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Old 01-06-2016, 07:11 AM   #1
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First Big trip - sub 0F

We took our 26BH out for the first big trip last week. We pulled from Houston to Abilene, thru Lubbock to Amarillo, then on to Angel Fire, NM. We left headed right into the winter storm blowing in. With RWD and an open rear diff on the truck, it was interesting. It was also the maiden voyage for our TV. About an 1 1/2 out of Houston the wind hit me so bad, I honestly thought I had a mechanical problem with the truck. Nearly turned around, but it eased up somewhere around Waxahachie, TX. Once the rig and I aligned our expectations, all was well, haha. I also learned that the TV really likes about 70mph more than 60mph. Looks like I'll be shopping for tires for the TT.

The grey/black water valves froze up by the time we hit Amarillo, but nothing a hair dryer didn't solve. In NW it started dipping as low as -17F. Again fighting frozen dump valves, and the intake line from tank to water pump froze. I ran to a local hardware store to get a heated wrap, only to discover the fresh water tank was frozen. We tuffed it out, using the city water hook up and running a faucet during the mornings and evenings, and disconnecting the rest of the time. Pondering a few ideas for a "skirt" and heater to battle these issues if we decide to go cold again...

One question. On our second day in NM, the fridge quit working, on gas or electric. It started working again when we got back in warmer climates that were around 30F. Is that normal?
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Old 01-07-2016, 01:17 PM   #2
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On your fridge not working. If it operates at the call of its thermostat as residential models do, then the refrigerator will not require cooling. Again, if it's like its residential kin, since the freezer runs along with the refrigerator, it will not kick on. And that can lead to thawing in the freezer. Right or wrong, this is what was explained to me some years back when we lost some foods in the freezer when I'd put our old fridge in the garage for extra space.
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Old 01-07-2016, 01:54 PM   #3
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snip...
One question. On our second day in NM, the fridge quit working, on gas or electric. It started working again when we got back in warmer climates that were around 30F. Is that normal?
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On your fridge not working. If it operates at the call of its thermostat as residential models do, then the refrigerator will not require cooling. Again, if it's like its residential kin, since the freezer runs along with the refrigerator, it will not kick on. And that can lead to thawing in the freezer. Right or wrong, this is what was explained to me some years back when we lost some foods in the freezer when I'd put our old fridge in the garage for extra space.
Or you could have an 'absorption' type refrigerator (standard in most RVs) in your trailer, not a residential 'compressor' type. It's normal for absorption types to stop working when it gets too cold inside the refrigerator and outside.
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Old 01-07-2016, 02:06 PM   #4
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Yes, it is an absorption type rv fridge. The fridge and freezer both got warm. From what I understand they relay on liquid to gas exchange of a chemical (amonia??) To cool. I thought maybe if the evaporator, which is exposed to outside temps, got too cold it might not function properly, but that was all conjecture.
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Old 01-08-2016, 08:07 AM   #5
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Regarding the refer. The problem seems to be that the heat source (electric or gas) has to heat the liquid refrigerant to it's boiling point for the refer to work. In extreme cold that sometimes is not possible. I've heard that they will work better on LP in extreme cold as the LP flame is hotter than the electric heater. I've also heard of some folks blocking the outside vents to cause the refer compartment temp to rise. Another problem is if there is any snow blocking the top or bottom vents.

Norcold makes the following kit. I'm sure there are others. I have no idea how well they work.

Norcold Refrigerator Cold Weather Kit, 634913
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Old 01-08-2016, 08:14 AM   #6
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That is some good info. Thanks
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Old 01-08-2016, 09:03 AM   #7
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That is some good info. Thanks
Most of this except the fridge issue can be solved by not using the on board plumbing during sub freezing outings. Some RV antifreeze in the Black tank might help and using a couple gallon jugs of water to "flush" will make the toilet function w/o charging the fresh water system. A jug or gallon thermos in the kitchen will handle cooking needs. We have traveled with temps as low as 5 below and a high of only +9 for the first 2 days of our trip. We did not experience any problems with the fridge in our 2014 White Hawk. The above things made our other activities fully functioning. The single OEM battery was drained by 3 or 4 am that first night as the furnace never shut off as it worked to overcome a fully frozen interior. Fired up theTV for furnace fan and finished out until dawn when we pulled out of the Wally W parkinglot.

