Tow Capacity Isn't How Much You Can Tow

[Scottenj]

I just found this thread and I am surprised at how much misleading information is in it.

Everyone wants to know how much they can tow, and it seems like most people believe the tow capacity provided by the tow vehicle manufacturer is that number, it is not! In fact, there is no single number that determines what you can safely tow, for a fifth wheel there are three numbers and for a travel trailer there are four numbers and you can’t exceed any of them.

Before I describe how to determine what you can safely tow, I need to discuss tow vehicle and trailer specifications.

Tow Vehicle
Tow vehicles have a Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR), this is the most the vehicle can ever safely weigh. If you put the tow vehicle on a scale the scale should never show more weight than this number. You can get this number off of the manufacture’s web site, it is also on a sticker on the end of the driver’s side door or center post. There should also be Gross Axle Weight Ratings (GAWR) for the front and rear axles.

There will also be a yellow sticker with the cargo capacity. This is basically the GVWR minus the curb weight of the vehicle from the factory. The cargo capacity will also be on the manufacturers web site but be careful because it will change depending on tow vehicle options whereas the yellow sticker will be the values for your specific vehicle as built.

Trailer
Just like your tow vehicle the trailer will have a GVWR on a sticker, usually on the door and the front driver’s side of the trailer.

There is also yellow sticker with the cargo capacity. Manufacturers web sites will typically list GVWR and a dry weight and pin weight for a trailers but keep in mind the dry weight can change a lot depending on options and the pin weight is based on an empty base trailer with no options. Some manufacturers do not even include the “mandatory option” packages in the dry weight even though you cannot buy a trailer without them. A trailer as delivered can easily weight 500 or more pounds above the web site dry weight. The yellow sticker on your trailer will be the actual weight of your trailer when it left the factory.

Cargo in the trailer is not only anything you put in the trailer but the weight of any fluids in your tanks or water heater. Once you use your water heater it will hold somewhere between 5 and 10 gallons of water until you drain it, that is approximately 40 to 80 pounds of weight. Water tanks may hold 50 or even 75 gallons, that is over 400 pounds to almost 600 pounds of weight. Clothes, food, drinks, pots and pans, dishes, eating utensils, bedding, towels, etc. add up surprisingly fast. It is amazingly easy to put a thousand pounds of stuff into a trailer.

Fifth Wheel Towing
As I previously mentioned there are three numbers you must consider, and you cannot exceed any of them:

1) Tow Capacity - the trailer weight cannot exceed the tow capacity of the tow vehicle. If you are buying a new trailer or tow vehicle, I recommend planning on the GVWR of the trailer, it is easy to fill a trailer up to its capacity so be prepared to pull the trailer at maximum weight.
2) Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR) – this is the maximum allowable weight for the tow vehicle and trailer combined. If your tow vehicle is within the GVWR and the trailer is under the tow capacity, you will be fine since this number is the combination of the two.
3) Cargo Capacity – for fifth wheel towing this number will almost always limit you to a lot less than the Tow Capacity. Your tow vehicle “cargo” will be the driver, any passengers, your hitch weight, the pin weight of the fifth wheel and any other cargo in the two vehicles. The pin weight of a fifth wheel will typically be between 15% and 25% of the weight of the trailer depending on how you load it. For example my trailer fully loaded has a pin weight of 3,400 pounds, my wife and I weigh a combined 375 pounds, my fifth wheel hitch weighs 140 pounds, I have a tool box bolted into the truck bed that weighs at least 200 pounds and then I carry some other accessories and need over 4,200 pounds of cargo capacity, that is why I drive a tuck with dual rear wheels. My truck’s tow capacity is 28,000 pounds and yet pulling my 15,000 pounds fifth wheel I am close to the cargo capacity of the truck of 4,400 pounds.

Travel Trailer Towing
For travel trailer towing there are four numbers you must consider, and you cannot exceed any of them:
1) Tow Capacity - the trailer weight cannot exceed the tow capacity of the tow vehicle. If you are buying a new trailer or tow vehicle, I recommend planning on the GVWR of the trailer, it is easy to fill a trailer up to its capacity so be prepared to pull the trailer at maximum weight.
2) Gross Combined Weight Rating (GCWR) – this is the maximum allowable weight for the tow vehicle and trailer combined. If your tow vehicle is within the GVWR and the trailer is under the tow capacity, you will be fine since this number is the combination of the two.
3) Cargo Capacity – for travel trailers you will typically see 10% to 15% of the trailer weight on the hitch. The hitch weight, driver and passengers and any other cargo all count against the cargo capacity. Either this number or hitch weight will typically limit how much you can tow.
4) Hitch Capacity - this number will typically have values for with and without a weight distributing hitch. A weight distributing hitch transfers some weight to the front axles and allows more hitch weight. Either this number or cargo capacity will typically limit how much you can tow.

