Towing advice

[Janet224]

Hi,

I know you probably see many posts regarding towing. I have poured through a few and decided to post my own questions. I have many but I will try to select the most important to start. I am not as knowledgeable as I should be but I am trying to learn. I'm on information overload right now!

This spring I purchased an Eagle HT 27.5 RKDS fifth wheel. From the factory 8000lbs. GVWR 9950. I have a Pullrite 16k auto slide hitch.

The camper dealer assured me my half ton Ram Big Horn 5.7 hemi would tow. And it does. However, I have a 2011 which has a tow capacity of 8750. I had a Timbren system added to my vehicle. Which helped. I feel like I have the power for the most part. I don't currently do a ton of hills but I do fairly well. I do think I would value more power.

Currently I do not travel far. I don't intend to go cross country with it but would potentially travel the east coast in retirement. I just don't feel comfortable towing. I know I am pushing my truck to the limit. So I am truck shopping.

I am struggling with 2500 vs. 1500.

I would like to stay in a 1500. Newer 1500s have towing capacity of at least 10500. Could be more with the right equipment. Yet Ram 1500s still have the 5.7 hemi which is what I have now so I'm having trouble understanding why they can tow more.

I don't need to stick with Ram. Willing to get the make that does the job I need. Some 1500s come with a 6.0 engine. Car and camper dealers tell me 1500 would do it because I am under towing capacity. I have not weighed my camper with cargo. I find it hard to believe I have more than 1,000 lbs, but in the future I may carry more ... like water, more stuff .... I don't haul water now. I'm guessing I am probably around 8700 right now and I think I am being generous. I'm told the average camper carriers about 1000lbs. We are just two people, no kids.

I have been looking at 2500s. I feel like that would be a safer ride. When looking at 2500s my camper dealer told me I have to be careful because of the height of the bed. Based on the pin height on the camper I need to be at 50.5 inches at the bed rail to be level towing. Seems like the 2500s I have looked at are much higher than that. I am pretty level right now with my current vehicle that sags in the bed and feel like s 2500 would be higher and sag less so I would be way off.

Also wondering about Rams with Ramboxes. I found a nice 2500 with a lower back end but it has boxes. Car dealer says it won't be an issue (of course). Reading some forums people say the changed their hitch to the Reese Revolution. My camper dealer tells me I can't change the hitch after manufacturing.

So, sorry for the long-winded post ... wondering what thoughts you have to help out a frustrated camper who feels a little trapped.

[NCMFFD]

Originally Posted by Janet224

This spring I purchased an Eagle HT 27.5 RKDS fifth wheel. From the factory 8000lbs. GVWR 9950. I have a Pullrite 16k auto slide hitch.

The camper dealer assured me my half ton Ram Big Horn 5.7 hemi would tow. And it does. However, I have a 2011 which has a tow capacity of 8750. I had a Timbren system added to my vehicle. Which helped. I used to sag about 4 inches. Now I sag under 2. I feel like I have the power for the most part. I don't currently do a ton of hills but I do fairly well. I do think I would value more power.

Congratulations on the new purchase but I'm going to say that the new FW maxed out your available payload of the TV when the rear end dropped 4". Most trucks have no problem with towing the weight, it's the rest of the combination of stopping and carrying the weight.

Best thing to do now would be to go to the CAT scale and see what your numbers are. Best of Luck to you.

[2nOZ]

We've been looking at a 28.5 HT. We have a 2017 F250 Lariat Fx4 off road with the 6.2 gas and 20" tires. The truck sits tall. 60 inches from ground to the side rails! We thought it sat too high for a FW. We took the truck to our dealer yesterday. They sat a Reese pro series in the bed and hooked up the FW. The FW has the Reese revolution pin box. After they sat the FW down on the hitch, we had 8" of clearance between the FW and the side rails. The FW sat 4" high in the front. With the bedliner removed, that lowers the front an inch and with the hitch adjusted, we would be level with about 6" of clearance. We thought it was totally out of the question with our truck. But it is not, as others have found out and posted through the forum. The dealer is correct about the revolution being installed at the factory. However, you can get the Reese Sidewinder which is a replacement for whatever pin box is on there and it does the same thing the Revolution does. Hope this helps. We found out quite a lot yesterday in our search.

