Frameless Window Reset / Reseal

[BigJohnD]

I've read on this forum here and there about the dry fit windows, and resetting them with butyl. I think it was on a Jay flight. This is definitely not isolated to Jayco. A friend of mine did a positive pressure test on his Forester MH and low and behold, several of the dry fit windows leaked. He reset all of his with a double sided eternabond tape, or butyl, can't remember.

So my question is, since Jay Flight has the frameless dry fit windows if the fiberglass option is chosen (ours is), has anybody pulled the windows and reset them with butyl. I've never pulled a frameless, but it looks pretty much the same with the trim ring and flange. I think we have 9 windows, so a good few days and I could reset all of them. Stinks having to do so much preventative stuff on a brand new rig, but it pays off with the peace of mind.

I've got several more bullet proofing procedures to do which we do to all of our rigs, so maybe as they're done I'll post pictures. One is the trim from roof to sidewall with the vinyl insert running the length of the rig. Remove all screws, fill holes with ProFlex, and reinstall stainless screws, then seal up the vinyl insert trim to keep all of the water out of this area. Same thing on the trim on front and rear of the coach. Another is resetting / resealing clearance lights, sometimes drilling weep holes.

[ctbailey]

Hi john,
We just brought home our brand new 2014 Jayflight 32BHDS, with the frameless windows. What issues are you hearing about?

[BigJohnD]

Haven't heard any on the Jay Flight yet, but just as the regular windows, the frameless are dry fit with a foam seal. This set up will leak over time, thus some have pulled and reset the windows, removing the foam and using butyl. I haven't experienced this yet as I don't pick ours up till Friday, but it is an industry wide issue. I just read on the Redwood forum of the same issue, and it was on a frameless window. Just trying to get a jumpstart to minimizing any future issues.

[RVhiker]

The windows on my trailer are the older framed type, and I've resealed them all. When I did this, I found that the windows were not centered in the cutout at all; this results in the frame of the window not having much sealing area where the frame abuts the side of the trailer. Here's a link if interested: window reseal thread

[BigJohnD]

RVhiker, that's exactly what I'm after. You're definitely not the only one to do it, and for the exact same reasons. Thanks for the link. Very good write up and pictures. I believe the frameless mount the same in regards to frame and clamp ring. Hate to have to it, but looks like I'll be pulling 9 windows. I wouldn't be as concerned if it weren't for the thin filon / laminated construction. You never know if there is or was a problem until you pull one.

[ctbailey]

OK,

This is a good issue to talk about, and the writeup on the replacement is good. BUT - has anyone actually experienced a failure yet?

These new-fangled frameless windows are new, but how new?

I'll admit, when shopping for the bunkhouse I was a bit hesitant to jump on the flat sided model because of the relatively new technology of the frame less windows.

Being so new, though, I'm guessing no one has had one actually fail, yet.

[BigJohnD]

Only failure I could find on a frameless window was on a Redwood fifth wheel, but either way it is a clamp ring dry fit window, same as the older style. I guess the thing is, if either style dry fit window has a bad seal between the flange and outer skin, it's bad news. I tend to overkill preventative measures, but I've also had a run of and luck over the last 3 of our rigs. Those few things with those that I didn't check, we're what went wrong. Worst being manufacturer forgot to seal outer t-molding on slide, thus destroying he floor on a brand new fifth wheel.

[ctbailey]

"Run of luck" HA! I like it. I too have had a recent "run of luck" with our last trailer, resulting in a complete floor rebuild from the nose back to the midpoint. So, afraid of camper components I am not.

I'll monitor these threads, but the only way to know of a failure is to yank windows. During the 2-year warranty period that is sorta like Russian roulette. I just bought a new rig for the simple reason... I'd like to run it for a while without major work, but I suppose... the quicker we all come to grips with the fact that all trailers are garbage, the better off we'll all be.

What I can't stand is the whiny folks who need and expect perfection. You need to be either Independently wealthy, or handy to be an RV person.

[BigJohnD]

Well said. Like the garbage comment. I have thanked the Rv industry many times for the extensive training ie received, since I do most all of my own work. The only thing I need warranty for, is delam, which would probably be my fault according to most manf. I bought the rig I did because it's a good bang for the buck. I knew I might have issues, the jayco is a simple rig, and I don't have to fuss cause I spent over $100k. As always, expect the worst, hope for the best.

[RVhiker]

During the two year warranty period, I would expect Jayco to deny a claim to repair damage caused by a leaky window if it was more that 6 months or so into the warranty. You see, Jayco does not honor claims due to lack of maintenance. Jayco recommends that the owner caulk, as a maintenance item, around windows across the top and down the side past the curve (and no, I don't have that in writing). So if a window leaks past six months, it is the owner's responsibility to fix it. Any leak - anywhere on exterior of the trailer - due to lack of caulking or sealing - past six months or so - is likely to be on the owner. Caulking and sealing is a maintenance item.

Here's a thread about Jayco's response about leaks within the warranty period.

[BigJohnD]

Your pretty much danged either way. Pull and reset them the right way, and they'll deny you if you have problems. Leave it as is, and again they'll deny you.

