. But I also know the newer models have a heck of a lot more payload than our 2010.

Anyhow, our F150 works for the trailer we have now. Would we go any heavier or longer? No, we would not. Would a 250 or 350 do a better job towing what we have? Of course. But we don't really need that larger truck just yet. I get that you can never have too much truck for towing, but you can certainly have too much truck for your bank account or too much truck for daily driving. So for now, we wait until we made decisions on our next RV and if it's a fifth wheel, we will then upgrade the truck.

Oh and today, we pulled into a rest stop and there was an older 26 foot Jayco fifth wheel being pulled by what looked to me, like a tiny truck. I actually thought it was like a Tacoma, or Ranger or something. So I looked more closely. It was an older F250! I was kind of shocked because it was right beside our 2010 F150 and it honestly looked like it was a Ranger! It was so small, and so low to the ground. I can't think of a better way to illustrate the difference between older F250's and newer F150s than what I saw today. (And ya, I know size isn't everything....!)

Anyhow, that's my two cents on this whole debate.

[Super Eagle]

Glad I'm not the only one who rolls their eyes at those posts.
Prior my current F-350 tow vehicle, I had three F-150's over a span of 26 years; my last F-150 was a 2004 Super Cab with a 5.4, and tow package, and I towed a pop-up. Loading the F-150's with wood, bicycles, coolers, and the family; I couldn't imagine towing much more than a pop-up. Now I tow a Eagle 314BHDS with my F-350, and I DO notice it's back there. So when I hear the guys with the 3.5 Eco-boosts, or Tundras, claim to tow 8000 pounds and not feel it, I cringe....
Thanks for commiserating!

[17 Oaks]

I am not sure if I posted it on here or not, but there is a Youtube of a OEM attachment for a VW Beetle for pulling a 5th wheel. Not a joke as I originally thought but it was an OEM setup.

Apparently there is a small 5th wheel that is in fact made for this. The attachment is on the roof of the Beetle...

Over the years and many miles I have seen some unusual stuff out there, sadly most runs the ragged edge of dangerous at any speed.

Just recently on I 10 N of San Antonio about 50 mi I came upon a half ton pulling a TT with a double axle. I noticed it from afar as the right rear wheel was dragging on the pavement having long ago and many miles back lost its tire. With much honking and yelling and pointing they FINALLY pulled over. As I came upon them my headlights lit up the TT and its wheel and not only did they need to replace the tire but the wheel was clearly destroyed.

[schrederman]

I had an F-150 and towed a Surveyor SV264 trailer that had a max weight of 6500#. I was within limits but just. I was uncomfortable with it pretty often. I knew I was going to upgrade my trailer. I would have been outside the numbers with my current trailer even though I've seen others of the same make/model being towed by 1/2 tons. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should. While 7500# (my current trailer gross weight) falls within the "towing capacity" it's tongue weight would have had my 150 overloaded. Keep in mind that in cross-winds and head winds, the weight is sometimes secondary to what the air is doing... until the air whips you into a bad situation and then the weight takes over... It's not my place to call someone out and tell them what they should or shouldn't do... But I upgraded the truck in anticipation of the recent TT upgrade. All I can say is that I wish I'd done it sooner. The heavier truck and LT tires are such an improvement... not to mention the power of the diesel. And... I'm a combination city boy and cowboy... that has actually owned acreage and cows... now retired and just a RV bum and fly fisherman / glider pilot... and my 3/4 Ram is just a cute little truck to me, even if DeeDee calls it the Beast.

[Vaquero]

Originally Posted by 17 Oaks

I am not sure if I posted it on here or not, but there is a Youtube of a OEM attachment for a VW Beetle for pulling a 5th wheel. Not a joke as I originally thought but it was an OEM setup.

Apparently there is a small 5th wheel that is in fact made for this. The attachment is on the roof of the Beetle...

Over the years and many miles I have seen some unusual stuff out there, sadly most runs the ragged edge of dangerous at any speed.

Just recently on I 10 N of San Antonio about 50 mi I came upon a half ton pulling a TT with a double axle. I noticed it from afar as the right rear wheel was dragging on the pavement having long ago and many miles back lost its tire. With much honking and yelling and pointing they FINALLY pulled over. As I came upon them my headlights lit up the TT and its wheel and not only did they need to replace the tire but the wheel was clearly destroyed.

They couldn't tell it was back there.