Unless you are setting up for a longer stay, skirting is not practical or particularily helpful. Camping in freezing weather requires some adjustments to normal habits. We were heading south toward warmer climate so the sub zero thing was a means to a warmer end. As a rule when its going to be below 25% in a non heated rv, we keep the plumbing winterized. Makes it easier to get things flowing when we reach our destination.
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Old 01-08-2016, 09:56 AM   #8
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We were on hook ups for a couple of days. We actually had a small electric heater that probably did about 80% of the heating, even in that climate. We were hooking up the water hose in the mornings and evenings when we were active in the camper and disconnecting the rest of the time. We only experienced the city water hook up freezing once, and that was quickly solved with a hair dryer. When we did pull upstakes we were about 300 miles down the road when temps finally got near 32 again, and every thing seemed to have resumed normal operation.


My goal is to find a solution that would be helpful to camp for a few days, in low temps, with all the conveniences that we purchased the camper to have. We may not decided to do another cold trip, but the family does seem to enjoy skiing. I think some insulation and radiant barrier added to the bottom of the TT, with a heavy vinyl skirt and a heat source would keep the pipes flowing. Maybe blocking the vents on the fridge, or possibly the linked kit from above to keep the fridge going. But, like I say, I will only pursue that, if we decide to do another cold trip.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:26 AM   #9
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Another way to avoid most problems caused by towing thru cold climates is to simply put the thermostat on 70 and arrive all toasty and warm. There is no issue with using your furnace while towing and the amount of propane used is negligible. I guess some of us are just a little more hesitant to "rough" it than others are.


I have seen folks with custom made snap on skirting weighted down with sand bags. Looked fairly easy to install and remove. However, I find that with full covered underbelly and heat into the underbelly I have never had an issue with things freezing up.
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:44 AM   #10
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I've done the roughing it thing since I was a teenager. Dragging 5 girls into the west Texas summers, nearing 100, tent camping for a week at a time with water only sites at a state park.


We bought the camper to work a little less, and vacation a bit more. Not having plumping puts me back to just have a warmer, hard sided tent that weighs 6000#. We don't have a high end camper, or an artic package, so our belly is fully exposed unfortunately. We didn't have any issues warming things up when we arrived, and as long as the temps were above 0F we did ok. It was that -17F crap that got us..haha.


As for the skirting, I was thinking of going to the print company and picking up a heavy vinyl (6-8mil) mis-print for next to nothing. Sewing in some good magnets and ta da. It would fold and store fairly easily and install as quickly as magnets can stick to the frame. I'm hoping the weight would be enough to hold it in place, and offer some "insulation"
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2015 Explorer Sport 3.5L EcoBoost, AWD, and Tow PKG (Kid hauler, and ambitious TV)
2011 Shelby GT500 (only thing it pulls is G's)
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Old 01-08-2016, 11:55 AM   #11
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I've done the roughing it thing since I was a teenager. Dragging 5 girls into the west Texas summers, nearing 100, tent camping for a week at a time with water only sites at a state park.


We bought the camper to work a little less, and vacation a bit more. Not having plumping puts me back to just have a warmer, hard sided tent that weighs 6000#. We don't have a high end camper, or an artic package, so our belly is fully exposed unfortunately. We didn't have any issues warming things up when we arrived, and as long as the temps were above 0F we did ok. It was that -17F crap that got us..haha.


As for the skirting, I was thinking of going to the print company and picking up a heavy vinyl (6-8mil) mis-print for next to nothing. Sewing in some good magnets and ta da. It would fold and store fairly easily and install as quickly as magnets can stick to the frame. I'm hoping the weight would be enough to hold it in place, and offer some "insulation"
That sounds like an excellent idea.
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Old 01-08-2016, 01:31 PM   #12
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All the skirts I've ever seen have been made from heavy vinyl. The same thing as awning material and boat tops. You might be able to pick up some old torn up awnings from a RV dealer or maybe something from a tent company. I've only seen them attached with snaps. I think it might take a lot of magnets to hold that stuff up. 6 mil might be lighter.
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Old 01-08-2016, 05:15 PM   #13
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this is all helpful. We wont unwinterize till we get to a warmer climate. The TT arrives Jan 20 and we hope to have our first trip early in February.

We are in Maine and the highs are never above 32 till April. The normal low for our "due date" is minus 30.

