Class C bunk ladders violate Govt. safety regs.

[mike837go]

Originally Posted by FLHTK-JOE

Actually there is an agency in the Federal Government that is very interested in stupid things that RV manufacturers do. It is the National Highway Traffic Safety Agency and you can file a complaint here http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/contact.cfm

When I purchased a new Montana in 2014 the rear escape window latch broke within the first 500 miles. Dealers, and Keystone RV could not get replacement latches so many owners, myself included had to zip tie or wire tie these windows closed. This went on for months with Keystone saying they could not get the latches. Several folks filed safety complaints with the NHTSA including myself. A Federal Investigator telephoned me within a week of my complaint being filed to get additional information. They were also conducting an investigation because Keystone had let some fivers leave the factory with the ladder on the wrong side, thus totally blocking the escape window in back!

Anyhow, about a month after the investigation started and the NHTSA
notified Keystone RV, the latches became available. After a couple of conversations with the NHTSA investigator I am convinced that they take any safety complaint seriously. And I guarantee you that the RV maker takes the NHTSA seriously. Keystone Customer Service must have called me and emailed me 3 or 4 times to make sure my window was finally fixed and I was a happy camper.

Thank you for replacing my ignorance with knowledge.

But why does it have to take a major safety violation (fire escape fail) to get government involvement in order for a manufacturer to properly support their product?

[Sorry for the outburst, I'm still waiting for the buyback on my VW Diesel]

[Bassdogs]

Buy or build replacement ladder if 16" is too much for you. After all you are climbing into a bunk not cleaning out your gutters. Never met a kid who has a problem with the ladder and such. I do not want the stupid government telling me how many bristles my toothbrush must have and the bs in most regulations is laughable at best.

[Levinehikeski]

One person ****s there pants and everyone needs to wear a diaper.

[howlin4you]

Originally Posted by anav8or

Government regulations aren't a good answer - all it will do it make things really, really expensive. Look at what it has done for aviation...

I'm all for the less government mantra but this doesn't seem like the best example. Aviation has an incredible safety record in large part because of the millions spent dissecting each and every crash down to the smallest detail and applying any lessons learned to future operations.

[Mountain Climber]

Originally Posted by ALJO

Grumpy and The Logans are dead on with their message.

If you are not happy why did you buy your RV in the first place? The RV industry is what it is and do rely on feedback of customers, but it is still up to this industry what they do with the feedback information.
Have some self initiative and finish your RV the way you want it. That's what I have always done over the 50 plus years of RVing. Complainers don't get far in this world...........it is the do'ers what make things happen.

++10 What he said! Just fix it up the way you want it. You knew the ladder was what it was when you bought it. Leaning on the government for every little silly problem weakens you and enables the government even more.

[Dustdevil]

Originally Posted by Levinehikeski

One person ****s there pants and everyone needs to wear a diaper.

Agree or not, this ^ is funny right here.

[Dustdevil]

Originally Posted by Mountain Climber

++10 What he said! Just fix it up the way you want it. You knew the ladder was what it was when you bought it. Leaning on the government for every little silly problem weakens you and enables the government even more.

Seriously, I do agree with this. Complaints about silly things empowers government to "do something". The way they "do something" is to create restrictions on what people can do from that point forward. If you ever wondered why we have 70,000 new regulations every year in the Federal Register, restricting what Americans can do, or mandating what Americans "must do", then wonder no more. You will eventually get a solution, however, whether it's what you wanted is usually questionable, and what you end up having to give up to get your questionable solution is a crapshoot. Often, it's way more than you wanted to surrender. The lesson: Be careful what you ask for.

[Bassdogs]

Originally Posted by howlin4you

I'm all for the less government mantra but this doesn't seem like the best example. Aviation has an incredible safety record in large part because of the millions spent dissecting each and every crash down to the smallest detail and applying any lessons learned to future operations.

Aviation is a pretty far cry from an RV bunk ladder. Sometimes it is actually ok to let people be themselves and look out for their own needs. Guess that's the motivation for the comments some of us have made. I challenge anyone to take the time to read the government mandated notices in the front of anything you buy. They often take up the first 1/3 of the owners manual. They say stuff like the chain on your saw can cut off body parts or your car will be hard to control on Ice. Really does anyone on here read that stuff?

[Dustdevil]

Originally Posted by Bassdogs

Aviation is a pretty far cry from an RV bunk ladder. Sometimes it is actually ok to let people be themselves and look out for their own needs. Guess that's the motivation for the comments some of us have made. I challenge anyone to take the time to read the government mandated notices in the front of anything you buy. They often take up the first 1/3 of the owners manual. They say stuff like the chain on your saw can cut off body parts or your car will be hard to control on Ice. Really does anyone on here read that stuff?

My favorite: The hot water is .... hot.

[bansai]

My TT bunks have no ladder.. my daughter doesn't care, so I don't. They have some spiffy aftermarket ones, but I've bought enough 'stuff' this month to empty my wallet till spring.

[mike837go]

Originally Posted by Bassdogs

..snip.. I challenge anyone to take the time to read the government mandated notices in the front of anything you buy. They often take up the first 1/3 of the owners manual. They say stuff like the chain on your saw can cut off body parts or your car will be hard to control on Ice. Really does anyone on here read that stuff?

Yes! When I upgraded all 14 PC's in the building, I bothered to read all of the documentation that came with the monitors. One 4x6 leaflet about the dangers of water and the monitor and warnings about sitting too close for too long. The fine print that came with the keyboards (single folded 3x3 card tied to the cord) warned of repetitive motion injuries.

I can do without the Nanny State, thank you very much. But there are too many folk that need to be told *repeatedly* that there are dangerous things in modern/industrial life.

Is it possible to create a class system based on how responsible someone has proven him/her self to be?

Those that need self-driving cars, padded stairwells and no access to sharp objects. Vs. People that can drive reasonably when the weather turns foul (and know when to pull off); people that can handle tools and equipment that can kill bystanders or the user if not careful.

Do we need a certification process for kitchen knives?

[Dustdevil]

In my Seneca, the original ladder for the over-cab bed (assuming there WAS one from the factory at all) is gone. The previous owner replaced it with a nicely-thought-out little steel one with about 12" on centers for the rungs. Works, but it's like lifting a 75 lb barbell, and climbing the thing in bare feet is painful. It's made out of 1" square thick wall steel tubing, and the rungs actually hurt your feet, especially at my weight class. But it works. I'll get around to modifying all three rungs someday to make them more comfortable, and the ladder heavier yet. But for now, it's just not a priority.

[JudyB]

LMAO?..just read your response and we are so there!! That queen in the back is not made for 4 small dogs and US!!

[rgolding]

We chucked ours out the first day and bought a nice folding step ladder at Menard's, that doubles for a lot of other uses. The one that comes with the Seneca is For Sale to the highest bidder or it gets chucked when we move.
Kinda like my wife saying, "Do you want to eat this, as she smells something that came from the back of refrigerator, or should I just through it away?"

[GrayHawk51]

Originally Posted by Mountain Cajun

I agree! My '16 Seneca has the same ladder in which I almost broke my leg the first time I used it!

Ditto: