Truck Help!

[spoon059]

Originally Posted by Shall36

Caveats:
- the GM and Fords are derated; Ram uses a different rear suspension setup in the 2500 that likely has less real capacity than their 3500 setup
- 250/2500s can come with wheel and tire packages that have lower real weight ratings than the 350/3500 counterparts

After 2014, the Ram 2500 came with a rear coil suspension that is rated for 6500 lbs (with 18" rims"). The SRW 3500 with leaf suspension is 7000 lbs. 500 lbs actual difference, 2500 lbs on paper.

[bap]

One piece of information that would help in the decision process is how much you plan on towing and how much you are going to use for just daily driving. The newer diesels with the DEF systems don’t like a lot of short daily drives (less than 10-15 miles) on a regular basis because they don’t warm up enough to burn off the emissions that accumulate. Many of the gas engines have plenty of power to pull big loads quite effectively. As far as size, a lot of times it does not cost much more to jump from a 3/4 ton to 1 ton single rear wheel truck. Dual wheel is a bigger difference. Whatever brand you choose will be a great truck because nowadays they are all good in order to be competitive. The best thing to do is to try them all out and see how much you like the layout of the controls, seats, and visibility. Each brand is different.

[GrumpyDad]

Originally Posted by Shall36

For the GM and for the most part, Ford, the 250/350 and 2500/3500 classifications are just that...classifications on paper. If you travel through areas where they check weights, yes, you need to have paperwork that says you paid for a certain GVWR and possibly may have to show you have a truck with a certain rated capacity. Otherwise, the payload figures on the 250/2500 trucks are low because the GVWR is capped at 10000#s for classification purposes. Payload = GVWR - weight of the truck when ready to load. My 9 year old confirmed that if we lower the GVWR (to put the truck in a specific registration class), the payload number gets smaller. BTW, Ford let’s you spec a variety of GVWR ratings on the 350 for registration purposes. Same truck, different paperwork for the DMV.

So why not just buy the 350/3500 out of the gate? All other things equal, you should...But....

- depending on your location, 350/3500 could cost more to insure and register
- depending on your location, there may be access restrictions to parkways and residential areas with a 350/3500
- depending on your state, you may have to register as a commercial vehicle and depending on your neighborhood, you may be restricted from parking a commercial vehicle there overnight
- 250/2500s are much more plentiful, both used and new, which can impact both price and selection for used and off the lot buyers

In my personal situation, there’s little impact to me if I go 2500 or 3500 as far as rules and taxes and stuff. But where I live, finding a 3500 used is tough and finding a new 3500 with a 6.5’ bed is tough.

Caveats:
- the GM and Fords are derated; Ram uses a different rear suspension setup in the 2500 that likely has less real capacity than their 3500 setup
- 250/2500s can come with wheel and tire packages that have lower real weight ratings than the 350/3500 counterparts
- the GM and Ford 250/2500 versions do have slightly less spring capacity with the GM having one less leaf in the spring pack (not sure about the Ford, but I believe it is the same thing). Spring tweaks are relatively cheap and easy if actually needed. Many folks add Sumos or Timbrens even when within posted capacity to improve ride and/or address sagging.
- RAWR and rear tire capacity, which can be identical across the platforms, need to be watched.

Anyone shopping would be wise to check out the brand specific truck boards regarding the real differences between the model trucks. There’s MUCH better information out there than on the RV boards...IMO.

Good luck to the OP on snagging a truck. I hope you get a great deal. If going GM, you should be able to get about 18% off MSRP.

This is a good summary. Where I live, there is no tax/isurance/registration difference between 3/4 and 1 ton trucks, so it makes little sense for anyone planning to tow or haul to get a the 3/4 ton version. That's my opinion, your situation may vary.

[Loboclone]

I didn't fool around, went and ordered an F450 in 2014 the way I wanted it. Bigger everything and pull a 4212 Seismic easily. Now at 86,000 mile and hasn't missed a beat.

[norty1]

Originally Posted by JayJ

Thanks for the replies. I test drove a Ram with a Cummins and a Duramax today on to the Ford next week, definitely going with the diesel.

Then I amend my answer to a 1 ton SRW crew cab.

[KillerIsMe]

As Senior Member bap said above a consideration of diesel vs. gas is driving habits. As I understand it diesels have exhaust filters that accumulate soot, and the exhaust needs to be run hot enough to burn that soot off. Short bursts of driving don't allow for the burn-off and you would have to do it manually periodically. That's my understanding anyway, and because the majority of my driving is within 15 miles of home it's the main reason I went with a gas engine. As others have said there isn't much of a price difference among 150/250/350 trucks. Having had an f150 and now an f350 I can tell you the gas mileage is miserable on the 350 and the ride is not at all car-like, but it's dramatically bigger, heavier, and more stable. I looked at f250's but was ultimately swayed by the 4200 lb. payload of the 350. I like Fords, but just because they're familiar. I'm sure you can't go wrong on the brand. Enjoy your search.

[bdreinv]

06 Ram 3500 bought new on second fiver,no major issues!

[Dave A]

Originally Posted by bap

One piece of information that would help in the decision process is how much you plan on towing and how much you are going to use for just daily driving. The newer diesels with the DEF systems don’t like a lot of short daily drives (less than 10-15 miles) on a regular basis because they don’t warm up enough to burn off the emissions that accumulate. Many of the gas engines have plenty of power to pull big loads quite effectively. As far as size, a lot of times it does not cost much more to jump from a 3/4 ton to 1 ton single rear wheel truck. Dual wheel is a bigger difference. Whatever brand you choose will be a great truck because nowadays they are all good in order to be competitive. The best thing to do is to try them all out and see how much you like the layout of the controls, seats, and visibility. Each brand is different.

Great Advice! DEF does make a difference, if it was a daily driver the diesel is probably not the way to go. I drive a diesel and love it, I think my wife may even be getting jealous.

A big consideration would be a GOOD dealer, no matter what the brand.

[scotte303]

Originally Posted by cfisher523

Before I offer my opinion I need to lead in with two things... (1)All the current 3/4 Ton (which is what you'll need at a minimum) pickups are capable. (2) I am GM loyal and most people who will weigh in on this will be brand loyal for one reason or another. That being said, here is my opinion...

The length of trailer(s) you are considering is not as important as the weight. If you are looking at "lite" models you're probably in the GVWR nieghborhood of 11k to 13k - give or take, and a 3/4 Ton pickup will likely get the job done without issue. If you are looking at luxury models its entirely possible that the same "size" trailer(s) could be 14k to 16k or more and now you are shopping for a 1 Ton truck. Also, don't forget you need to count all the weight you already have in your truck (you, your family, pets, etc.) against the available payload and remember that springs are not the only difference between weight classes of trucks, brake systems are critical to stopping your GCW.

Now, on to brand. I prefer the GM trucks, and for towing a 5th wheel I would strongly suggest you consider a diesel. In my opinion, the GM vehicles offer more creature comforts in a more astheticly pleasing package than the other brands. Pair that with a nicer loaded ride than Ford and a more reliable drivetrain than Dodge and you have a great vehicle to travel in. I feel that even the higher end packages in the Ford still feel like a work truck inside and while the Dodge's look nice I don't believe their quality is on par with GM - Also, Dodge offers about a million different builds/packages which can make selecting a vehicle a major project whereas GM (Ford too) keep it pretty simple; for example a Chevy will have trim levels LS, LT1, LT2, and LTZ. You will have double the choices with trim levels on Dodge, but Ford will be about the same.

Once you have your truck consider replacing the shocks. In my experience (limited to Fords and GM) the stock shocks are terrible and you will experience porpoising when heavily loaded. Look into a good set of Bilstiens or Rancho shocks. I am also a big fan of timbrens for load leveling purposes. They basically function like air bags except they are only engaged when the vehicle is heavily loaded so they don't impact ride quality when the vehicle is unloaded. Don't count on bags/timbrens/etc. to make up payload deficiencies, remember springs are not the only difference in truck classes.

