1st Time Seneca

[tomden2]

I am in the process of making a final decision on buying a used 2015 Seneca. My main concern is the towing and carrying capacity. I have a 5th Wheel for the past 15 years, and always had a vehicle to drive whenever I arrived at where I was going. With the Seneca I'll have to tow a car. With the tow rating of 5,000 lbs, how can anyone tow anything except a sub-compact, and not be overweight, when including the weight of the vehicle+dolly or trailer? I can't tow my car 4 down, and don't want the expense buying another one. What do you all do??

[norty1]

Welcome to JOF.

I can't help you but we have a knowledgeable Seneca gang here.

[Rustynuts]

The 2015 Seneca has a Towing capacity and hitch for 10K not 5K. It has a GVW or 28k and GCW of 33K so you can easily tow a car.


Complete specs for a 2015 Seneca are here...

[Robbbyr]

Welcome to the forum!

I tow either a 2014 Ford Explorer or a 2013 Ford Focus, my Seneca doesn't know which is back there! As stated the hitch is a 10,000 lb hitch, but you are "limited" by the Gross Combination Weight Rating of 33,000 lbs. Loaded for bear (we always pack way too much!) with 4 adults on board, full fuel, propane, and fresh water, my rig weighed just a touch over 26K. So I had almost 7,000 lbs. to play with to tow with.

And there are several other Seneca owners here on the forum who regularly tow over the GCWR and have not had any handling or reliability issues.

Good luck with your decision!

[SloPoke]

Originally Posted by Robbbyr

Welcome to the forum!


And there are several other Seneca owners here on the forum who regularly tow over the GCWR and have not had any handling or reliability issues.

Good luck with your decision!

I resemble that comment...

First - Welcome to JOF Tomden2

Second - Robby is absolutely correct... there are quite a few of us that constantly run at the legal limit, and once in a while we have been overweight a little bit (but we have never been more than 700# over GCVW, and only ONCE)

We have a '15 36FK and tow a 28ft trailer with all of our toys. I have posted many threads on this forum with our scale weight as reference of what the Seneca is really capable of - I encourage you to use the search of JOF to look them up. I do not encourage you to run overweight! but it takes a bit of effort to really load up enough stuff, water... fuel and cargo to be overweight.

While at legal weight, fully loaded with a full tank of water, a week of food and beer and our trailer weight running in the 7000# range with the Toyota and toys loaded on it - we go and run 8% grades in/out of Utah & Colorado. We have done some steeper and if you are planning on a TOAD to pull with your new-to-you Seneca, that gives you LOTS of options of having something to take along. We use the trailer for our "built-for-offroad" FJCruiser because they are not able to be towed on a dolly or flat.

If you really want to know more... send me a PM and we can talk over the phone.

[Rustynuts]

My trailer loaded up with a SxS, Sandrail, fuel and tools weighs 9600lbs and at 6-7% grades the Seneca does great. Fully loaded for a week we are around 25k but on our 2018.5 we have a GCVW of 39k so we have plenty of leeway.

[RyRoRyan]

Towing...no problem.

[MD3]

I'm disappointed with the towing on the Seneca. I hate being a rolling roadblock in the hills. I've had the transmission retune done and still not impressed. I'd be happy with 45-50 mph on the hills but 35-40 sucks, no way to sugar coat it.


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[Dustdevil]

Sounds like you'll either need a trailer for your existing car, or buy something that can flat tow. I am partial to Jeeps, because they are easy to set up for flat tow, but there are others. We also love to travel off-highway and explore, so that fits. The drawback to a flat car hauler trailer is that you have to find a place to store it at home, and also at any campground you might visit. They take up a ton of room. And they do add to your toad weight under GCVW, but it sounds like you don't have much problem with capacity.

[SloPoke]

Originally Posted by MD3

I'm disappointed with the towing on the Seneca. I hate being a rolling roadblock in the hills. I've had the transmission retune done and still not impressed. I'd be happy with 45-50 mph on the hills but 35-40 sucks, no way to sugar coat it.
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Now that totally surprises me... when we are fully loaded (at 33k) and are heading out of town over Parley's summit (6%).. we never have fallen below 45mph, even in the hot summer months.

