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Old 01-23-2019, 10:19 AM   #81
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I think a residential fridge is appropriate when you are you are using your trailer in a residential way. Full timing or seasonal parking or snow-birding, I can see how extended stays in a rig would benefit from a residential fridge. For weekend warriors, or even campers that plan trips a week or two long (such as myself), I really don't see the need or purpose for a big residential fridge. I really appreciate the ability to cool the fridge on propane. We often will bring our trailer to friends' camps/cottages/houses and park in their driveway for a few days, and the majority of the time there is only 15amp service to plug into, sometimes with a 100' cord (voltage drop). Running the fridge on gas saves me roughly 3amps of AC power, not to mention how efficient the fridge is on gas as well. It leaves me more electricity available for other things when there isn't a whole lot to begin with. Sometimes there is no shore power at all and that makes it even more practical!
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Old 01-23-2019, 10:48 AM   #82
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If I had to keep my NorthPoint in a storage yard, I would probably not go with a residential fridge now that I have had one for the last three years.
My trailer is in my driveway year round and we use the fridge like a second fridge. Plus most of the food is left in there for going camping.
Pretty much I just hook up and go.
Sometimes we hang out in there. Drinks are always in there. It’s near the pool.
All depends how you use your trailer.
I most likely wouldn’t have solar if I didn’t have the residential fridge.
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Old 01-23-2019, 10:59 AM   #83
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I do the same as Klassic. (But no solar yet)

Trailer stays plugged in at my house. Fridge always has camping staples (condiments and drinks) in it. I go there to hang out all the time and we use it as a guest house when family comes to visit.
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Old 01-25-2019, 06:20 AM   #84
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Fyi-from a 12 volt only perspective

I’ve noticed in my eagle that with everything powered off the parasitic power draw will still completely drain my lithium batteries 200ah in 10 days per my BMV-712 battery monitor. (If this was done with a typical dual lead acid battery setup it would seriously degrade the batteries)

That is only with the co sensor, the little led indicators for the dimmable light switches (I have 2) and those usb chargers (nothing plugged into them) I have 4. I also had the antenna booster on (it is A PIA to get to and turn off)

How long do you expect your rv frig to run on batteries/propane alone and not harm the lead acid batteries by using more than 50%?
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Old 01-25-2019, 10:10 AM   #85
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If I had all 12V draw items turned off and was just running the fridge on battery and propane, I am confident that I could easily match your 10 days. I have twin Trojan T-105 6V. The 12V circuitry in the fridge uses quite little electricity, however with 60lbs of propane available I am thinking the batteries would be the first thing to hit the limit.

I do like the sounds of your Lithium set up. My PD4655 converter came with a lithium option, by placing a jumper over two specific terminals. It's nice that you can't hurt them by discharging too much as you say, although I use LiPo (lithium ion polymer) batteries in some of my RC planes and I have to watch that I don't bring the cells down too low or risk damaging them. Maybe yours are different.

One thing that I am very aware of with LiPo is the fire hazard risk when charging. Guys have lost their houses from this. They cannot, cannot, cannot be overcharged! Some people even use fireproof boxes to charge their batteries in because of this. I have not had any issues, but I bought a high quality smart charger and I never leave them unmonitored.
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Old 01-25-2019, 10:19 AM   #86
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@SkyBound You are confusing LiPo with LiFePo4 (Lithium Phosphate Iron) These are NOT Lithium Ion batteries, and will not catch fire, and cannot be over charged as they have a built in BMS (battery management system). This is a common mistake and many make it. My LiFePo4 batteries are safer than flooded (I had one short and melt in the box). They are protected from over/under charge, reverse polarity, and over discharge.
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Old 01-25-2019, 10:24 AM   #87
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Right, the fire risk I was referring to was for the LiPo batteries, which are used in my RC planes. I understand the ones in the trailer are different.

One thing I don't understand, though, is how you can't hurt the LiFePo4 batteries by completely draining them, and with the LiPo, you can hurt them. Is it just that the BMS shuts them down before damage is done?
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Old 01-25-2019, 10:36 AM   #88
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X2

I did calculate my power draw at .8 amps parasite draw.

I never went more than a day boon docking with out running my generator to run a/c and top off my batteries when I ‘ve had a rv frig.

I wonder how much power is needed to keep the propane solenoid open and the rv frig control board powered - I suspect it is more than .8 amps, but even if it is the exact same and there is 0 extra draw it could only go 5 days before hitting 50% discharge - with a standard dual 100ah lead a id setup.

With my new residential frig And my lithium iron phosphate battleborn batteries I can go about a day and a half disconnected. I will be adding solar to extend this, but I will be running a generator when I want A/C and that will fill the batteries in just an hour or two.
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Old 01-25-2019, 11:27 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by SkyBound View Post
Right, the fire risk I was referring to was for the LiPo batteries, which are used in my RC planes. I understand the ones in the trailer are different.