Picking a truck to tow your RV is very much a personal decision. Don't go strictly based on what you see here. I'm sure I'll be put on blast at some point about why GMs are garbage - in my experience they have not been and have given me tens of thousands of miles of headache free travels, but I have no doubt there is someone on this board that had a lemon, or two. It happens.

As you do your research decide whats most important to you and remember that as you look at HD trucks, look at what they are made of in terms of critical components. Who makes the transmission (sure is nice having an Allison in the GM), the motor (Duramax which is really an Isuzu, Cummins, etc.), how comfotable is the interior for you - can you reach critical controls easily and does the layout work for you to operate the vehicle with little effort.

Drive each of the major brands yourself. Its a big investment, take your time and try them out and if a dealer give you a hard time about test driving a $50k+ vehicle then find a new dealer. People will swear one brand is better than other, but they are all capable trucks.

Besides all this great information check the height of the bed and rails prior to purchase. I saw forums where guys bought the fords only to find out there campers were riding high in the front. Even after all adjustments and raising the suspension of there camper.I was a Ford guy my entire life, was looking into the 2017 and found out the bed sat about 3" higher then the 2016's , I ended up with a 3500 GMC Denali diesel dually and couldnt be happier.

[bigedlittle]

I agree with most of the above comments about each of the trucks. My only addition is that if you go with a diesel truck, as soon as you run out of warranty. Fully delete the egr system and you too can get 600,000 miles out of your truck!!

[j2ponies]

Wow! What good answers all. I agree, find what fits you. When I drove big trucks,I found that the Peterbuilt wasn't good for me. I loved the truck but I'm small.When my feet reached the petals my stomach was against the steering wheel. The KW fit me better. I felt more in control.Both are excellent trucks but I had to find my fit. I've had Chevy,Dodge and Ford. I stay with Ford. I have a King Ranch F350 because I loved the look, feel and the saddle leather seats (need to stay on top of keeping them conditioned). and had everything I needed for anything I waned to tow or haul.I don't like that it feels like a work truck when empty, however that is what it was made for. On the broken roads we have it feels like it can beat my brains out when empty. .When I went through Missouri on smooth roads it drove like a dream. When loaded it's a dream.l My brother has a GMC with the Duramax.. I love it. It is beautiful. Like they said they will all do the job if you get enough truck for the job. I personally would go with a 1ton dually. Best for towing .I always want to have more than enough rather than not enough. When you get in a storm of some kind out there, and you will sometime, best to have the equipment you need.After reading these comments, I think I'll look into replacing my springs!!
It has to fit your needs. None of us will be there. I wish you all the best in your decisions.

[Fleetman]

Ditto on the Ford, I too was a GM fan for years, until I needed torque. The Ford 6.7 w/6 speed is awesome. As a 20 year fleet maintenance manager, stay away from the Ram. Engine is great, but that's where it ends.

[BrokeDown]

I am Ford loyal BUT: A friend of my purchased a F250 gasser and it is a great truck. He then purchased a 2018 Jayco 317RLOK. When he left my resort, we noticed that he was nose up just a bit. On his way home he stopped for gas a heard the dreaded scraping noise, it was the 13'6" over hang scraping on his front AC unit. When he got home, he measured it and the AC was 13'10". They are going to put a low profile AC unit on the front of his trailer to solve this problem.


Here is the point, the nose of the trailer need a minimum of 6 inches of clearance over your bed side rails. Measure your trailer when it is level from the bottom of the nose to the ground. If your truck side rails don't leave 6 inches of space, pick another truck. For example, if your trailer nose measures 68 inches, your bed rails should be 62 or less inches.


-B

[sail154]

Originally Posted by JayJ

I need some opinion on a new pickup. First let me say i am not Brand Loyal so i want to buy the best tool for the job. I plan on pulling a 30 to 34 ft fifth wheel . With that said please provide some information on pulling ability, ride loaded and empty and any information a first timer new to the RV life needs to make a informed decision.
Thanks in advance

For those of us who trailer this is a significant decision. As some have already stated, there are many factors to consider. Based on what you will read and see it is pretty safe to say all three major truck manufacturers make a reasonably good product and many responses will be based on owner loyalty to a brand. If you choose to go with a diesel power plant, it is difficult to find a better power train than the Ram offers with its Cummins 6.7 turbocharged in-line 6 and the Aisin transmission. Cummins has a long history of manufacturing diesel power plants for the commercial trucking industry including Peterbuilt. The vast majority of commercial trucks on the road use the in-line 6 design because of the longer stroke, increased compression, and better balance over the V-8 design. Both Ford and Chevy feature V-8 power plants and neither manufacturer and the engines they offer, i.e. Duramax and Powerstroke, have the commercial truck applications and history that the Cummins has.