[RedHorse1]

Originally Posted by NCMFFD

Best thing to do now would be to go to the CAT scale and see what your numbers are. Best of Luck to you.

2X on the CAT Scale. The CAT Scale is your friend.

[dee]

Seems your issue is payload, not towing capacity, which almost always the issue with the way trucks are rated.

I could be wrong, but most 5th wheel have 15-20 percent of their weight on the pin. That's easily 1800 pounds, then you add passengers, and your hitch and you are likely over 2000 pounds. How does that compare to what is on you door sticker?

That is nearing the payload numbers of a cummins ram 2500, although they have a bit of margin imho. The gas engine has more payload, due to the lighter engine.

[nwminnesota]

Why even look at the 1/2 ton truck. You have a 5th wheel now. Buy the 3/4 ton or a 1 ton. You won't regret having the bigger truck. I don't think anybody has every said I wish I would have bought the smaller truck....It will be an enjoyable experience towing then a worrying experience. Always take a look at the payload of the truck as well.

[Janet224]

I would do a 3/4 ton but camper dealer is telling me they will be too high and I will be off level by quite a bit. Say I have to be at 50.5 side rails and 2500 is 5-8 inches higher.

[bdreinv]

If you are considering a 3/4 ton, I would spend a few extra bucks a go one ton.We have a 06 3500 Ram 4x4 dully new never regretted it. Once it was paid off!

[klpoppe]

"The camper dealer assured me my half ton Ram Big Horn 5.7 hemi would tow."

There is part of your problem. Yeah, it will "tow" the camper. They do not care about considering safety and weight capacities of the tow vehicle. All they care about is you making it off the lot. I fell for that same line when I bought a camper - way too much for the truck I had but they assured me it would be ok. Like others have said, get your weights and see where everything stands.

[Ruth]

I agree with the others. We have a 27.5 RKDS with the Reese Revolution pin box and a Reese Titan 16K non slider in our 07 Silverado 2500HD. We tow a bit nose high, but have no problems towing in New England. My signature has our TV specs. I would not agree with these dealers who say the HT line is half ton towable. I feel that most would be over payload and taxing the suspensions of the TV making for unsafe towing IMHO..

[wags999]

People get tow capacity and load capacity mixed up. Towing capacity is the least of your concerns...most anything can drag it down the road. If you look at your drivers side door jamb you should see a sticker normally yellow, telling you what load your truck can carry including passengers and cargo and the trailer hitch and weight of the trailer on the truck. Typically this is exceeded far before you exceed the "towing capacity" of your vehicle. I would suspect your over or very close to being over towing a 5th wheel with a 1/2 ton truck. Good Luck.

[Rustic Eagle]

Janet,

Welcome to JOF

Originally Posted by Janet224

snip...... Some 1500s come with a 6.0 engine.....snip

Just a little FYI (off subject) on the 6.0L (or 6.2L) gasser's in the GM 1500's.., they are not the same 6.0L engine in the 2500's. But, the 1500 6.0L (or 6.2L) is much better then the 5.3L !

IMO a 3/4 ton's increased payload capacity is a much better match for an Eagle HT FW under moderate to heavy loading habits. Most FW loaded pin weights are 20% -25% of the CAT scale gross weight.

Bob

[2nOZ]

Originally Posted by Janet224

I would do a 3/4 ton but camper dealer is telling me they will be too high and I will be off level by quite a bit. Say I have to be at 50.5 side rails and 2500 is 5-8 inches higher.

Please see my previous post on height of bed rails, hitches and pin boxes based on our experience this weekend. Not saying all will be this way but it will work for us.

[Janet224]

I appreciate everyone's feedback. My camper is already in storage so hard to get weight at this point. Might need to wait until spring!

Anyone with experience with Ramboxes?

[Bookemdanno]

Originally Posted by Janet224

I appreciate everyone's feedback. My camper is already in storage so hard to get weight at this point. Might need to wait until spring!

Anyone with experience with Ramboxes?

Check on the Dodge Cummins Diesel Forum. There's a guy on there that installed the factory puck system on a Ram Box bed. He hasn't had any problems.

Also, I feel your pain with regards to your TV. We purchased a 28BHBE and towed with the DW's SUV a few times. After that I sold my Mustang and purchased a Ram 2500. Then we bought our current 377...so again I found myself in the same spot...so I now have a 3500 dually.

