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Old 04-12-2018, 09:13 AM   #11
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That is correct to winterize you just turn the unit off, open the low point drain to reduce the pressure and the pull the screen filter. The unit will then be all set. That is why I installed the valves to shut off the supply to the unit. I put a heater in the water bay and keep that area warm. I added a gfi outlet for the heater.

The one thing that the comfort unit provides is quicker response for heating as the unit is already at 110’f

You just have to decide how you are going to be using the unit.
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Old 04-14-2018, 03:56 AM   #12
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Truma

Exactly what RVermont said. Upgrade to comfort works well, but that idea of rerouting the lines is genius!!

I do know that when on comfort it will generate enough heat to keep water lines from freezing down to 4 degrees (other mods have been made for wheel well lines and space heaters in tank and wet bay); that notion of a “heated and enclosed water lines” only works to a point as those areas are only about 5 degrees above ambient.
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Old 04-14-2018, 05:43 AM   #13
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I am following this discussion with interest as I all I know about “winterizing” is that is the time of year that we can open the windows here on select days. Now, “summerizing” is our big issue.

I am getting my Truma upgrade done next Monday, which I would never have known about if not for you guys.

And Ryan, I will let you know if they honor the deal. Thanks
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Old 04-17-2018, 12:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McGintys924 View Post
; that notion of a “heated and enclosed water lines” only works to a point as those areas are only about 5 degrees above ambient.
...can you elaborate here???

I'm not sure I follow how you are getting the water line 5 degrees above ambient.
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Old 04-23-2018, 12:21 PM   #15
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Remote Temp

Steve, sorry such a late reply.
I have been staying in my Seneca through the winter and will be doing so for the next two years it looks like. In the previous camper I purchased, despite a heated and enclosed underbelly, I had water lines freeze at around 20 degrees. So, when I had the Seneca I wanted to make sure this didn’t happen.

When RVermont and I began discussing the Truma, after the order was placed yet way before arrival, we had both been curious about which model they used. I called Jayco and when the rep explained that the basic was installed, I exclaimed that it would not have freeze protection (which the older Girard did). His response was “the Seneca is not a four season coach, we don’t intend for you to use it is freezing weather.” Aghast, as this was my main reason for purchase, I was determined to make it work; I just wondered if the Seneca version of enclosed heated water lines was any better than the previous TT.

I found remote temp monitors and put them in the wet bay, wheel well bay (don’t ask what my plan is when the little batteries die) and water tank bay. To my dismay, as the ambient temperatures plummeted, so did the temperature in the water line areas. This prompted an immediate winterization one cold night. From my readings, the temps in those areas with the furnace heat running full force was a mere five degrees higher than the outside temperatures. At 17 degrees outside it was 22-23 in these areas.

The solution has been a heater in the wet bay and tank bay and heat tape and insulation on the wheel well lines, and this summer will be a fresh water tank heater pad and insulation and heat tape to those lines. However, with the current modifications, I am good to 4 degrees. Therefore, I am theorizing that the Truma running on comfort keeps those lines from freezing due to the heat it generates; I will be insulating those lines this summer also.

I just wanted everyone to know my findings of the temp monitoring so that no one believes Jaycos marketing and leaves water in the lines when it’s very cold out.
Let me know if that answers the questions; I am eternally indebted to you for my refrigerator!
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Old 04-23-2018, 03:12 PM   #16
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Outstanding data-collection! I'm sure that will help factor into a lot our our equations when making a decision to winterize or not! Many thanks!!!
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Old 04-23-2018, 10:36 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McGintys924 View Post

When RVermont and I began discussing the Truma, after the order was placed yet way before arrival, we had both been curious about which model they used. I called Jayco and when the rep explained that the basic was installed, I exclaimed that it would not have freeze protection (which the older Girard did). His response was “the Seneca is not a four season coach, we don’t intend for you to use it is freezing weather.” Aghast, as this was my main reason for purchase, I was determined to make it work; I just wondered if the Seneca version of enclosed heated water lines was any better than the previous TT.

I found remote temp monitors and put them in the wet bay, wheel well bay (don’t ask what my plan is when the little batteries die) and water tank bay. To my dismay, as the ambient temperatures plummeted, so did the temperature in the water line areas. This prompted an immediate winterization one cold night. From my readings, the temps in those areas with the furnace heat running full force was a mere five degrees higher than the outside temperatures. At 17 degrees outside it was 22-23 in these areas.

The solution has been a heater in the wet bay and tank bay and heat tape and insulation on the wheel well lines, and this summer will be a fresh water tank heater pad and insulation and heat tape to those lines. However, with the current modifications, I am good to 4 degrees. Therefore, I am theorizing that the Truma running on comfort keeps those lines from freezing due to the heat it generates; I will be insulating those lines this summer also.

I just wanted everyone to know my findings of the temp monitoring so that no one believes Jaycos marketing and leaves water in the lines when it’s very cold out.
Let me know if that answers the questions; I am eternally indebted to you for my refrigerator!
Ahhhh Now I have a better understanding.

First off... I agree that Jayco did not build a 4-seasons coach that allows us to leave our rigs like Mark S. does in winter. (until Mark S. happens to be here for the winter like we were there - but he IS Invited!) As Jayco has the plumbing, there are lines that run above the floor, and lines that are below the floor. If you consider that the above floor temperatures are going to always be in a living space that is somewhat heated... we really focused on the plumbing that is below the floor.

We put a 1500w electric heater in all three bays behind the rear axle that have plumbing lines, Grey or black valves and the wet bay. On our FK model, our grey tank is over the rear axle, but drains out into the Wet-Bay that has the Propane Tank on the passenger side - we don't have a heater in that compartment... There are a few large openings between these two compartments that allow for the heaters that are placed in the Black / Wet Bay compartments that easily prevent the valves from getting impacted by freezing.

In the next bay back - our fresh water tank has the same 1500w heater too... We have been able to heat that bay and keep the fresh water temperatures in the 60's even when the outside temps are below freezing (highs and lows) the Genny is on the far side of that compartment, so we are blowing hot air around the tank from the passenger side compartment.

The rear bay - is our last heater. Basically heating the pipe coming out of the back of the Girard and back into the Fresh Water Compartment. Ironically, this is our most vulnerable compartment to freezing temperatures, especially in windy and frigid conditions due to the lack of insulation on the rear of that compartment. We have had that pipe get real close to freezing, to the point where water was barely flowing to the water heater. That pipe is going to get the heat tape to replace the heater this year...

Long post... yea, but we like to take off and go with our Seneca - even in the middle of winter. If I had the space to build a heated garage for the Seneca - it would never be winterized for the rest of it's life.
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Old 04-25-2018, 07:36 PM   #18
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Similar set up

The TS has the water lines that supply the ice maker (rerouted to have a shut off in the neighboring wet bay), bathroom sink, shower, and kitchen sink all in the wheel well bay. Despite a open heat vent to that area, I was still seeing temps minimally different from ambient; this prompted the heat tape and insulation as I could not see a method of heating this compartment further. Felt that if grey tank is empty, no need to worry about it.

I had heaters in the wet bay and water tank bay. The wet bay appears appropriate for the heater, but the water tank bay has other items and I worry about space heaters near things.

I will take your initiative as well and insulate those lines to and from the water heater this summer. I didn’t take into account that fact that that area has no neighboring bay for and insulation factor. Good point!
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