Having our house pipes freeze up is no fun and I would imagine the chill factor at 65 mph in those temps really puts the water lines at risk. This will be our first little trailer (195 RB)
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Old 01-08-2016, 06:20 PM   #14
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70 mph in freezing weather on your maiden voyage??? You got bigger balls than me...
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Old 01-08-2016, 08:30 PM   #15
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finally03gt is the under belly on your unit enclosed? If not get some material similar to this Underbelly Material - RV Parts & Accessories - All-Rite.com any RV shop will have it. Seal seems with aluminum tape, a tip from local RV shop.

I was camped that week south of you with no freezing but enclosed under belly. Like OP above keep the heat on traveling, cheap and toasty when you finally park. Put some foam noodles in and cover the water hose, keep a short as possible, many sites I go to 10FT is all I need. I'll get a picture tomorrow of the heated water hose I made, not pretty but works great.

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Old 01-08-2016, 08:42 PM   #16
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70 mph in freezing weather on your maiden voyage??? You got bigger balls than me...
We cant do anything about the weather nor the speed limit. There is a minimum.
I suppose we ought to be thankful that we are in Maine where there is almost no truck traffic. You can walk across I 95 almost anywhere and not get hit , though moose take their toll.
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Old 01-09-2016, 09:22 AM   #17
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I've done the roughing it thing since I was a teenager. Dragging 5 girls into the west Texas summers, nearing 100, tent camping for a week at a time with water only sites at a state park.


We bought the camper to work a little less, and vacation a bit more. Not having plumping puts me back to just have a warmer, hard sided tent that weighs 6000#. We don't have a high end camper, or an artic package, so our belly is fully exposed unfortunately. We didn't have any issues warming things up when we arrived, and as long as the temps were above 0F we did ok. It was that -17F crap that got us..haha.


As for the skirting, I was thinking of going to the print company and picking up a heavy vinyl (6-8mil) mis-print for next to nothing. Sewing in some good magnets and ta da. It would fold and store fairly easily and install as quickly as magnets can stick to the frame. I'm hoping the weight would be enough to hold it in place, and offer some "insulation"
Suspecting you didn't do a lot of tent camping when it was below freezing so the RV already has given you an expanded camping experience. Throw in heat, Sat tv, a kitchen and warm beds and you/re miles ahead of the game. If you are an occasional user as it sounds like you are, trying to armor up the TT to fight off the freeze will likely prove a futil effort. In all my years of camping [over 45] the only skirting I have seen used is on long term seasonal set ups. The skirting is not likely to provide much extra protection to a sub freezing night and days that don't get much warmer. Don't get me wrong, you can prep a TT to perform better in freezing weather but if in the end things freeze up the repair costs will not make for a happy homecoming.

And as I said before, you can use your sink and toilet without charging the fresh water system. Good luck,
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Old 01-09-2016, 12:48 PM   #18
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Don't get me wrong, you can prep a TT to perform better in freezing weather but if in the end things freeze up the repair costs will not make for a happy homecoming.
Well said prep for cold. Heat taped aluminum & from wrapped water hose. Loose heat tape, foam noodles w/ bungee loops, and a roll of duct tape. Hook hose add insulation & heat to CG pipe/bib as needed with foam, bungees & tape. Forgot to add the 3 way plug for two heat tapes and a short extension cord to reach the 20amp in the pedestal.
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Old 01-09-2016, 01:05 PM   #19
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Another example of Jayco cutting corners. It is so much cheaper to just run another duct from the existing heating system to the underbelly than adding electric heating pads to the tanks and heat traces to the pipes. This is the proper solution. That way, even if you are not running the furnace, you can keep your unit from freezing.

I will be making this conversion next year in preparation for an Alaska trip.

That way, even when parked in storage, the unit is still protected. Far more efficient.

P.S. Jayco thinks its all about saving money. I am sure there are a lot of us that would pay extra for it to be done right and eliminate winterization headaches altogether. Or at least provide an option.
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Old 01-10-2016, 12:01 PM   #20
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Another example of Jayco cutting corners. . . .

P.S. Jayco thinks its all about saving money. I am sure there are a lot of us that would pay extra for it to be done right and eliminate winterization headaches altogether.
If that is true why do you own a Jayco? Why didn't you pay more money for a brand that has all the features you think are necessary?
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