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Old 05-07-2013, 01:48 PM   #21
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Tires are stamped: Goodyear HMG2020 in big letters, smaller letters say, "Property of U_HAUL Not for Sale". Each tire is rated to a maximum of 2040 lbs at 65 psi. The installer at Discount Tire noted that they were significantly stiffer than the stock tires that came on the trailer. He said they should definitely tow better.
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Old 06-02-2013, 06:56 PM   #22
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Bob,

I want to thank you and everyone else for their replies to my initial post above. I want to follow with a few more questions now that Iíve been to the scales this past weekend during the first trip in our new 27DSRL. The trip by the the way went very well and we only came up with a few minor things to address with our dealer at some point. The attached photo is as we were getting ready to pull out of our campsite last Monday, the only sunny day of the holiday weekend up in the MA Berkshire mountains.

Before the trip I was able to weigh the nearly loaded TV/TT combination at a local recycling center on a single large scale and found I was at 12,100#, or 86% of my Avalancheís 14,000 GCWR. So I thought I was starting off at a fairly good point.

What I found out at the truck stop scale was:

1) Loaded TV weight: 6,380# (3,260 FA, 3,120 RA)
2) Loaded TV/TT combination weight, WD bars engaged: 12,640# (3,120 FA. 4,000 RA, 5,520 TT)
3) Loaded TV/TT combination weight, WD bars disengaged: 12,680# (2,840 FA. 4,420 RA, 5,420 TT)

Based on this I used your calculations and came up with a loaded TT weight of 6,280# (using the average of the two GCWs), a loaded tongue weight of 880# (14.0% weight ratio) and found I'm at about 90% of the Avalancheís GCWR. So with this information, the questions I have now are:

1) The TV GVWR is 7,200# and based on the loaded TV weight and the tongue weight, I appear to be over by about 60#. Iím thinking I need to move a bit of gear out of the front pass and store it in other more aft areas of the TT.
2) The TV/TT combination looks level with the spring bars (800# trunnion) of the Reese HP dual cam WD hitch parallel to the frame on the 5th link up from the bar. However I was wondering if the WD hitch is adjusted optimally since Iím near the Avalancheís 4,100# RAWR while the loaded TV weight is about equally distributed on both axles when unhitched.
3) The 4,000# on the rear axle made the rear tires really squat and my tire shop recommended increasing the rear tire (P275/55R20) pressure to 45# and the front to 40# to compensate. I was wondering if there is anything else I should be doing when towing, such as installing the coil spring air bag inserts Iíve read about.
4) The GVW of my delivered TT is 5,910# versus 5,400# spec while the GVWR of 7,500# GVWR is the same as spec However, I noticed the GAWR is only 7,000# and was wondering if the tongue weight makes up the remainder of the GVWR.

Thanks very much.

Spray56
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Old 06-02-2013, 09:10 PM   #23
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Spray56,

Great effort on getting your TV/TT weight results from the CAT scale!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spray56 View Post
snip...... came up with a loaded TT weight of 6,280# (using the average of the two GCWs), a loaded tongue weight of 880# .....snip
Your actual loaded TT weight, including tongue weight is: (12,640lbs - 6,380lbs) = 6,260lbs

Your correct, a loaded tongue weight of 880lbs (on the hitch ball)..., but your RV dealer provided WDH/Dual Cam is rated at 800lbs, which is under rated for your TT. I would inform your RV dealership that they need to provide you with a WDH/Dual Cam rated at 1,200lbs (at no cost to you).

NOTE: In many cases it only involves exchanging the spring bars, not the entire WDH/Dual Cam assembly. May have to tweak the cam arm adjustment to get the 1,200lb bars centered over the cam surface.

Also, (13% to 15%) of 6,260lbs = 813lbs to 939lbs for a recommended loaded tongue weight, and at 880lbs your in the sweet spot... the best place to be!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spray56 View Post
snip...... 1) The TV GVWR is 7,200# and based on the loaded TV weight and the tongue weight, I appear to be over by about 60#. I’m thinking I need to move a bit of gear out of the front pass and store it in other more aft areas of the TT.....snip
Actually you are 80lbs under your TV's GVWR when hitched, w/WD's engaged; (7,200lbs - 7,120lbs) = 80lbs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spray56 View Post
snip...... 2) The TV/TT combination looks level with the spring bars (800# trunnion) of the Reese HP dual cam WD hitch parallel to the frame on the 5th link up from the bar. However I was wondering if the WD hitch is adjusted optimally since I’m near the Avalanche’s 4,100# RAWR while the loaded TV weight is about equally distributed on both axles when unhitched......snip
Your TV when "unhitched" has a FA of 3,260lbs, but when hitched/engaged the FA is 3,120lbs. IMO I would tilt your WDH ball mount "one" more position toward the TT, but keep the same 5 chain links under tension..., doing this will remove a little more weight off the TV rear axle distributing most to the TV front axle and some to the TT axles. The objective is to get closer to the original unhitched TV FA of 3,260lbs without exceeding it (you presently have a 140lb delta).