Now we did bog down on UT-143 and had to drop into "3" climbing into Brian Head, but that is a 13% Grade. We just kept the engine in the 2k RPM range and climbed right up at a steady pace. That is a real steep climb, but we had no issues doing it.

[SloPoke]

Originally Posted by Dustdevil

Sounds like you'll either need a trailer for your existing car, or buy something that can flat tow. I am partial to Jeeps, because they are easy to set up for flat tow, but there are others. We also love to travel off-highway and explore, so that fits. The drawback to a flat car hauler trailer is that you have to find a place to store it at home, and also at any campground you might visit. They take up a ton of room. And they do add to your toad weight under GCVW, but it sounds like you don't have much problem with capacity.

Absolutely correct!!!

We weighed the various factors above against some other factors that were purely our own choice - and went with an even bigger trailer because:

* We have room in our rear yard for all of our trailers.
* Our Toyota FJC is not able to Flat Tow or Dolly Tow
* Most of our camping is BoonDocking, and parking the trailer is never an issue. We found that on our trip to FLA over the winter... every campground had space to park the trailer somewhere in the park, and most had big enough spaces that we did not ever have to unhook the trailer at all.
* We also have room for our 4-wheeler along with the FJC
* We also take two canoes with us - and the 4Wheeler and FJC
* We also can haul two 50-gal Water Tanks - and run back into town to get more water if needed.
And we found out the best reason by accident... We can back up, anywhere... without having to unhook anything.

[RyRoRyan]

I agree with SloPoke on this one. I have not dived below 45 and I have done some pretty big climbs.

[tomden2]

Thank you all for your comments. I have no doubt that the Seneca can tow an auto, but my question was, and still is how do you tow above the limit placed by Jayco. In the 2015 Seneca Owners Manual, On page 3-2 under Using the Rear Hitch, the first sentence of paragraph 2 states "The factory installed towing hitch on this vehicle is capable of pulling 5,000 lbs. of load (maximum), however the vertical (tongue) weight will vary according to the towed vehicle." So what all of you are saying is that you are towing over the limit. Is that correct, or am I missing something? I have RV'd for many years, and know about UVR, GAWR, GVWR, GCVWR, etc. Not trying to be argumentative, just trying to getting some answers before I make the purchase. I plan to tow my POV, which can only be towed on a dolly or trailer, plus my full size motorcycle (approx 900 lbs). I'll do it on a tandem dolly or trailer. Just concerned because whichever way I go, I'll be over the 5,000 lbs. Just asking.....

[Old skipper]

I tow my 2008 Chevy 1 ton dually. The question you have is a Freightliner question not really a Jayco engineering exercise. I don’t have the specs in front of me but I am confident we are within the capabilities of the M2

[MD3]

Originally Posted by tomden2

Thank you all for your comments. I have no doubt that the Seneca can tow an auto, but my question was, and still is how do you tow above the limit placed by Jayco. In the 2015 Seneca Owners Manual, On page 3-2 under Using the Rear Hitch, the first sentence of paragraph 2 states "The factory installed towing hitch on this vehicle is capable of pulling 5,000 lbs. of load (maximum), however the vertical (tongue) weight will vary according to the towed vehicle." So what all of you are saying is that you are towing over the limit. Is that correct, or am I missing something? I have RV'd for many years, and know about UVR, GAWR, GVWR, GCVWR, etc. Not trying to be argumentative, just trying to getting some answers before I make the purchase. I plan to tow my POV, which can only be towed on a dolly or trailer, plus my full size motorcycle (approx 900 lbs). I'll do it on a tandem dolly or trailer. Just concerned because whichever way I go, I'll be over the 5,000 lbs. Just asking.....

I’ve seen a few places of conflicting info in the different manuals on mine.
I see what you are talking about in the 2015 online manual stating 5k lbs.

I’d email or call Jayco for clarification.... a quick google search showed numerous quotes of a 10k lbs hitch but not a “tow capacity”. Link below from Jayco quoting the 2015 Seneca as having a tow capacity of “more than 8,000lbs” and a 10k lbs hitch. Jayco link : https://www.jayco.com/about/news/jaycos-2015-seneca/

I’ve had good luck getting questions answered by both calling and emailing Jayco.


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[Rustynuts]

Originally Posted by tomden2

Thank you all for your comments. I have no doubt that the Seneca can tow an auto, but my question was, and still is how do you tow above the limit placed by Jayco. In the 2015 Seneca Owners Manual, On page 3-2 under Using the Rear Hitch, the first sentence of paragraph 2 states "The factory installed towing hitch on this vehicle is capable of pulling 5,000 lbs. of load (maximum), however the vertical (tongue) weight will vary according to the towed vehicle." So what all of you are saying is that you are towing over the limit. Is that correct, or am I missing something? I have RV'd for many years, and know about UVR, GAWR, GVWR, GCVWR, etc. Not trying to be argumentative, just trying to getting some answers before I make the purchase. I plan to tow my POV, which can only be towed on a dolly or trailer, plus my full size motorcycle (approx 900 lbs). I'll do it on a tandem dolly or trailer. Just concerned because whichever way I go, I'll be over the 5,000 lbs. Just asking.....

I just looked at the manual for 2015 and it does say that but I would guess it’s a misprint as the 2015 brochure says they come with a 10k hitch which every M2 based Seneca I have ever looked at before we purchased had a 10k hitch on it....it’s one of the selling points of the Seneca. You say you have found one so just look at the tag on the hitch itself. You could also verify the rating with Jayco if you can supply them with the last 6 of the VIN number.

[RVermont]

This sticker gives you most of what you need to know. The only piece missing is the actual tow receiver info which will be stamped on it. Look for this on the unit you are interested in and then verify that they have not added something like a washer dryer or extra tanks.

My rig is 22119 lbs with fuel and propane. My max weight is 33000 lbs. if I don’t pack anything in the unit I could pull a full 10000 lbs. plus two people plus beer but really nothing else. If I start eating into the 10000 lbs then the trailer weight must be reduced.

[SloPoke]

Originally Posted by RVermont

Attachment 41753
This sticker gives you most of what you need to know. The only piece missing is the actual tow receiver info which will be stamped on it. Look for this on the unit you are interested in and then verify that they have not added something like a washer dryer or extra tanks.

My rig is 22119 lbs with fuel and propane. My max weight is 33000 lbs. if I don’t pack anything in the unit I could pull a full 10000 lbs. plus two people plus beer but really nothing else. If I start eating into the 10000 lbs then the trailer weight must be reduced.

Exactly....

Our '15 has the 10k Hitch receiver mounted directly on the frame of our Seneca. Our trailer is rated at 10k, but we have yet to load it any heavier than this (see scale ticket) so that we are right at legal weight. And BTW, it tows this load without any issues, and we can run faster than most trucks.

We were fully loaded (Water, Fuel, Food, Beer, etc) for a 4-month long trip, took everything with us except our 500# Four Wheeler too.

[tomden2]

Thank you MD3 for the web link to the Jayco news site. It was very interesting. Also, thank you to RVermont and SloPoke for your input. I am breathing a lot more easier now. I was afraid that now when I was finally ready to make the plunge from 5th wheel to Super C, I was making a bad move. My mind is now at ease. I see the unit tomorrow, and have a RV tech checking it on Thursday. Hopefully, all will go well, and I can move permanently from the Montana Owners group to the Jayco Seneca Owners group

[tomden2]

OK, so today my wife and I looked at the unit for the first time. There is obvious caulking problems on the roof, plus other items. Will meet again tomorrow with a mobile RV tech to really check it out. My question is on the microwave oven. It is listed in the spec sheets as a convection unit. I saw nothing on the control panel to indicate this. Is this normal? Also, on the bottom of the unit there is normally on both undersides, a woven silver filter installed. On this unit, there were only 2 openings. We were told that there never was anything there. Is this normal?

Thanks

Tom