Should I buy a new 27BH?

[Famtraveler24]

Hi all. Completely new to the forum and to RVing but looking forward to the journey. Seriously considering a 27BH to pull behind my 2019 Expy (with HD towing package). Raptor engine and 1500 payload, 9200 towing capacity. Any reason I should avoid the 27BH? Would love your feedback and input.

[Siamese]

There's no substitute for you doing the math yourself, but off the top of my head:

- You'll have close to a thousand pounds for tongue weight
- That leaves 500 pounds for everything else. Driver and passenger weight, and whatever gear you bring along. I'm 160lbs., and my wife claims 150lbs., so there's 290 just in humans.
- Also factor in your wheelbase, although I have no input on how to do that, other than pickups typically have longer wheelbases and that factors into towing ability.

I would suggest you amend your question to something like, what is the best method/formula for determining how heavy a trailer my vehicle will tow.

[Famtraveler24]

Thanks Siamese. With a WDH to take some of the tongue weight off, wouldn't that help? Sorry for the elementary question. As I mentioned, I'm all new to this world.

[Siamese]

i took the loaded weight of the 27bh and multiplied it times .13 to get an approximate tongue weight of close to 1000lbs.

That 1000lbs. is getting transferred to your tow vehicle, no matter what. The WDH "distrubutes" the weight more evenly between your rear tires and your front tires, but it can't make the weight disappear. It's still 1000lbs taken off your available payload. Actually, you have to figure in the weight of the WDH, too, and it's right where you need extra weight the least...on the tongue. And then you might do what I did and add a second battery up there on the tongue so you can boondock some of the time.

My opinion's worth what you paid for it, but I'm guessing with that vehicle and trailer you'll end up somewhere in the "just barely" and "don't do it" range.

Opinions will vary!

I wanted a new F-150 for a tow vehicle (for various reasons), and worked backward from that to determine what trailer I'd get. I ended up with the the Jayco 26BH. There's me, wife, two cats, litterboxes, inflatable kayak, charcoal, second battery, forty pound generator in the rear of the pickup, etc., and I'm towing as much as I'm comfortable with. I wouldn't go any heavier. Not because I couldn't get it to move down the road, but because to get from Michigan to somewhere like Mobile, Alabama, I have to go through Indy, Louisville, Nashville, and Birmingham, and I don't want things to get overly interesting if I have to make an emergency maneuver. Which happens.

Staying within your rated payload can be a brutal equation.

[MichaelO]

Originally Posted by Siamese

i took the loaded weight of the 27bh and multiplied it times .13 to get an approximate tongue weight of close to 1000lbs.



That 1000lbs. is getting transferred to your tow vehicle, no matter what. The WDH "distrubutes" the weight more evenly between your rear tires and your front tires, but it can't make the weight disappear. It's still 1000lbs taken off your available payload. Actually, you have to figure in the weight of the WDH, too, and it's right where you need extra weight the least...on the tongue. And then you might do what I did and add a second battery up there on the tongue so you can boondock some of the time.



My opinion's worth what you paid for it, but I'm guessing with that vehicle and trailer you'll end up somewhere in the "just barely" and "don't do it" range.



Opinions will vary!



I wanted a new F-150 for a tow vehicle (for various reasons), and worked backward from that to determine what trailer I'd get. I ended up with the the Jayco 26BH. There's me, wife, two cats, litterboxes, inflatable kayak, charcoal, second battery, forty pound generator in the rear of the pickup, etc., and I'm towing as much as I'm comfortable with. I wouldn't go any heavier. Not because I couldn't get it to move down the road, but because to get from Michigan to somewhere like Mobile, Alabama, I have to go through Indy, Louisville, Nashville, and Birmingham, and I don't want things to get overly interesting if I have to make an emergency maneuver. Which happens.



Staying within your rated payload can be a brutal equation.

If it’s just you, your wife, and two cats why get a bunk house?

[Siamese]

Originally Posted by MichaelO

If it’s just you, your wife, and two cats why get a bunk house?

Good question.

One of us snores, so maximum separation is desirable. We took out the upper bunk, creating an awesome sleeping area/den, with Home Depot wire rack shelving on the rear wall, and on the front end, we took out the dividing wall and swung the sofa 90 degrees so it's up against the outside wall. The furnace is under there, but was unaffected...just had to move the ducts a little). Took out the queen bed, and now we have a single bed that goes along the front wall.

Got rid of the crummy jackknife sofa and replaced it with much nicer sofa from Walmart online for about $350. WOW, what a difference.

The result is a very open, non-slide arrangement. Big living room with an L shaped seating area. Nice, roomy feel. More room for the cats to race around, too. The litter box is under the built-in door side night table. It has a swing pet door on it's front to guard against odor, and is walled off from the rest of the storage area. To clean the littler area, we just open the outside door and scoop (no bending over).