One thing I don't understand, though, is how you can't hurt the LiFePo4 batteries by completely draining them, and with the LiPo, you can hurt them. Is it just that the BMS shuts them down before damage is done?
Not all BMS are created equal.

In the case of Battleborn they include inside the battery their proprietary BMS.

The BB - BMS auto cutoff trips if the battery gets below rated capacity - The batteries actually have more capacity but only let you get 100ah in this case.

You can “hurt” them if they have disconnected from an “empty” scenario and you leave them that way for an extended time you shouldn’t store them completely discharged.

The BB-BMS has auto cutoff tripping if the temperature gets to high or too low, power demand is too much - this includes a surge for too long.

The BB-BMS won’t allow a charge if the temp is 24F or lower.

You can reduce the charge cycle rating (normally 3000-5000 (if charged at 50ah) before dropping to 80%) if you charge them at their rated capacity ie put 100ah into a 100ah battery to charge it in an hour- the BMS will cutoff if you go over this charging rate.
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Old 01-25-2019, 12:08 PM   #90
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BB's 'Proprietary' BMS is just pretty much the same as most BMS systems out there, they are all 'Proprietary' in some small way. My LiFePo4 batteries are not BB, cost 1/2 as much, and have the same BMS spec's.

But to answer the question, yes, other than the obvious chemistry difference it is the BMS's job to protect the battery from over charge and discharge. LiFePo4 batteries can accept up to their rated amperage for charging, but very few if any RV system can output 100AH, as a test I used both solar and engine and managed to get a 65 Amp charge rate, but normally just let the solar charge at 40 amps(in full sun) My BMS cuts the output off at 10% and goes to float at 99%. I use a Tracer solar controller and load a custom charge profile from my laptop per the factory spec's as the generic profile is not spot on.
If you have 200AH of flooded batteries and switch to 200 AH of LiFePo4 then the battery percentage drop will be the same under the same load, but the batteries will discharge deeper (giving you about 40% more AH), charge faster, be protected, and not get hot. They do have a working temp range as @Gizmopilot stated, mine will not accept a charge below 15 and will not provide power below -15, these temps will not harm the battery and it will function properly when the temp gets back within the working range. If you camp in sub-freezing temp (Burrr!, not me) you would need an insulated box or warming blanket. I have been using mine for about a year and love them, would never go back to flooded. As soon as I get a battery box mod finished I will be adding a third battery.
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Old 01-25-2019, 12:09 PM   #91
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It’s nice to have the space of the res fridge. Just remember to turn your inverter on when not hook to land line.
Where is this switch??

The guy that did our walk through told me the inverter did not have a switch. That it automatically switched on when it lost shore power

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Old 01-25-2019, 12:46 PM   #92
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Where is this switch??

The guy that did our walk through told me the inverter did not have a switch. That it automatically switched on when it lost shore power

2018 377RLBH

Thanks

Vic
On my eagle there are 2 one on the remote inverter display - that is located under my Washing machine and there is one on the inverter itself.

As far as the automatic part - the inverter needs to be powered on for it to autoswitch.
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Old 01-25-2019, 12:55 PM   #93
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BB's 'Proprietary' BMS is just pretty much the same as most BMS systems out there, they are all 'Proprietary' in some small way. My LiFePo4 batteries are not BB, cost 1/2 as much, and have the same BMS spec's.

But to answer the question, yes, other than the obvious chemistry difference it is the BMS's job to protect the battery from over charge and discharge. LiFePo4 batteries can accept up to their rated amperage for charging, but very few if any RV system can output 100AH, as a test I used both solar and engine and managed to get a 65 Amp charge rate, but normally just let the solar charge at 40 amps(in full sun) My BMS cuts the output off at 10% and goes to float at 99%. I use a Tracer solar controller and load a custom charge profile from my laptop per the factory spec's as the generic profile is not spot on.
If you have 200AH of flooded batteries and switch to 200 AH of LiFePo4 then the battery percentage drop will be the same under the same load, but the batteries will discharge deeper (giving you about 40% more AH), charge faster, be protected, and not get hot. They do have a working temp range as @Gizmopilot stated, mine will not accept a charge below 15 and will not provide power below -15, these temps will not harm the battery and it will function properly when the temp gets back within the working range. If you camp in sub-freezing temp (Burrr!, not me) you would need an insulated box or warming blanket. I have been using mine for about a year and love them, would never go back to flooded. As soon as I get a battery box mod finished I will be adding a third battery.
What brand of lithium batteries do you have?

I should of also said about the max charging - if it is only one battery, if there are multiples wired in parrallel the max charging goes up at the same time so 2 can be charged at 100ah without reducing the charge cycles.

I have a 4560 converter that claims upto 60amps, but the most I have seen is 45amps and I will be adding my victron 100/50 to the mix so I shouldnt go over 95 for both batteries when using shorepower/generator charging along side solar.
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