[vcbice]

We did the same years ago with a smaller fiver. 7500lb with a 1/2T. Maxed out. It towed ok but nothing extra left over.

FYI, part of the towing capacity is the strength of the engine, transmission and axles as well as the brakes.

Yes, if you buy a 4x4 the bed will probably be higher. If it concerns you then get a 2WD truck as they have lower beds and some can be lowered more. If you can find one, RAM had the air suspension system option which allows you to keep the truck level as the load is added.

My trailer rides a little high in the front. Not a big deal for me.

[MadJoker TX]

Did the same here, bought my first trailer and towed a few times with my wife’s Nissan Armada and blew the factory airbags twice, them decided an F150 was the ticket to a better tow, found the suspension to soft so upgraded to an F250 until I bought the 377 now I have an F350 Dually.


2017 NorthPoint 377RLBH
2017 F350 FX4 DRW 6.7 PSD
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGW...jCx2yKWbNHxFpQ

[smurfs_of_war]

Have you asked the RV dealers around you about an axle flip on the 5th wheel? That will give you more height.

You're definitely out of 150/1500 territory in my opinion. 250/2500- definitely. 3500? Well maybe- but it may be overkill unless you plan on going bigger.

The 1500s are awesome little trucks! I loved my Ram 1500 and I wish I still had it 97% of the time. The other 3% is when I am towing and realize why I wanted a 2500.

I tow a TT that grosses roughly 5700lbs with a 2500 Ram. The GVWR numbers didn't lie. When hitched with my family on board and all the other "junk" I was 1000lbs over GVWR for the 1500. I couldn't imagine a 5th wheel on any 150/1500 and I have owned recent iterations from all of the big 3 so it's not brand biased. Sure, I see it all the time, but I also have done my fair share of axle rebuilds on the farm and I see first hand what an overloaded axle looks like inside and what happens when (not if) they decide to give out while driving. Also consider your poor transmission! Just don't do it.

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[need-a-vacation]

Janet,

Welcome!!!

I know you stated the rignis already stored for the winter, so I would highly suggest holding off buying a new truck until you can weigh the truck and 5r at a CAT Scale as mentioned. You will want to get two weight, Truck only and truck hooked up with the 5r. That way you know exactly what the 5 weighs, and can figure out how much your loaded pin weight adds to the trucks payload.

What does the yellow sticker in the drivers door jamb state the payload for your truck is? Whill be “All day ccjpants and cargo not to exceed XXXXlbs”... just how much is it? The Jayco site doesn’t list the dry pin weight, it I would guesstimate your loaded pin weight is about 1800lbs also. This adds to the truck, along with you and your “better half”, the 5r hitch, and any other cargo in the truck cab or bed.

I don’t see how a 1500/150 is able to stay under the ratings (not the tow rating) without being a GM Max Tow (still not sure this would be enough) or the F150 with the max tow AND the hd payload package. That would give a payload up to maybe 2500lbs (estimate!!!) depending on the cab/bed combo.

As for the Ram Boxes, you will need the Reese Sidewinder or Revolution (what ever it may be called) for the 5r to work with the Ram Box. My buddy went through a big ordeal over towing a 5r with the Ram Boxes. He “listened” to the dealer salesman (like you did about your 1500!) and went with the Pull Rite slider hitch. Pin box hit his bed rail.... He ended up having a weld shop rebuild the pin box, and lift his 5r so it was level. Cost about it $1k, at the family rate! He should have gone with the Reese pin box like he had read online, but listened to his salesman who stated “he called the hitch company and it would work just fine!!!”.

Is there any way to get the 5r out just to weigh it at the scale?

I know you state what the dealer said about the bed rail height, but there is a lot of other factors that are more important. Cross the bed rail issue after finding a truck to safely handle the rig.

[kayakterp]

If I read your original post correctly, even your tow capacity is maxed out. Not to mention your payload.
Definitely need a 3/4 ton truck. Just hope it won't be your daily driver as that's where it becomes more expensive for weekly gas bills
Please don't go by what any salesperson tells you, always best to do your own research. This is an awesome forum to get good honest advice, hope you get to have plenty good memories with your RV
Good luck