Winterizing without antifreeze

[JFlightRisk]

Sure we can. This is what we do to our particular TT.

1) Drain the water heater from the drain plug, and open the pressure relief valve to vent.
This is a good time to rinse the water heater out through the drain plug. Reinstall the
drain plug, and close the pressure relief valve.

2) Open the low point drains to drain the water lines (open all the faucets inside, shower
faucet, step on the toilet flush for a minute or so, and the outside shower faucet to
vent.)

3) Drain the fresh water tank(s).

4) Drain the gray and black water tanks. Close the valves.

5) After all the water has drained out, bypass the water heater so you don't fill it with
antifreeze. Close all the faucets and outside shower faucet.

6) Blow out the lines with low pressure compressed air, from the city hose connection,
with an air adapter. Do this several times until no more water comes out of the low
point drains. Close the low point drain valves.

7) Take 3 gallons of antifreeze inside to the water pump. place the winterizing suction
hose into one. Close the valve from the fresh water tank, and open the suction hose
valve. Turn on the pump. It'll suck most of the first gallon in before coming up to
pressure and stopping.

8) With the pump still on, open faucets one at a time, starting with the farthest away,
until they run solid pink, hot and cold side. Shut off the pump to change out antifreeze
jugs as needed. Don't forget the outside shower faucet and toilet.

9) Shut the pump off, switch the winterizing valves by the pump back to the normal
positions.

10) Pour a cup or two of antifreeze into the sink drains, and shower (or bathtub) drain.
Pour another cup or two of antifreeze into the toilet. It'll keep the valve seal wet.
There will be a little evaporation over winter.

11) Make sure the propane tanks are closed, remove everything inside that can be
damaged from freezing temperatures.

12) Remove the battery, and put on a battery tender at home. Cover the trailer if desired.


If I think of anything I missed I'll add it to another post.

[Rice1951]

Originally Posted by SloPoke

Wait until you hear "air" coming out of your washer instead. works great on the washer, the ice maker and the tankless water heater...

So I am curious. The washing machine winterization procedure specifically states to run antifreeze through it and run it through the specified cycles. How would I use compressed air and be able to hear it if the machine is running? Also, how would you blow water out of the washing machine drain?
I get that you can use air to clear out the supply lines to the washer but there are valves to control the flow of water in and out of the machine. How do you ensure the valves are open to get the water out if you aren’t operating the machine itself?
I’m not trying to be a horse’s rear end. I’m all for learning a better way if there is one but I would need a detailed procedure similar to what is in the washing machine manual.

[Big1]

I blow and I have always use Anti-freeze it just give me a piece of mind.

[MontanaRick]

One thing that rarely gets mentioned on these winterizing threads is that not all RV antifreeze brands are the same. Some are ethanol based, some are propylene glycol based, and some are a blend. In my experience, any with ethanol are much harder to get the smell and taste flushed than the propylene glycol based (and can also dry seals and is flammable). The PG based costs a few dollars more, but is well worth it.

[RogerR]

I agree 100% with MONTANARISK that using alcohol free is the only and best way to go. The alcohol stuff left stains in the sink and toilet that were a bear to get rid of. In my hot tub it evaporated and left a total mess!

[Kim Gass]

For you that travel during the winter what do you advise for repeated winterizing and dewinterizing during your travels?


We are going cross country in January and Feb and the early part of March. Some will be over mountain passes once. We usually dewinterize at a full service CG in NC going south and expect to be freeze free till we get to AZ where of course we will encounter snow and mountains and freezing then some warm in Death Valley and then more snow and mountains back over 1 40 going East followed by nice usually in the Midwest followed by the snow and cold of New England( usually April 1 has a low of 0 F!).

The dewinterizing is a PITA even with a small TT..

[Jagiven]

Originally Posted by Kim Gass

For you that travel during the winter what do you advise for repeated winterizing and dewinterizing during your travels?


We are going cross country in January and Feb and the early part of March. Some will be over mountain passes once. We usually dewinterize at a full service CG in NC going south and expect to be freeze free till we get to AZ where of course we will encounter snow and mountains and freezing then some warm in Death Valley and then more snow and mountains back over 1 40 going East followed by nice usually in the Midwest followed by the snow and cold of New England( usually April 1 has a low of 0 F!).

The dewinterizing is a PITA even with a small TT..

My buddy travels from MN to Florida at least once every winter for a few weeks in his class B MH. He stays winterized until he gets to warm climates. He flushes with windshield fluid, and hauls water for drinking and so forth. Gets south and flushes the system.

On his way back he winterizes once he feels he needs to and back windshield fluid and bottled water.

[Kim Gass]

Originally Posted by Jagiven

My buddy travels from MN to Florida at least once every winter for a few weeks in his class B MH. He stays winterized until he gets to warm climates. He flushes with windshield fluid, and hauls water for drinking and so forth. Gets south and flushes the system.

On his way back he winterizes once he feels he needs to and back windshield fluid and bottled water.