NOTE: If you go with a WDH rated at 1,200lbs, don't change the WDH ball mount tilt angle, the added force of the 1,200lb spring bars at 5 links under tension may be enough.

Check your GM owners manual, some of the newer GM vehicles when using a WDH may recommend that "not all of the weight removed from the TV FA has to be replace (ie; fender height measurments)"..., IMO getting closer to the original FA unhitched weight will be fine, and may be to your advantage.

Don't worry about obtaining equal TV axle squat, and/or equal weight distribution to both TV axles, the objective of the WDH is to address the loss of weight over the TV's front axle do to the weight of the TT tongue being placed on the hitch ball. When a WDH is adjusted correctly most TV's will squat a little in the rear (1"-2" depending on suspension). Leveling the TT is accomplished by moving the WDH ball mount up or down on the draw bar.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spray56 View Post
snip......3) The 4,000# on the rear axle made the rear tires really squat and my tire shop recommended increasing the rear tire (P275/55R20) pressure to 45# and the front to 40# to compensate. I was wondering if there is anything else I should be doing when towing, such as installing the coil spring air bag inserts I’ve read about.....snip
From a TV handling standpoint the tires should be at maximum PSI.., but a set of "LT" will give you much better TV handling characteristics. LT tires have a stiffer sidewall design than "P" tires, thus reducing that spongy feel when under load.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Spray56 View Post
snip......4) The GVW of my delivered TT is 5,910# versus 5,400# spec while the GVWR of 7,500# GVWR is the same as spec However, I noticed the GAWR is only 7,000# and was wondering if the tongue weight makes up the remainder of the GVWR.....snip
The TT GAWR of 7,000lbs is taking into consideration that the tongue weight is supported by the TV, not the TT axles while in tow.

In summary, it appears that your TV/TT combination is doable, but with some very controlled and limited loaded weights under ideal towing conditions. What also plays into towing at/or near one's TV weight limits is our personal towing expectations of our TV under different towing conditions (weather, speed, mountains, etc.).

Bob
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Old 06-09-2013, 09:43 AM   #24
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Bob,

Thanks again for the reply. When you mention tilting the ball one more position, are you referring to the groove or teeth that are on the side of the ball mount. I printed off and read the Reese installation directions and they say each step changes the height at the end of the spring bar by one inch, so I can see that this will lower the end of the spring bar and apply more leverage when raised up by the chain. BTW, I spoke to Reese tech support after reading your comment and the person thought I was within the design capability of the 800# spring bar and didn't recommend going to the 1200# spring bar due to the affect it would have on the ride. In the end, I just want to make sure I'm within design parameters for all the components and not presenting any undue safety risk, which is why I really appreciate everyone's comments based on their experiences.

Thanks again,
David
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Old 06-09-2013, 02:41 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spray56 View Post
snip....Thanks again for the reply. When you mention tilting the ball one more position, are you referring to the groove or teeth that are on the side of the ball mount.....snip
David,

Yes..., moving just one groove position makes a big difference, so going one position at a time is best.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spray56 View Post
snip.... I spoke to Reese tech support after reading your comment and the person thought I was within the design capability of the 800# spring bar and didn't recommend going to the 1200# spring bar due to the affect it would have on the ride ......snip
Interesting..., did he comment that an under rated spring bar can compromise weight distribution effectiveness (I had to put that out there )? I guess one can trust his judgment that being 80lbs over the spring bar rating will still provide acceptable results. Since all TV suspensions aren't created equal.....; if you find that the front of your TV tends to experience frequent bouncing, you may want to re-visit your spring bars.

Travel safe and enjoy the camping season!

Bob
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Old 06-09-2013, 04:28 PM   #26
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Thanks Bob and I sure hope to.
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Old 06-19-2013, 10:20 AM   #27
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Try this site for your calculations. Changing Gears http://changingears.com/index.shtml Put in your numbers into the trailer calculator and it will give you a reading based on a 20% safety margin or you can lower the margin to whatever you want. I used this page when shopping for my truck and 5th wheel.
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