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Old 07-10-2015, 02:15 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by tnchuck100 View Post
This post is one of the better posts in this thread. It is based on facts. Not what somebody heard somewhere. Good going Tim L.

There is nothing wrong with using an adapter when the occasion calls for it. Better to use the adapter and plug into a solid 50 amp receptacle than use a worn 30 amp. A loose 30 amp receptacle will generate heat and melt the plug. This will also result in low voltage to the camper while this connection arcs and builds heat. The 50/30 amp adapter is a wise choice here. You are still limited to 30 amps by the camper breaker. If the camper service cable were to short (extremely unlikely) it WILL trip the 50 amp breaker in the pedestal.
Amen. This confirms my thoughts, too. My understanding of the dogbone type of 50-30 amp adapter is that it drops off one leg of the 220V 50 amp supply so only 110V 50 amp is passed on to the trailer. The 30 amp breaker in the trailer will protect and prevent more than a 30 amp draw. I had to do this on a couple of occasions with my last trailer, using the adapter provided by my dealer (when I bought the trailer). If someone wants to be extra cautious, then that's what they should do, for their own peace of mind.
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Old 07-10-2015, 02:22 PM   #72
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Going back to the Original Post, it was concerning melted plugs on shore power cords. My bet, also as TNCHuck100 states, is that worn loose 30A receps are the root cause! Poor contact = high resistance (heat) and arcing.
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Old 07-10-2015, 02:59 PM   #73
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Although I do agree with some of the statements made about using adaptors I will stand by my statement that I would never use a 50 to 30 adaptor. Even as was stated that it would be "extremely unlikely" and that doesn't mean that it is 100% unlikely.
Also by using a 50 to 30 there is a potential that up to 50 amps could be placed on a wire designed for up to 30 amps. I realize that this may be a little different but it will better explain Imagine if you were to wire up a 30 amp clothes dryer in your house using the correct #10 wire but you used a 50 amp breaker. Would the building inspector pass or fail the installation. You would fail in that you used a 50 amp breaker to protect 30 amp wiring.


What I do at a campsite is my own doing and knowing I am taking a risk is my decision. However I would never tell someone else to do it or that is Ok. My advice would be based on electrical codes and safety. Again the chances may be very slim but the potential is always present.


Plus I am not afraid to leave the house but my biggest fear is from those things and people I have no control over that continually do dumb and stupid things And to be perfectly honest those other people may have the same to fear about the dumb and stupid thing I may do
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Old 07-10-2015, 03:14 PM   #74
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One final point. There is no condition that would would put more than a 30 amp load (key word is LOAD) on the service cable. The camper breaker would trip. The only condition that would exceed 30 amps on the service would be a short (< 1 ohm) and that would trip the pedestal breaker. A 30 amp service cable could carry 50 amps for a few minutes without a problem.

Now the next consideration is code vs safety vs practical application (the real world).

bedrck46, consider the following: You are at a campground 100 miles from home. It is hot and you must have the air conditioner. You do not have a generator. The 30 amp receptacle is worn and loose. The 50 amp receptacle is fine. There are no other sites available. The campground cannot or will not get a maintenance man to replace the receptacle.

Choice one: Use the adapter.
Choice two: Tell the wife and kids it's a tough break but we are going home.

If you leave the campground will not refund your camping fee.
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Old 07-10-2015, 03:37 PM   #75
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I don't think anyone here is trying to tell anyone else what to do. It is a decision that has to be made by the individual. You can throw out all the hypothetical situations you want to justify your position. It's still an unapproved practice according to the NEC .

The NEC prohibits the practice for a reason. I've never found anything in the NEC that didn't have a purpose based on safety of users and installers.

That being said do what you want. I do think you are doing a dis-service to others to recommend they do something that may or may not be harmful. If you want to take the chance that's your choice. I just don't think you should tell others to do so.

And somebody thru out their EE degree as if that made them some sort of expert. I've met EEs who couldn't recite Ohms law and who couldn't wire an outlet properly. Throwing that out to imply you are some kind of expert on the subject further encourages the less experienced and less educated to do something that all electrical jurisdictions consider wrong and illegal.

