Seneca DEF Issues

[Wade]

I have had four DEF issues with the emission system in my 2017 Seneca with a Cummins engine. All four times while on the road, so it has been fixed four times at different Freightliner dealers; all under warranty.
I now think mine is a lemon, and I am getting ready to trade in on a gas Newmar Baystar.
Does anyone else have DEF issues in a Seneca or other diesel that uses DEF?
I originally thought I was doing the right thing by going with a diesel, but I was wrong, at least with the one I have.
Thanks,
Wade Griffin

[Mountain Cajun]

I got 40,000 miles on mine with no problems. What sort of issues are you having?

[ready2retire&drive]

HI Wade I had a DEF issue when I pulled mine out of storage way back on April 8th of this year. It threw a code 1682 , they found DEF not building pressure, the pick up line was broken. They said some systems had too small a pick up line in them and could break when DEF fluid froze and expanded, they said there was an updated bigger pick line. Sounded different ? but ok by me due to it was covered under warranty. But then in July three months later it threw codes again, active code 2976 and inactive code 3577. They found DEF fluid leaking into connector. They installed new DEF pump then spliced on a new connector, it was repaired. They tried to ping me for all of this saying it was over the two year warranty period, after much vocal discussion as to why they never saw signs of this three months earlier, when it was all under warranty so we agreed it would only cost me the base deductible of $100.00 and it's settled. So hope next spring we do not start this saga all over. I believe you and me may be in the minority as I think these systems have enough road miles on them that they pretty much have it figured out. I am sure not if this gives you any answers that may help but know you are not alone on this particular issue.

[Wade]

Originally Posted by Mountain Cajun

I got 40,000 miles on mine with no problems. What sort of issues are you having?

Four differerent problems with the "Selective Catalytic Reduction (SCR system). This is an emission system issue with the DEF being injected into the emission system to control pollution. Manufacturers admit that it is a complex system, and it gives problems to semi truck also.
I have less than 19,000 miles and am trying to find out if most everyone else with a diesel gets along great (like you do) or if they have major problems like me.
Thanks for your feedback. I would like to hear from some others, as I think I may have a lemon. I can't trust it on the road, as I break down on most every trip. It is under a five year Cumins warranty, so it is not the cost that is the problem, it's breaking down on the road and all the issues that causes.

[SloPoke]

We have almost 25k miles and have not had any issues with our Seneca's emisssions. We do use ours in Freezing weather, and so far no freezing issues. Following..

[Robbbyr]

Mine turned on the "Check Engine" light and threw a code for a bad NOx sensor about 10,000 miles ago. Replaced under warranty in about an hour by Freightliner, never any additional problems.

[Sam]

I have 32,000 miles on my Seneca with no issues regarding the DEF system .Sam

[javamon]

Pretty sure vehicles equipped with EPA 2010 compliant diesel engines (DEF) have a 5 year/100k mile emissions warranty as dictated by the Feds. Should be in your warranty manual.

[Wade]

Originally Posted by javamon

Pretty sure vehicles equipped with EPA 2010 compliant diesel engines (DEF) have a 5 year/100k mile emissions warranty as dictated by the Feds. Should be in your warranty manual.

That is the warranty, so it is not a money issue for repairs; it is the inconvenience and hassle of breaking down on the highway.
Have you had any problems with your engine?

[Crossingover]

Are you the original owner? If not, perhaps the previous owner put 'bad' DEF or something other than DEF in the tank and you are experiencing lingering issues from those mistakes. No DEF issues here.

[McGintys924]

I have heard many stories of how truck stops poorly maintain their def storage allowing it to get old and water contamination. I know many out there use the pumps without issue, but I keep the jugs from Sams on board and use them exclusively.

[Crossingover]

Originally Posted by McGintys924

I have heard many stories of how truck stops poorly maintain their def storage allowing it to get old and water contamination. I know many out there use the pumps without issue, but I keep the jugs from Sams on board and use them exclusively.

While that may be true for some smaller truck stops, I doubt it is an issue with the mega chains like Love’s and Pilot/Flying J (the one we always go to; DW loves their coffee). Flying J has a DEF QC sampling and analysis program to verify DEF purity in their storage tanks, and their inventory turnover must be huge. Also, if a DEF issue were to affect truckers equipment, it wouldn’t be long for the negative word to get out amongst that community and the offending truck stop called out. I have the same zero concerns about DEF quality at Flying J as I do about their diesel quality.

