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Old 01-18-2014, 07:47 AM   #11
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Interesting video for chevy. I have seen a similar video from ford.
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Old 01-18-2014, 08:36 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by NewBlackDak View Post
The ITBC in the RAM does try to apply the trailer brakes as the first measure in controlling sway.
So you guys are saying that your system will engage the trailer brakes without you applying brake pedal pressure if an unusual amount of sway is detected from the TV's on board system? I thought mine only controlled TV "sensed" conditions of sway produced by the TV/TT. Maybe I should read my owners manual again.
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Old 01-18-2014, 09:50 AM   #13
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So you guys are saying that your system will engage the trailer brakes without you applying brake pedal pressure if an unusual amount of sway is detected from the TV's on board system?........snip
As I mentioned earlier, I don't know if different individual ITBC systems operate differently, so as you stated I would check one's owners manual as well.

Here is a GM description of their ITBC and StabiliTrak:

"Trailer sway control employs an angle sensor within the steering wheel assembly to measure the drivers intended yaw, or rotational movement around the axis of a vehicle, which determines the direction. During a sway incident, the sensor detects the driverís intended yaw, while another sensor measures the actual yaw. The Electronic Brake Control Module compares both inputs and sends a signal to the Integrated Trailer Brake Control for action. The resulting action is to apply the trailer brakes and reduce the velocity. In more extreme conditions, the Integrated Trailer Brake Control will also signal the vehicle to apply its brakes until the oscillation stops"

Source: http://media.gm.com/media/us/en/gm/n...r_sway_gm.html

Bob
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Old 01-18-2014, 04:22 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by TCNASHVILLE View Post
So you guys are saying that your system will engage the trailer brakes without you applying brake pedal pressure if an unusual amount of sway is detected from the TV's on board system? I thought mine only controlled TV "sensed" conditions of sway produced by the TV/TT. Maybe I should read my owners manual again.
I worked in Electonic Brake Systems for over 12 years. Here is a little background:

There are 2 systems in play here. The ITBC and the ESC (Electronic Stability Control) system or "Advanced Track" in Ford speak. These systems integrate ABS, Traction Control and Vehicle Stability systems by activating the brakes in different situations.

ABS keeps the wheels from locking during hard braking with loss of traction. Could be on dry pavement or in slippery driving conditions. It uses wheel speed sensors and sometimes a acceration sensor (front to back) on some 4x4s to monitor the vehicle. It actually allows a little slip (wheels just slight slower than the vehicle) if necessary in hard braking as this gives best traction and stopping distance in slippery conditions but keeps the wheels from sliding causing loss of control of the vehicle. I.e you can still steer even during hard braking.

Traction control uses the same wheel speed and acceleration sensors to monitor wheel slip/spin during acceleration. If necessary the system can work to lessen the spinning of the wheels during acceleration. This can be done through brake pressure at the drive wheels and/or throttle reduction some of this depends on how fast the vehicle is moving.

ESC adds a lateral (side to side) acceleration sensor, a steering wheel angle sensor and a yaw (rotation around the center of mass of the vehicle) along with the sensors mentioned above to monitor the stability of the vehicle. This system works without you even knowing and may have saved your life by helping to keep your vehicle on the road in a turn or a curve even at highway speeds. The system is remarkable and really enhances the stability of your vehicle. The anti sway systems use this technology to help stabalize the vehicle and help prevent a sway event from getting out of control by applying the brakes to kind of drag the vehicle straight. However, if the force of the sway events gets too bad, the anti-sway will not be able overcome the sway. Better to avoid the sway by proper TT and TV loading and a good WDH with sway control and keeping speeds down.

I'm not an expert on the trailer brake contollers, but I did just read an article on the newer ITBCs from Ford that there is a link between the advance track system and the ITBC so trailer brakes are activated in a sway event and also potentially during an ABS event. This is sure an advantage of getting an OEM integrated system rather than an add on aftermarket TBC.

Hope this helps.
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Old 01-18-2014, 08:41 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by t2daniel View Post
... SNIP...on the newer ITBCs from Ford that there is a link between the advance track system and the ITBC so trailer brakes are activated in a sway event and also potentially during an ABS event. This is sure an advantage of getting an OEM integrated system rather than an add on aftermarket TBC.

Hope this helps.
Tim is right on the money...
Let me add to it
ESC (electronic stability control) is the common industry name and all the companies have their own name... Stabil Track in GM...ECT
90% of all vehicles sold in the US today have some type of ESC system
With Ford and GM the system can apply brakes to any tire it needs or slow it down completely
With the GM hill assist it will hold the brake when on an incline greater than 5% and will release once the accelerator is pressed...

Anyway back to the point
Now with the ITBC the system will apply the trailer brakes as needed once a sway event is detected
It can, if needed, pulse (pump) the trailer brakes. They call it pulse since it is really sending voltage to activate the brakes.
All the programing needed is the reason you cant get the ITBC added after market. You can get systems that look like OEM but will really only be a standard Brake Control, not an ITBC system.

Make sure if you have a ITBC system you set the gain according the manual

And the point of the post I was looking to find out if anyone has actually seen or used the system darning a sway event.
While it sounds great on paper, and by theory, it works...However in reality does it really work?
It is still a reactive system and starts after the sway event begins, what the yaw (sway) setting? How far does it need to swing before it starts applying brakes?
If it does work, does this change the way we look at sway control systems in our WDHs?

Thanks for everyone's input
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Old 01-18-2014, 08:52 PM   #16
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Just found these 3 you tube videos
GMC

Ford

Chevy
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Old 01-19-2014, 08:28 AM   #17
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Upon further review of my owners manual it states; "Trailer sway control will use the vehicles AdvanceTrac with RCS system to detect and help reduce trailer sway by applying brake force at individual wheels and if necessary, by reducing engine power. Warning; Trailer sway control does not prevent a trailer from swaying, it mitigates the sway from increasing once it has occurred". I'm assuming here that my on board system only deals with the TV and is not able to apply the TT brakes without applying brake pedal pressure. I also think that it would be a natural driver reaction to apply the brakes at the onset of a sway event long before the on board system would take over although trailer sway can happen very quickly. These are good systems to have and for all of us, I hope they're never used. Thanks, Terry
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Old 01-19-2014, 10:22 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Redhorse 823 View Post
snip..... If it does work, does this change the way we look at sway control systems in our WDHs?....snip
IMO when a TV's ITBC system is working in concert with a mechanical sway control device it can only enhance the TV's ability to manage/recover from a given sway event...., but I don't see the ITBC system (and/or ESC's, etc.) replacing the mechanical sway control device.

It should be noted that a TV doesn't necessarily have to be hitched to a trailer to incur a sway event.

Bob
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Old 01-23-2014, 09:32 AM   #19
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Something to note about the Hensley Arrow, it does not resist the TV initiated turns at all it completely stops TT initiated turns. It does this by a mechanicial 4 bar problem the back (attached to the TT) bar is longer than the front bar (attached to the TV) thus it is over center and cannot initiate a turn. The TV (front) bar can pivot thus allow turns. The benefit is you can use this setup in slippery conditions such as ice and snow where you cannot use friction based sway controll. This limitation also affects other "cam" based sway controls because they want to force the TV and TT to want to center. The Hensley does not do this. I have used standard systems such as a Vallley system with a separate friction bar, the Hensley Arrow, and a new single point system from Anderson that also uses friction. They all work and have their pros and cons. With my experience I strongly recommend the Hensley Arrow for TT use.
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