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08-11-2019, 07:22 AM
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#41
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: WHITBY
Posts: 40
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I'm towing a 2017 Eagle HT (Jayco model 24.5CKTS) with a 2018 F150 Supercab (5 litre V8 with 10 peed auto trans. The day I picked it up I was prepared to tell the DW that we would have to spend a few $$$ for suspension upgrades on the truck. Once hooked up, I was presently surprised that the truck and trailer sat level - no upgrades needed. According to Ford's towing guide we could have gone to the 27.5' but we would have been just about at the quoted max for the truck. The 24.5 with this truck is a great match.
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08-11-2019, 08:29 AM
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#42
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayoutalker
Weight at the hitch, "pin", of a 5er. That's the weight transferred to the truck when the front legs are retracted.
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I’ve been up, down, and sideways reading everything about my 2019 HDPP, and absolutely nowhere have I seen a rating for max pin weight. It simply (as far as I can tell) does not exist, at least in the Ford eco system. What truck manufacturer publishes a pin weight?
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08-11-2019, 08:38 AM
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#43
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OTTERCOMET
I'm towing a 2017 Eagle HT (Jayco model 24.5CKTS) with a 2018 F150 Supercab (5 litre V8 with 10 peed auto trans. The day I picked it up I was prepared to tell the DW that we would have to spend a few $$$ for suspension upgrades on the truck. Once hooked up, I was presently surprised that the truck and trailer sat level - no upgrades needed. According to Ford's towing guide we could have gone to the 27.5' but we would have been just about at the quoted max for the truck. The 24.5 with this truck is a great match.
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I came SUPER close to getting the 24.5 last year, but the timing was not perfect. I really like it, and sad to see they are not making it anymore. By virtue of the 5.0, yours is not an hdpp, and I am really glad that it deals well with it! What hitch are you using? I plan on getting my truck ready before I actually buy a trailer at this point, and prolly getting a drop ball/Andersen setup. Shortlist is 25.5 reok, 27.5 rlts, 26rlds. I am being cautious and slow, no rush. No one near me stocks the 25.5, and I do not want to order it, but get one on a lot where I can inspect it completely first. I was considering timbrens or roadmaster before even owning a trailer, but with success like yours, may forgo that. My truck has a 2500 lb payload, and the 27.5 starts to tickle the limit. Another I like, (but DW not so much) is the minnie winne 25rlk. It has the unique distinction of empty pin of 820 lbs!
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08-11-2019, 11:03 AM
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#44
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Highlands
Posts: 654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Half Ton Heavy
I’ve been up, down, and sideways reading everything about my 2019 HDPP, and absolutely nowhere have I seen a rating for max pin weight. It simply (as far as I can tell) does not exist, at least in the Ford eco system. What truck manufacturer publishes a pin weight?
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My Ram doesn't either that I know of. I would use the payload limit and subtract the normal load of people, etc that I normally carry on trips. I would guess that is what the rating mentioned above is based on.
__________________
Cliff
Jayflight 34RSBS
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08-11-2019, 12:37 PM
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#45
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayoutalker
My Ram doesn't either that I know of. I would use the payload limit and subtract the normal load of people, etc that I normally carry on trips. I would guess that is what the rating mentioned above is based on.
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That's my point. No such thing as a max pin rating, at least in Ford lexicon. It's all part of payload.
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08-11-2019, 01:13 PM
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#46
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Highlands
Posts: 654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Half Ton Heavy
That's my point. No such thing as a max pin rating, at least in Ford lexicon. It's all part of payload.
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But in trailer lingo pin weight does exist and must be considered against payload weight. According to a post above it looks like some truck makers may be starting to use the pin rating spec. That would make things easier for most people when considering new tv or 5er.
__________________
Cliff
Jayflight 34RSBS
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08-11-2019, 06:26 PM
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#47
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Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 75
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Just as a conventional hitch has a maximum hitch weight that is 10% of its trailer tow weight rating, the maximum pin weight is 15% of the gooseneck/fifth wheel tow weight rating. You are right in that very few manufacturers note or acknowledge the rating which leads to a lot of confusion.