I get that. We have been from ME to FL five times round trip and the process is not bad once dewinterizing and once winterizing

But that was not my question. We are looking at multiple alternations between summer like and winter. At this time looks like five or six iterations.. After a southern route through Death Valley we will head to Utah and Colorado via the Grand Canyon . Would a tire compressor be enough to blow out the lines for a day or two below freezing?

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by Kim Gass

I get that. We have been from ME to FL five times round trip and the process is not bad once dewinterizing and once winterizing

But that was not my question. We are looking at multiple alternations between summer like and winter. At this time looks like five or six iterations.. After a southern route through Death Valley we will head to Utah and Colorado via the Grand Canyon . Would a tire compressor be enough to blow out the lines for a day or two below freezing?

I would generally answer that, no. Tire compressors do not typically have the flow rate needed to do it.

[Slurugger]

Originally Posted by Rice1951

If you have a washing machine it will have a winterizing procedure and most likely will recommend RV antifreeze. Same will probably be true for an ice maker. Anything with a valve that is electrically operated will be difficult to winterize with air only.
If you’re old school like me the pink stuff going in on one end and coming out the other end is a welcome sight and never fails.

I used air my first year and the water valve on the inlet for the res fridge busted when I opened it up the next year. I now do anti freeze only after draining low water valves. This includes pumping antifreeze through the washer valves, icemaker and water spout on the whirlpool fridge. Sanitize entire system when i open it in the spring. No issues since using antifreeze.

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by JFlightRisk

Sure we can. This is what we do to our particular TT.

1) Drain the water heater from the drain plug, and open the pressure relief valve to vent.
This is a good time to rinse the water heater out through the drain plug. Reinstall the
drain plug, and close the pressure relief valve.

2) Open the low point drains to drain the water lines (open all the faucets inside, shower
faucet, step on the toilet flush for a minute or so, and the outside shower faucet to
vent.)

3) Drain the fresh water tank(s).

4) Drain the gray and black water tanks. Close the valves.

5) After all the water has drained out, bypass the water heater so you don't fill it with
antifreeze. Close all the faucets and outside shower faucet.

6) Blow out the lines with low pressure compressed air, from the city hose connection,
with an air adapter. Do this several times until no more water comes out of the low
point drains. Close the low point drain valves.

7) Take 3 gallons of antifreeze inside to the water pump. place the winterizing suction
hose into one. Close the valve from the fresh water tank, and open the suction hose
valve. Turn on the pump. It'll suck most of the first gallon in before coming up to
pressure and stopping.

8) With the pump still on, open faucets one at a time, starting with the farthest away,
until they run solid pink, hot and cold side. Shut off the pump to change out antifreeze
jugs as needed. Don't forget the outside shower faucet and toilet.

9) Shut the pump off, switch the winterizing valves by the pump back to the normal
positions.

10) Pour a cup or two of antifreeze into the sink drains, and shower (or bathtub) drain.
Pour another cup or two of antifreeze into the toilet. It'll keep the valve seal wet.
There will be a little evaporation over winter.

11) Make sure the propane tanks are closed, remove everything inside that can be
damaged from freezing temperatures.

12) Remove the battery, and put on a battery tender at home. Cover the trailer if desired.


If I think of anything I missed I'll add it to another post.

I realize you were trying to one-over-the-world this, but I will quibble with a lot of things listed here. Some are implied, but not clearly listed. Forgive me, if it is stated somewhere and I am just adding emphasis.

1. This does not follow all of the recommendations/notes/warnings listed in the Jayco owner's manual. It seems like the site could just post that text in it's entirety, as a sticky, or at least include the parts about differing RVs, having differing requirements.

2. "low pressure compressed air" is pretty vague. The manual (at least the 2018 Eagle version) says no greater than 30PSI. You need sufficient flow rate to do much good, but do not need a high pressure.

3. No mention of pump strainer (but this was stated as AF method, so not required).

4. Black tank flush and macerator are not listed.

5. I would list all the water heater instruction in one paragraph/area, instead of multiple paragraphs for clarity. Note the differences in a tank and tankless models. The list is written as multi-tasking, but that won't work if the reader forgets step 5.

6. Particular warning of interest in the thread:
"Antifreeze should never enter the water heater, RV water filter, frigerator, refrigerator water filter, or fresh water tank."

7. I cannot tell you how many threads of broken toilet inlet valves I have read over the years. The valve needs **lots of attention** noted, and the manual states "Toilet: Flush the toilet several times until you see antifreeze in the bowl."

8. Because, many newby RV'ers read this stuff. . . . Another warning to ensure you are using RV antifreeze only. "Automotive antifreeze (ethylene glycol) and windshield washer antifreeze (methanol) are poisonous. Never use these products in your fresh water system. These products are harmful and may be fatal if swallowed."


9. Last but not least: Read your owner's manual and follow all the steps that pertain to your RV, as you may have other items required.


Edit: The requester has a semi-permanent installation, so standard things like "remove the fresh water hose" or "install heated fresh water hose" for winter would be required, just like at your home.