[LeonDawn]

Never go with adequate! I just traveled 2500 miles from Texas to Washington. 09 Dodge Ram3500 single axel Pinnacle 36FBTS. Not a lightweight 5er! My friend in a 12 Ford F250 pulling a lighter 5er had a hard time on some of real long downgrades. My Dodge kept me below 50mph all the way down. The Ford didnt do as well. Made a true believer out of both of us!!

[rkelly]

I have a 2017 F-350 dually and love it! We pull a pinnacle 37RSTS that weights 16,200 and it does a great job and it is the most comfortable truck I have owned

[topshelfredlabel]

Originally Posted by LeonDawn

Never go with adequate! I just traveled 2500 miles from Texas to Washington. 09 Dodge Ram3500 single axel Pinnacle 36FBTS. Not a lightweight 5er! My friend in a 12 Ford F250 pulling a lighter 5er had a hard time on some of real long downgrades. My Dodge kept me below 50mph all the way down. The Ford didnt do as well. Made a true believer out of both of us!!

let me guess ... you have the engine brake, rt? I have a '10 2500 RAM 6.7 with the 6 speed manual and engine brake and I absolutely love it. It makes towing fun. Down shifting to 4th and letting the engine brake do its thing keeps me between 40-45 mph coming out of the mountains on the steeper grades wo ever touching the brakes - GCW around 19k lbs. Its awesome.

[KillerIsMe]

Originally Posted by bigedlittle

I agree with most of the above comments about each of the trucks. My only addition is that if you go with a diesel truck, as soon as you run out of warranty. Fully delete the egr system and you too can get 600,000 miles out of your truck!!

I fondly remember knowing I was going to live that long

[BJR]

Oh so easy spending OPM.

You're looking at a bunch of different numbers but as it's often said you will run out of payload before you run out of tow capacity. Take the 29.5BHDS for example. It's about 35' feet overall and comes in at 10,130 GVWR. If you figure 20 percent pin weight you're talking 2,026 lb at the pin.

10k is well below my tow capacity (14k 5th wheel) but what about payload? My Silverado's door sticker says I have a 2,652 payload capacity. If I subtract the two I have about 625 for family, cooler, firewood, hitch, bikes, kayaks, whatever. I would not make it. In reality, I loaded up the camper and truck for a worst-case-scenario week long camping trip and found out my available tongue/pin weight is more like 1,520. If I was dead set on a 5th wheel I'd have limited options, but bumper pulls come with much lower tongue weights. (Figure 13 - 15 percent)

The Silverado 2500/3500 needs a refresh. The 6.slow gasser is low HP and drinks gas like it's going out of style. The diesel is a good option but eats into your payload capacity so many recommend the 3500 if you're into the diesel. I don't know that I could recommend getting the gasser but I favor the GMs and did not drive a Ford. (I'll never buy a Dodge) To have some fun, go on Youtube and watch the Fast Lane videos for various models running the gauntlet.

It's a little of chicken and the egg for you right now. First step is to find the camper that you would die if you didn't have then find the truck that can tow it.

[RVhiker]

Sounds like either gas or diesel might work for you.

I've driven a 30 foot long, 9000 pound, fifth wheel with a 6.0L 3/4 ton Chevy gasser and with a 6.6L 3/4 ton diesel. Both will tug it down the highway and up and down hills. The diesel is much, much easier to drive because of the extra torque and horsepower.

The diesel is much more capable driving up (and in controlling speed driving down) hills as well as more likely to maintain a reasonable speed up hills. The diesel has slightly better fuel mileage.