[Wade]

Originally Posted by Crossingover

Are you the original owner? If not, perhaps the previous owner put 'bad' DEF or something other than DEF in the tank and you are experiencing lingering issues from those mistakes. No DEF issues here.

I am the original owner, and bad DEF has not been the issue. DEF quality is one of the first checks in the standard diagnosis the Freightliner shops perform.
I think my emission system was a lemon, but there are plenty of truckers having the same problems. I talked with them in the shops while waiting for repairs. The repair techs also say DEF issues are the most common problem of diesel trucks.

I traded my Seneca in for a Tiffin Allegro Open Road with a gas engine today, drove it home through the mountains and thought it handled just as good as the Seneca. It actually has a smoother ride and I didn't watch the dash to see when the "check engine light" was coming on.

[JMac]

Reviewing all the posts on the forum regarding def problems. I have a 2017 Seneca HJ bought new. 14000 miles and it just set check engine lights and scan gauge code is 4364 15. It came on the last 200 miles of a 2500 mile trip. Early on I used the DEF from jugs, lately I have been using truck stop pumps. One thing I have noticed is the pressure is really high on the truck stop Def pumps. I am hoping it is something simple. No RV freindly Freightliner dealers near me.

[McGintys924]

Originally Posted by JMac

Reviewing all the posts on the forum regarding def problems. I have a 2017 Seneca HJ bought new. 14000 miles and it just set check engine lights and scan gauge code is 4364 15. It came on the last 200 miles of a 2500 mile trip. Early on I used the DEF from jugs, lately I have been using truck stop pumps. One thing I have noticed is the pressure is really high on the truck stop Def pumps. I am hoping it is something simple. No RV freindly Freightliner dealers near me.

I have had some Freightliner shops say they only work on RVs on certain days until I tell them I have an M2 106. I just get in the Q and find a good movie.

I am thinking their pressure is high to increase flow rates as Semis have bigger DEF tanks than we do.

[rgolding]

Our 2016 37FS has 66,000 miles on it and no DEF problems, so far. We have bought 100% of our DEF from Love's Truck Stops. High volume works for me for getting fresher fuel and fresher DEF.

We are currently near Lake George in the Adirondacks and had to buy fuel at a questionable truck stop off I87, exit 11. Did not seem to be a great place, but I wanted to top off the tank before going up in the hills away from everything. Would not have even considered buying DEF there.

[SloPoke]

Originally Posted by JMac

Reviewing all the posts on the forum regarding def problems. I have a 2017 Seneca HJ bought new. 14000 miles and it just set check engine lights and scan gauge code is 4364 15. It came on the last 200 miles of a 2500 mile trip. Early on I used the DEF from jugs, lately I have been using truck stop pumps. One thing I have noticed is the pressure is really high on the truck stop Def pumps. I am hoping it is something simple. No RV freindly Freightliner dealers near me.

If you have a Seneca, you do not need to wait for the RV appointment list. You tell them it is on a M2 chassis and they take you right in.

I have had to "remind" the service writers a few times that it is on a M2 chassis, even on the billing / estimates. FL dealers have a different fee / labor schedule for the motorhome chassis than we have on the M2- chassis.

[hammer55]

since DEF is made of 66% water, and the rest synthetic urine, how bad can it get, to me it is just a scam, but that is me, just another cost to add to the products sold, making it harder for people who are struggling raising children and retired people of fixed incomes,

[McGintys924]

I have recently talked to several people who have deleted the DEF from their diesel pickup trucks. What is the thinking on this. They have said they are also getting better gas mileage.

[Camper_bob]

Originally Posted by McGintys924

I have recently talked to several people who have deleted the DEF from their diesel pickup trucks. What is the thinking on this. They have said they are also getting better gas mileage.

One of my clients is a fairly large diesel shop. They do our state required safety inspections as well. If they can see that you have deleted or tampered with any of the OEM emission reduction equipment on the chassis, they will fail the vehicle. They work mostly on commercial vehicles.

That being said, I'm betting that at least for the short term, you could find someone to "rubber stamp" the inspection. But I doubt that will last long as the fines are VERY stiff for that.

When I had my muffler replaced on my old YJ, I asked the shop if they could just skip the catalytic converter. He pointed to an empty parking spot at a nearby business and said "that's where DOT sits and watches my shop. If I send you out of here and they think I've removed the required emission equipment, they'll stop you, inspect the vehicle, and then come back here and write me a ticket I can't afford. So no way I'm not putting it back together right."