I can't leave nothing alone. When we show up for a PDI at the dealer, it's usually with a lot of tools, including multi meter, torque wrench and any other tool that works on an RV. (Torque wrench, because I've found fifth wheel pin box bolts hand tight on the lot). At that point, usually the PDI guys walks away and says he'll leave us alone. Every rig we've had goes under the knife for 2 weeks to a month after we get it home, and before we'll use it. There's the PDI, then there's the in my shop Post DI. We take every access panel loose, and if it doesn't have one, we make one to things we want to inspect. Underbelly comes down, delete black flush anti-siphon valve, add shut off valves to every plumbing fixture, pull a majority of the screws, fill with geocel and resecure with same or stainless, change converter if not Progressive Dynamics, add PI EMS, change all faucets to Moen or similar, etc etc. Pretty much disassemble everything you can, and reassemble again. With each RV, the list has gotten longer, as we find something new we didn't check the last time.

Sorry so lengthy. We're new to the brand, but I'm learning more every day about it thanks to all the great contributors here. I hope to keep learning, and hope I can help somebody else as well, or save them a little aggravation.

[Camping Couple]

Originally Posted by BigJohnD

Your pretty much danged either way. Pull and reset them the right way, and they'll deny you if you have problems. Leave it as is, and again they'll deny you.

I can't leave nothing alone. When we show up for a PDI at the dealer, it's usually with a lot of tools, including multi meter, torque wrench and any other tool that works on an RV. (Torque wrench, because I've found fifth wheel pin box bolts hand tight on the lot). At that point, usually the PDI guys walks away and says he'll leave us alone. Every rig we've had goes under the knife for 2 weeks to a month after we get it home, and before we'll use it. There's the PDI, then there's the in my shop Post DI. We take every access panel loose, and if it doesn't have one, we make one to things we want to inspect. Underbelly comes down, delete black flush anti-siphon valve, add shut off valves to every plumbing fixture, pull a majority of the screws, fill with geocel and resecure with same or stainless, change converter if not Progressive Dynamics, add PI EMS, change all faucets to Moen or similar, etc etc. Pretty much disassemble everything you can, and reassemble again. With each RV, the list has gotten longer, as we find something new we didn't check the last time.

Sorry so lengthy. We're new to the brand, but I'm learning more every day about it thanks to all the great contributors here. I hope to keep learning, and hope I can help somebody else as well, or save them a little aggravation.

John....you rock! I make the same list and correct to MY specs as well. This camper will be around for awhile.

[BigJohnD]

RVhiker, just curious how hard this original foam seal was to get off once the window is out? I've seen some with a rubber seal, but not a foam. Just curious what I'm up against and if there is any tricks getting the old seal off the window flange.

[RVhiker]

Originally Posted by BigJohnD

RVhiker, just curious how hard this original foam seal was to get off once the window is out? ....

The foam seal is exceedingly sticky. While most of the windows came out of the hole easily, if a window is stuck in place by the sticky, a thin putty knife will help to (gently) pry it out of the hole. I scraped off most of the big hunks of the seals with a putty knife and removed the residue with paint thinner; I let the paint thinner soak in for just a bit, and then rub off the mess with with a rag. Really not a big deal at all.

I used some thin strips of wood between the inside window frame and the foam of the wall to (hopefully) keep the window in the center of the hole; tightening the screws of the interior window ring helps to hold it in place, too. I used a reversible drill to remove the screws, but screwed them back in by hand to make sure I did not strip the aluminum holes. Before I removed the ring, a applied strips of duct tape to the outside of the window to insure it could not fall out of the hole onto the ground.

After the window has set in place for a while and the butyl quits oozing, I put a cap of caulk over the top of the window and down the sides as another seal.

[BigJohnD]

Good enough. Sounds like cleaning the old seal off is the worst part. Everything else you mentioned goes along with what I was thinking. Think I'll try the small kitchen window first to see how it goes.

[BigJohnD]

Looking for feedback / opinions. I got the Jay Flight home today. All looks very good. Can't complain a bit. I want to pull the windows and reset them, but, don't really feel like it right now. Debating the gamble to leave it as is and do it around April, or when it warms up. Also wondering, if anybody has done a top / side seal on the frameless windows as a preventative measure?


I hadn't heard much about people resetting these windows until recently. On our cedar creek, we had the same windows, and sealed the top and sides with geocel proflex.


Right now, they look good, and the foam seal is visible and compressed, but, just not sure how good that seal is. Can't win for losing in this debate with myself.

[ctbailey]

Your sig pic has the rig indoors. Can't get much better "sealed" than that!

Congrats on the bunkhouse!

[BigJohnD]

True. Guess you could say the thing is in purgatory. It's been cleaned and put there until we deem it suitable for use, or good to go. LOTS of sealing, redoing, fixing and so on until we'll take it back out of the shop. Same with every rig we've owned. Hadn't had a factory satisfy us yet, so, we buy, we fix to our likings.


The window thing just plain ticks me off the way they're done. Hope Jayco takes notes from Open Range, since they own them now. Thinking that hot seal method via machine is a way better way to go. No dry fit crap there.