Winterize - Blowout or Antifreeze

cgmoses74 · 10-12-2015, 12:04 PM

Can I winterize my Jayco x23b by simply blowing out the lines and then by putting a gallon of antifreeze in each of the grey and black tanks?

djtho1 · 10-12-2015, 12:51 PM

Technically you can blow out your lines with air, but you can't get your various traps and things. When I winterize, I use antifreeze and then open my low point drains to get most of it out. I have also always used antifreeze to at least flush the hot water heater a little bit, and then drain it as well. I don't like the idea of leaving anything in there that might be water. Don't forget your city water hookup and your outside shower either!

cgmoses74 · 10-12-2015, 01:00 PM

For the traps, that's why I'd pour a gallon of Antifreeze in the drains (kitchen, shower, bath). I'd think doing that after you blow it out you'd be all set. Thoughts?

djtho1 · 10-12-2015, 01:04 PM

Too much risk for me. Will there still be some water left in the pump? Will there still be some in the bottom of the hot water tank that can freeze? Will there still be some in some corner of the line that air did not get to? Too many ifs for my liking. If I pump antifreeze through the lines I am sure. It doesn't really take that much, and you can usually do your traps at the same time.

TWP723 · 10-12-2015, 01:06 PM

I never put antifreeze in the tanks. There's enough room for expansion when they're drained properly.

hoppers4 · 10-12-2015, 01:17 PM

I've always used air with no problems. A bit of water here and there won't hurt anything. There's plenty of room for the bit of water that's left to expand in multiple directions without damaging anything. I put a cup of antifreeze in each P trap, a bit of antifreeze in the toilet and call it good.

mike837go · 10-12-2015, 01:21 PM

I like both.

Blow out the lines. Then charge the system with antifreeze. The process of purging the air puts enough antifreeze in the traps and waste tanks to prevent damage.

Throw a quart of anti-freeze down the gravity fill and we're done!

Jagiven · 10-12-2015, 01:28 PM

I do both! But a lot really depends on where you are at. In Minnesota we can get really cold, so I like the antifreeze to be full strength to get maximum protection. So I first blowout the lines first. Then pump antifreeze through the lines (full strength). Then blow out the anti-freeze from the lines. The P-traps get their antifreeze from water lines. Before I start winterizing I make sure my tanks are well drained. Close the dump valves, and whatever antifreeze gets down there dilutes any remaining water, to protect the valves. I also add a little bit of mineral oil down each drain to keep the anti-freeze from evaporation. I also do this to the toilet too.

The water heater and the waste tanks are big enough that a little bit of water will not hurt them. I am more concerned about the valves than the tanks.

jasoncw · 10-12-2015, 02:05 PM

Either will work, assuming you cover all sections of the plumbing. You just have to be a bit more careful if not using antifreeze. I have only had a trailer for 5 winters, but I only use the compressed air method, and (knock on wood) I have never had an issue. And it has gone below 0 here many times in MI.

DJL1967 · 10-12-2015, 02:19 PM

I do both as winters in Northern Ontario are very cold. Never hurts to be too careful and it only takes a few more minutes.

spoon059 · 10-12-2015, 03:00 PM

For the cost of 2 gallons of RV anti-freeze, I don't understand why people take the risk. Blowing out the lines might work, but then again you might have some water left in a line or a fitting. For about $8 worth of anti-freeze you displace ALL the water and don't have to worry about water expansion in your lines, pump or fittings.

Bobx2 · 10-12-2015, 03:31 PM

Blow out the lines, dump a gallon of anti-freeze down the drains and all is good until spring. No foaming or foul tasting water to deal with every spring. Absolutely no reason to do both. That is just nothing but over kill. Either anti-freeze or blowing out the lines is all you need. No, I'm not way up north, but we do see negative teens, and sometimes -20's in the winter. It's no different than blowing out your sprinkler system, and I bet nobody runs anti-freeze in there.

Raven · 10-12-2015, 03:45 PM

Wait a minute... Some posters said antifreeze in the water heater. I'm a newbie so please forgive me, but I was told to never have antifreeze in the water heater. That is why there is by-pass values, so you can winterize the entire plumbing system with antifreeze and by-pass the water heater.(after draining it of course)
Various youtube videos also have by-passing the water heater during winterization.

**norty1** · 10-12-2015, 03:54 PM

I have not read of anyone filling the wh with antifreeze on purpose. Bypass, drain wh and low point drains. Then pull antifreeze into the lines and faucets. Pour some in traps. Done.

Bobx2 · 10-12-2015, 04:04 PM

No, you do not want anti-freeze in your water heater. What little bit that is left in there after draining is fine. A cup of water freezing in a 6 gallon container hurts nothing. And, if you leave the plug out as some recommend, that little bit of water will likely evaporate before it would have a chance to freeze.

norty1, read post #2 in this thread.

Jagiven · 10-12-2015, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raven

Wait a minute... Some posters said antifreeze in the water heater. I'm a newbie so please forgive me, but I was told to never have antifreeze in the water heater. That is why there is by-pass values, so you can winterize the entire plumbing system with antifreeze and by-pass the water heater.(after draining it of course)
Various youtube videos also have by-passing the water heater during winterization.

None of the tanks need antifreeze.

I do have a coworker who's husband insists on filling the water heater full. Each to there own.

**norty1** · 10-12-2015, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobx2

norty1, read post #2 in this thread.

what specifically?

mtdawg · 10-12-2015, 06:01 PM

In the past I have only used the antifreeze method and it has worked well. This year with a new unit which has a residential refrigerator I ended up doing both. I initially blew out the system. I then closed the supply valves to the refrigerator and ran antifreeze through the rest of the system. Guess I'll find out in Spring of 16 whether or not that was a good idea.

Jim

Fire_Instructor · 10-12-2015, 06:46 PM

I do both, as well. I blow-out, because there's a very small section of pipe behind the water heater between the heater bypass valve and the heater feed valve that won't drain by gravity, even if I pull the drain plug from the heater. In known this, because it froze and cracked the feed valve the first winter, after I had gravity drained, closed the tank valves, and opened the bypass (Rockwood's have a three valve system).

I winterized the Rockwood for the LAST TIME today, as it'll soon be traded for my new North Point 377RLBH!!!!

VicS1950 · 10-12-2015, 07:23 PM

My opinions.

A small heel of water in a tank is not a problem.

A small amount of water in PEX tubing is not a problem.

A fitting full of water can be a problem.

A single freeze is not generally a problem. The freeze thaw cycle is what does the damage.

The cycle is this for anywhere there is a full volume of water.

The water freezes which expands the volume. If the water partially thaws then more liquid water moves into the voids. That water then again freezes which expands more than just the original volume freezing. Every time the cycle happens it puts more stress on the fitting or contained space.

That is why low spots in seasonal cabin copper tubing become "pregnant". Eventually the tubing is stretched to the point of failure from the freeze-thaw cycles. My experience is that improperly drained seasonal cabin low spots take about 3 winter seasons to fail. PEX tubing is much more forgiving than is copper tubing.

The above said, using air to blow out the water and achieve enough air space to avoid problems can be very effective. I prefer to just blow out boat systems and my travel trailer to avoid the Spring season process of getting rid of the anti-freeze in the pressure lines. We always drink the water from our trailer system.

I now pour a bit more anti-freeze into my black and gray tanks than I once did. I learned that there was more heel left in the black tank after our end season campsite connection dump than I expected. For some reason emptying to a dump station (as is my usual practice) drains the black tank more effectively. I'm not worried about the tank proper. I'm worried about the freeze-thaw water which may collect in the hard plastic dump valve.

FWIW. vic

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