__________________
2007 G2 28RBS
2016 Titan XD SV CTD
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08-11-2019, 07:00 PM
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#48
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Colorado Springs
Posts: 1,269
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Demiles
Just as a conventional hitch has a maximum hitch weight that is 10% of its trailer tow weight rating, the maximum pin weight is 15% of the gooseneck/fifth wheel tow weight rating. You are right in that very few manufacturers note or acknowledge the rating which leads to a lot of confusion.
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I think you are light on both of those.
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08-11-2019, 07:34 PM
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#49
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Missouri City, The Republic of Texas
Posts: 5,063
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Half Ton Heavy
I’ve been up, down, and sideways reading everything about my 2019 HDPP, and absolutely nowhere have I seen a rating for max pin weight. It simply (as far as I can tell) does not exist, at least in the Ford eco system. What truck manufacturer publishes a pin weight?
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As noted earlier, the weight of the pin is subtracted from the rear axle’s GAWR which is part of the available payload. Firewood, generator, chairs. . . And the other stuff you put in the bed. Keep in mind that the payload number is divided between the rear and front axles (majority going to the rear). So a payload of 2000# doesn’t mean a pin weight of 2000# is within the TV’s rated limits.The TV’s weight sticker (found on the driver door jamb) will tell you the weight ratings for the front and rear axles (GAWR) as well as the payload. Roughly, the weight rating of the rear axle less the rear axle weight is an indication of the pin weight.
The CAT Scales are a great way to get the actual weights.
The hitch and other “stuff” in the bed increases the axle weight which reduces the pin weight the TV should carry. There are some great sticky’s discussing how to use the CAT Scale and how to interpret the results.
The CAT Scale is your friend.
__________________
Cheers,
T_
2013 F-350 CC SB 2WD 6.7PS
2013 Eagle Premier 351 RLTS
-SOLD- 2012 X23B
-SOLD- 2003 Ford Expedition 5.4, Bilstein shocks
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08-11-2019, 07:43 PM
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#50
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Highlands
Posts: 654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Demiles
Just as a conventional hitch has a maximum hitch weight that is 10% of its trailer tow weight rating, the maximum pin weight is 15% of the gooseneck/fifth wheel tow weight rating. You are right in that very few manufacturers note or acknowledge the rating which leads to a lot of confusion.
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Let's see if I understand you. The tow rating on my Ram 2500 4x4 is 15,630#. So my max pin weight would be 2345# by your figures. The payload rating is 3300#. That is a difference of 955#. That should cover people and misc load.
With modern 5ers being what they are that could be a fairly large size unit.
__________________
Cliff
Jayflight 34RSBS
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08-11-2019, 08:07 PM
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#51
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Missouri City, The Republic of Texas
Posts: 5,063
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Demiles
Just as a conventional hitch has a maximum hitch weight that is 10% of its trailer tow weight rating, the maximum pin weight is 15% of the gooseneck/fifth wheel tow weight rating. You are right in that very few manufacturers note or acknowledge the rating which leads to a lot of confusion.
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It’s my understanding that the pin will be 20-25% of the GVW. Our 5th is at 23%.
__________________
Cheers,
T_
2013 F-350 CC SB 2WD 6.7PS
2013 Eagle Premier 351 RLTS
-SOLD- 2012 X23B
-SOLD- 2003 Ford Expedition 5.4, Bilstein shocks
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08-12-2019, 03:09 AM
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#52
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Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayoutalker
Let's see if I understand you. The tow rating on my Ram 2500 4x4 is 15,630#. So my max pin weight would be 2345# by your figures. The payload rating is 3300#. That is a difference of 955#. That should cover people and misc load.
With modern 5ers being what they are that could be a fairly large size unit.
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Yes
__________________
2007 G2 28RBS
2016 Titan XD SV CTD
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08-12-2019, 06:29 AM
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#53
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: DFW
Posts: 2,212
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Nissian and a 5er ?
This is pretty interesting. I just looked up my own truck’s specs and the max fw tow rating is 13900. This would put max pin just north of 2K. Leaving a couple hundred pounds left over for other stuff. The 13900 is fw or gooseneck. Obviously with a fw you won’t see a 13,900lb unit with a pin of 2K. That ‘s fairly close to my own math if aiming for the yellow sticker. GM must be figuring some payload numbers into this as the gas model has higher fw tow rating by 500lbs and a long bed is lower by 1000lbs. This is for a 2016 2500HD.
Interesting stuff. Let’s hear some more opinions.