[JFlightRisk]

[QUOTE=madmaxmutt;898754]I realize you were trying to one-over-the-world this, but I will quibble with a lot of things listed here. Some are implied, but not clearly listed. Forgive me, if it is stated somewhere and I am just adding emphasis.[QUOTE]

Not a problem. I was merely describing what we do to our particular TT in answer to DebbieMacs quick question, without knowing which model they have. It was also off the top of my head at 12:40 in the morning. I also knew there would be more postings after that, so they could get at least a general idea of the process. Nothing can be carved in stone, since there's so many variables in models. Quibbling is allowed on this one.

[MontanaRick]

Originally Posted by Kim Gass

I get that. We have been from ME to FL five times round trip and the process is not bad once dewinterizing and once winterizing

But that was not my question. We are looking at multiple alternations between summer like and winter. At this time looks like five or six iterations.. After a southern route through Death Valley we will head to Utah and Colorado via the Grand Canyon . Would a tire compressor be enough to blow out the lines for a day or two below freezing?

I use a tire compressor, but hook it up through my fresh water hose to provide greater air volume. I have a 195RB, so 4 faucets plus toilet. Takes a minute or 2 to build up the pressure each time, but seems to do a decent job. That said, I have always followed up with antifreeze, so can't guarantee it's good enough. FWIW, I find dewinterizing pretty simple, a bucket or jug with about 2 gallons of water and all my taps are running clear.

[Kim Gass]

Originally Posted by MontanaRick

I use a tire compressor, but hook it up through my fresh water hose to provide greater air volume. I have a 195RB, so 4 faucets plus toilet. Takes a minute or 2 to build up the pressure each time, but seems to do a decent job. That said, I have always followed up with antifreeze, so can't guarantee it's good enough. FWIW, I find dewinterizing pretty simple, a bucket or jug with about 2 gallons of water and all my taps are running clear.

Thanks Rick. The most PITA of dewinterizing is sanitizing so for these quick dewinterizing situations I think we can skip the santizing.

The most exposure we will get on the way back on our trip is maybe two days of sub freezing.

LOL I only counted three faucets?

Sorry for hijack but the detour has been helpful for me.

[KCSA75]

We empty and bypass the water heater, drain the low-point drains and pump anti-freeze into the lines until it comes out of all the faucets. I just bought two gallons at the local Ace Hardware for $6. At that price, it's not worth dragging my air compressor to the campground/storage shed.

[spoon059]

Never understood this. $5 worth of antifreeze will almost completely eliminate any issues. Its easy and foolproof to do. Why re-invent the wheel? Maybe you'll get enough air pressure to clear out the lines, maybe you won't. For $5 a year and about 10 minutes time, I'll use antifreeze.

[MontanaRick]

Originally Posted by Kim Gass

LOL I only counted three faucets?

I counted the number that have to be run to winterize. Hot and cold on the kitchen sink, hot and cold on the shower = 4 that need to be run to winterize.

[pconroy]

Originally Posted by Brian_HR

I'm interested in the SloPoke air winterization process as well. I live in CO and although it gets below freezing in the winter we can have some really nice winter days as well and would love to be able to take advantage without spending all day de-winterizing.

What we do in October, November is: if the temps are going to be in the mid-20's or up, we'll bring the RV out of the lot and plug it in. Then I'll turn on the furnace or put a nice electric heater inside.


I'm aiming for inside temps to be 60's.


I put a 500 watt electric heater in the "basement" area because that's where all of the water works are on the 31FK.


The residual heat seems to keep our pipes warm. We've never frozen up.


If the temp is going to be in the teens or worse, then it's 2 gallons of RV Antifreeze and I just winterize.


We've been able to camp up in Golden Gate in November and only had things freeze up on us once. The temps dropped to 14* and it was windy. So that's my cutoff. Teens, I winterize.


End of November or December, it's time to just winterize. If we're camping, then I'll winterize it that evening after the last person takes a shower.


With practice I can do it in about 10 minutes.

In the morning, hop up and flush it out.

[pconroy]

Originally Posted by spoon059

Never understood this. $5 worth of antifreeze will almost completely eliminate any issues. Its easy and foolproof to do. Why re-invent the wheel? Maybe you'll get enough air pressure to clear out the lines, maybe you won't. For $5 a year and about 10 minutes time, I'll use antifreeze.

This is exactly where my head is too.
$5, ten minutes and all worry is eliminated.


You're buying RV AF anyway - for the pTraps, toilet and black/grey tank valves.


After crawling underneath and seeing the piping job - I know for a fact, that no amount of air flow is going to eliminate *all* of the water.


Nope - Just Pink-ify it and Sleep.

[Midnightmoon]

The reason to use compressed air isn't a matter of saving money for many of us. It is a matter of convenience. We use our trailer nearly all year long, especially when we get those warm stretches of weather in January and February that seem to happen every year here in PA. So, we end up "winterizing" 3, 4, 5 times a year. That's a lot of antifreeze to deal with, a lot of time and water to flush the system etc.

If we were winterizing in the fall and not touching it until the spring, it may be a different story. But for now, and many years before this, the compressed air method and a little antifreeze in the p traps works quite well.