Just my opinion. Do what you want.
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Old 07-10-2015, 03:55 PM   #76
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Two things: Could you please give a citation for the NEC prohibiting the use of the 50A to 30A RV adapter.

Also, please read more carefully. I said I have a B.S. in Engineering, and I understand the risk. NEVER said EE. Industrial Engineer, and I can use Ohms law, and the power pie.

Illegal? Really? But still made and sold by the millions, with not one documented example of a problem.

Is it 100% safe using it? No. I think I made that very clear. But like I said, you have a FAR FAR greater risk of being killed on the way to the campground. About 50,000 a year die in auto accidents in the U.S. alone. We all take risks every day.
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Old 07-10-2015, 04:06 PM   #77
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Just my opinion . . . but I think we've beat this one to death. There are those who will and those who won't. So lets just say we agree to disagree.
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Old 07-10-2015, 04:18 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by tnchuck100 View Post
One final point. There is no condition that would would put more than a 30 amp load (key word is LOAD) on the service cable. The camper breaker would trip. The only condition that would exceed 30 amps on the service would be a short (< 1 ohm) and that would trip the pedestal breaker. A 30 amp service cable could carry 50 amps for a few minutes without a problem.

Now the next consideration is code vs safety vs practical application (the real world).

bedrck46, consider the following: You are at a campground 100 miles from home. It is hot and you must have the air conditioner. You do not have a generator. The 30 amp receptacle is worn and loose. The 50 amp receptacle is fine. There are no other sites available. The campground cannot or will not get a maintenance man to replace the receptacle.

Choice one: Use the adapter.
Choice two: Tell the wife and kids it's a tough break but we are going home.

If you leave the campground will not refund your camping fee.
What would my choice be Well for one I stated I will not nor do not own a 50 to 30 adaption So that's no option
And being I have no kids or wife that isn't a option
and being I paid for my camping with a Credit card if they refused to refund I would call the Credit card company and cancel payment That would then cause them to make repairs not only for me but for the safety of their own equipment.

But as to a refund I doubt that they would refuse a refund if that could not provide what they offered and that be a site that had the service I required If that was the case I am sure they would receive a call for service from me until the repair was made. Lets get real about a situation as you state.

And being I started camping a long time ago and camped for many years without A/C If I wanted to stay there then the G/F and I would just have to sweat it out.

My real option would be to offer to install a new receptacle for them as I am more that capable to do so. And that is something I have done once in the past. And again it would be for my safety and for the safety of their equipment.
I also worked for a KOA campground here in PA a few years ago. and was also involved with a campground/resort in West VA.
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Old 07-11-2015, 09:21 PM   #79
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Two things: Could you please give a citation for the NEC prohibiting the use of the 50A to 30A RV adapter.

Also, please read more carefully. I said I have a B.S. in Engineering, and I understand the risk. NEVER said EE. Industrial Engineer, and I can use Ohms law, and the power pie.

Illegal? Really? But still made and sold by the millions, with not one documented example of a problem.

Is it 100% safe using it? No. I think I made that very clear. But like I said, you have a FAR FAR greater risk of being killed on the way to the campground. About 50,000 a year die in auto accidents in the U.S. alone. We all take risks every day.
You tossed out your degree (regardless of the specific degree) to imply you somehow had some special knowledge that the average person does not. What I said still stands regardless of the field of your degree.

Anybody who knows anything about the NEC knows it is against code to protect #10 wire with a 50 amp breaker. And it is illegal to do so in a jurisdiction that bases their laws on the NEC which 99% or more do. Even those jurisdictions that do not base their laws on the NEC will prohibit protecting a wire with a breaker rated at 160% of the wire ampacity.

And if this discussion was about auto accident risks I would maybe or maybe not discuss auto accidents. This discussion is about an electrical circuit that is improperly wired and protected.
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Old 07-11-2015, 09:33 PM   #80
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Nuff said, you guys. Chill please.
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