So, as you can see, Two Capacity is not what typically determines how much you can tow.

Now one question you may have is, what if I exceed one of these numbers when towing. The reality is people do it all the time, but the further over the limits you are the more likely you are to eventually have something break. Staying under these limits does not guarantee you won’t have something break but it is less likely. The other issue is legal, if you exceed these limits you are operating a vehicle outside of its design limits and breaking the law, I am not a lawyer and not qualified to comment on the consequences of that but if you get in a accident you could have expanded liability.

Other Considerations
A few other towing considerations:
1) Diesel Versus Gas – if you compare diesel and gas tow vehicles of the same model, the diesel vehicle will typically have twice the torque of the gas version. This will provide better acceleration and better performance going uphill. Typically, the tow rating will be higher, the fuel economy better and the fuel economy for towing a trailer versus not towing will not decrease as much. However, diesel engines are heavier, and the cargo capacity of a diesel tow vehicle will typically be lower than for a gas tow vehicle. This may allow you to tow with a lesser model, for example a GMC 2500 gas model instead of a 3500 diesel because of the additional cargo capacity.
2) Dual versus Single Rear Wheels – for the same tow vehicle the dual rear wheel version will have a higher cargo capacity than the single rear wheel versions so for heavy fifth wheels dual rear wheels range from being a good idea to being essential. There are varying opinions on this but personally I think when a fifth wheel is 15,000 pounds or heavier dual rear wheel are needed. The dual rear wheels will also provide more stability in windy environments or when a tactor trailer truck goes flying by. The downside to dual rear wheel is the fuel economy is lower, the tow vehicle is heavier and harder to park.
3) Air Bags or Timbrens – if the back of your tow vehicle sinks down too much when you hook up your trailer air bags or timbrens can help level out your ride, however, if your sagging problem is due to exceeding a weight rating these are a band aid at best and you need a heavier duty tow vehicle.
4) CAT Scales – there are CAT scales all over the country, they are set up so that when you pull on the scales you get front and rear tow vehicle axle weights and a trailer axle weight. You can quickly and easily determine whether you are exceeding either GVWR or GAWR for the tow vehicle or GCWR for both the tow vehicle and the trailer. If you then drop the trailer and pull the tow vehicle back on the scales without the trailer you can subtract the tow vehicle weight without the trailer from the tow vehicle weight with the trailer to get the pin weight. The pin weight plus the trailer axle weight is the total trailer weight. The tow vehicle weight with the trailer should not exceed the tow vehicle GVWR and the trailer axle weight plus pin weight should not exceed the trailer GVWR.

[curver900]

If you have a toyota you can "tow" a space shuttle..

[DocBrown]

Although most experienced members here know all this, it should be a sticky for new owners. I'm really glad when people ask, but it's pretty obvious from what I see on the road and in campgrounds that most people think if it says "x" towing capacity that's what I can tow.

Unfortunately when you look at trailers, dealers use the "dry weight" to determine if you can tow it.

[TCNashville]

Originally Posted by DocBrown

it's pretty obvious from what I see on the road and in campgrounds that most people think if it says "x" towing capacity that's what I can tow.

Agreed. And I'll bet that 75% of people who tow have ever heard the word payload or have any idea what it means.

[Scottenj]

Originally Posted by DocBrown

Although most experienced members here know all this, it should be a sticky for new owners. I'm really glad when people ask, but it's pretty obvious from what I see on the road and in campgrounds that most people think if it says "x" towing capacity that's what I can tow.

Unfortunately when you look at trailers, dealers use the "dry weight" to determine if you can tow it.

I find it interesting that the fourth sticky on here is about the "Actual" Tow Rating when the entire post is pretty much irrelevant.

[norty1]

Many just believe what the salesman says!

[gladecreekwy]

It’s not how much you can tow it’s how much you can stop

[KCSA75]

Originally Posted by curver900

If you have a toyota you can "tow" a space shuttle..

But it takes a Chevy to tow a 747, which is a lot bigger than a space shuttle.