__________________
2017 Eagle HT 26.5BHS Sold
2019 Eagle 321RSTS Sold
2024 Grand Design 310GK
2022 Chevy 3000HD Dmax
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08-12-2019, 06:52 AM
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#54
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Highlands
Posts: 654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TxLoser
GM must be figuring some payload numbers into this as the gas model has higher fw tow rating by 500lbs and a long bed is lower by 1000lbs. This is for a 2016 2500HD.
Interesting stuff. Let’s hear some more opinions.
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The difference here is the weight difference between the models. The gas is lighter than a diesel and a long bed is heavier than a short bed.
__________________
Cliff
Jayflight 34RSBS
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08-12-2019, 07:15 AM
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#55
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Member
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: WHITBY
Posts: 40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Half Ton Heavy
I came SUPER close to getting the 24.5 last year, but the timing was not perfect. I really like it, and sad to see they are not making it anymore. By virtue of the 5.0, yours is not an hdpp, and I am really glad that it deals well with it! What hitch are you using? I plan on getting my truck ready before I actually buy a trailer at this point, and prolly getting a drop ball/Andersen setup. Shortlist is 25.5 reok, 27.5 rlts, 26rlds. I am being cautious and slow, no rush. No one near me stocks the 25.5, and I do not want to order it, but get one on a lot where I can inspect it completely first. I was considering timbrens or roadmaster before even owning a trailer, but with success like yours, may forgo that. My truck has a 2500 lb payload, and the 27.5 starts to tickle the limit. Another I like, (but DW not so much) is the minnie winne 25rlk. It has the unique distinction of empty pin of 820 lbs!
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After seeing the damage a friend did to his truck cab and the front of his 5th wheel, when he forgot to manually release his sliding hitch, I went with the SuperGlide #2700, rated for 16K and slides automatically. It is a bit of overkill but I have capacity if I decide to trade up in the future. I found I had to adjust my back up process. Beause the hitch changes location - front to back and side to side - when reversing, it seems to take much less steering wheel movement change the direction of the rear of the trailer.
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08-12-2019, 09:00 AM
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#56
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: DFW
Posts: 2,212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bayoutalker
The difference here is the weight difference between the models. The gas is lighter than a diesel and a long bed is heavier than a short bed.
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Exactly. That’s why I was saying they must figure some payload numbers into that.
__________________
2017 Eagle HT 26.5BHS Sold
2019 Eagle 321RSTS Sold
2024 Grand Design 310GK
2022 Chevy 3000HD Dmax
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08-12-2019, 01:05 PM
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#57
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TxLoser
This is pretty interesting. I just looked up my own truck’s specs and the max fw tow rating is 13900. This would put max pin just north of 2K. Leaving a couple hundred pounds left over for other stuff. The 13900 is fw or gooseneck. Obviously with a fw you won’t see a 13,900lb unit with a pin of 2K. That ‘s fairly close to my own math if aiming for the yellow sticker. GM must be figuring some payload numbers into this as the gas model has higher fw tow rating by 500lbs and a long bed is lower by 1000lbs. This is for a 2016 2500HD.
Interesting stuff. Let’s hear some more opinions.
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What does your payload sticker read? Keeping it in the limits with a 3/4 diesel generally means less than a 26’ fiver.
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08-12-2019, 02:22 PM
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#58
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Highlands
Posts: 654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Half Ton Heavy
What does your payload sticker read? Keeping it in the limits with a 3/4 diesel generally means less than a 26’ fiver.
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I had a 32' 5er that would make it easily but it was a light weight with aluminum structure. It did have 4 slides though.
__________________
Cliff
Jayflight 34RSBS
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08-12-2019, 05:36 PM
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#59
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Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Baltimore
Posts: 75
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Here is a good example. This sticker is from a 2020 GM 3500 SRW and note the %’s of hitch weight to trailer weight and payload rating.
__________________
2007 G2 28RBS
2016 Titan XD SV CTD
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08-12-2019, 07:06 PM
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#60
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Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Highlands
Posts: 654
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Demiles
Here is a good example. This sticker is from a 2020 GM 3500 SRW and note the %’s of hitch weight to trailer weight and payload rating.
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That would sure help reduce confusion when matching a TV to a trailer of any kind.
__________________
Cliff
Jayflight 34RSBS
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