[Kim Gass]

Originally Posted by gladecreekwy

It’s not how much you can tow it’s how much you can stop

yes,

I tried to explain payload and tongue weight to my neighbors who say they can tow 5000 lbs in their SUV. If the concept ever entered their head it left quickly. They want to tow a 3600 lb boat with a car full of gear and people.
There is no way out that does not involve a steep up and downhill.

[Rustic Eagle]

Originally Posted by Scottenj

I find it interesting that the fourth sticky on here is about the "Actual" Tow Rating when the entire post is pretty much irrelevant.

Scottenj,

The post is addressing the manufacture's "published" Tow Rating (Capacity) weight limit of a vehicle..., and as we all know manufacture's "published" weight limits can be misleading.

I agree with your inclusion of the Tow Rating (Capacity) within your Fifth Wheel Towing & Travel Trailer Towing list of numbers one must consider: "1) Tow Capacity - the trailer weight cannot exceed the tow capacity of the tow vehicle."

I believe the 'sticky post' will be helpful for considering one's actual Tow Rating (Capacity) weight limit.

Bob

[Marcm157]

Tow capacity is about as clear as Einsteins theory of relativity to some. As Norty said - some folks just swallow what a salesman says as gospel. Sadly, they endanger themselves and others with their lack of understanding. The vehicle manufacturers bear some responsibility for posting misleading info about "Tow Capacity" as well.

Tow capacity is just a number like Jail is just a room....

[LuckyDuck]

Originally Posted by KCSA75

But it takes a Chevy to tow a 747, which is a lot bigger than a space shuttle.

Actually the 747 is pushing the Chevy to the shop

[colby]

Originally Posted by luckyduck

actually the 747 is pushing the chevy to the shop :d

:rofl:

[Marcm157]

Originally Posted by LuckyDuck

Actually the 747 is pushing the Chevy to the shop

Outstanding!!

[Scottenj]

Originally Posted by Rustic Eagle

Scottenj,

The post is addressing the manufacture's "published" Tow Rating (Capacity) weight limit of a vehicle..., and as we all know manufacture's "published" weight limits can be misleading.

I agree with your inclusion of the Tow Rating (Capacity) within your Fifth Wheel Towing & Travel Trailer Towing list of numbers one must consider: "1) Tow Capacity - the trailer weight cannot exceed the tow capacity of the tow vehicle."

I believe the 'sticky post' will be helpful for considering one's actual Tow Rating (Capacity) weight limit.

Bob

The point I am making is for fifth wheels, tow capacity almost never matters at all because how much you can safely tow is almost always limited to a much lower number by payload capacity. I think your post helps to perpetuate the myth that tow capacity is the key number.

There was recently a post in the fifth wheel forum from a guy who was having all kinds of towing issues and he thought his tow vehicle was OK because the tow capacity was greater than his trailer weight. After several people asked him questions it became clear that his truck was way over it's payload capacity.

[RogerR]

My Jeep mentioned one thing I think is often missed. That is wind drag reducing total payload. If you had zero wind drag (flatbed loaded with lead ingots to your max weight) you might meet what the manufacturer allows. But every square foot of frontal area reduces the pulling capacity, increases fuel use and slows acceleration.

[ALJO]

Christ said raise your consciousness - 2000 years later they still do what they feel like.
He even told the path - no one listen.
Even if a salesman says you can't pull it - they still want the trailer, special this year was bad. Even if the weight figures are correct - it doesn't mean you feel comfortable during the tow.

[bankr63]

Originally Posted by Scottenj

The point I am making is for fifth wheels, tow capacity almost never matters at all because how much you can safely tow is almost always limited to a much lower number by payload capacity. I think your post helps to perpetuate the myth that tow capacity is the key number.

And further limited by RGAWR. The payload capacity listed generally assumes a well distributed load. A 5er puts all that pin weight directly over the rear axle, and is more likely to overload the rear axle even if the pin is lower than payload. Some manufacturers list pin weights in their towing guides which (I assume) take into account that load distribution.

[CAG]

I stopped reading the OPs entry about 3 paragraphs in. It is really good information but there are so many calculators on-line to help you figure out what your vehicle can tow and what you should be towing. Or what RV you should be buying for your TV. I know, I know, we all like to add our knowledge to the list in the thread but the info is there and so few seem to find it or be directed to it.

[curver900]

Originally Posted by LuckyDuck

Actually the 747 is pushing the Chevy to the shop

I think it is a Ford in drag.....