We lost some of the under bed storage up front, but we don't even use all of what's left.

We removed the mini-fridge from the area under the bunks, as we'd never use it. That increased the storage area under there, and made the access easier. And, we only use a small portion of that storage.

The only other thing we did to make it roomier is to put an aluminum slide track on the ceiling outside the bathroom. When you go in the bathroom, you can slide a curtain around the curved track, which sections off the sink area. Leave the bathroom door open, and you have pretty much double the moving around area in the bathroom, eliminating the phone booth feel (if you remember phone booths).

Oh, and the wall opposite the swung sofa, and by the door, now accommodates a big coat rack, and under that is a shelf unit that holds all our shoes, etc..

And, with the queen bed gone, we don't have to scootch around the bed to get to wardrobes and top shelf on the front wall. Just walk over to it and boom.

Turned our trailer into an inexpensive, slide-less trailer for a couple that wants some separation and comfy sleeping quarters (replaced the mattresses).

Sounds like a lot of mods, but it really only took a couple days to do it all, and it was so easy, it seemed like it was made to be modified.

Works for us, anyway. We stay in the trailer for a month at a time during the winter in Mobile, and do smaller trips spring and fall for about 9 weeks total annually without feeling cramped.

And now, back to your regularly scheduled thread.

[MichaelO]

Originally Posted by Siamese

Good question.



One of us snores, so maximum separation is desirable. We took out the upper bunk, creating an awesome sleeping area/den, with Home Depot wire rack shelving on the rear wall, and on the front end, we took out the dividing wall and swung the sofa 90 degrees so it's up against the outside wall. The furnace is under there, but was unaffected...just had to move the ducts a little). Took out the queen bed, and now we have a single bed that goes along the front wall.



Got rid of the crummy jackknife sofa and replaced it with much nicer sofa from Walmart online for about $350. WOW, what a difference.



The result is a very open, non-slide arrangement. Big living room with an L shaped seating area. Nice, roomy feel. More room for the cats to race around, too. The litter box is under the built-in door side night table. It has a swing pet door on it's front to guard against odor, and is walled off from the rest of the storage area. To clean the littler area, we just open the outside door and scoop (no bending over).



We lost some of the under bed storage up front, but we don't even use all of what's left.



We removed the mini-fridge from the area under the bunks, as we'd never use it. That increased the storage area under there, and made the access easier. And, we only use a small portion of that storage.



The only other thing we did to make it roomier is to put an aluminum slide track on the ceiling outside the bathroom. When you go in the bathroom, you can slide a curtain around the curved track, which sections off the sink area. Leave the bathroom door open, and you have pretty much double the moving around area in the bathroom, eliminating the phone booth feel (if you remember phone booths).



Oh, and the wall opposite the swung sofa, and by the door, now accommodates a big coat rack, and under that is a shelf unit that holds all our shoes, etc..



And, with the queen bed gone, we don't have to scootch around the bed to get to wardrobes and top shelf on the front wall. Just walk over to it and boom.



Turned our trailer into an inexpensive, slide-less trailer for a couple that wants some separation and comfy sleeping quarters (replaced the mattresses).



Sounds like a lot of mods, but it really only took a couple days to do it all, and it was so easy, it seemed like it was made to be modified.



Works for us, anyway. We stay in the trailer for a month at a time during the winter in Mobile, and do smaller trips spring and fall for about 9 weeks total annually without feeling cramped.



And now, back to your regularly scheduled thread.

Your bathroom can’t be that small. The bathroom in my last trailer was so small that I had to step out to change my mind. You could scootch around the bed? My last trailer I had to crawl across the bed to get in. I had to be on the bed to make it because it was against a wall on three sides. One good thing about the last trailer, it was so uncomfortable inside it forced me to spend more time outside.

I had trouble finding a trailer that wasn’t a bunkhouse because I didn’t want more then one bed. I don’t have to worry about a jack knife sofa. My trailer came with the upgraded fold out, queen size sofa bed and also two recliners.

At least you reconfigured yours to work for your needs. I tried to figure out how to reconfigure my old trailer, but with the work and expense to do so I was much better off with a new trailer.

[Octopus Prime]

Siamese, I would love to see pics of your trailer on the inside if you feel comfortable posting.
We did very little to alter ours, but that is because most of the set-up works for a family with children. We did add a support frame under the island queen so that we won't roll into each other anymore.

My main complaint about the trailer is the tiny bathroom. I would rather have the single bunks and a slightly wider bathroom than what we have now. But it was the closest thing they had to what we need, and on the lower end price-wise.

[Siamese]

Originally Posted by Octopus Prime

Siamese, I would love to see pics of your trailer on the inside if you feel comfortable posting.
We did very little to alter ours, but that is because most of the set-up works for a family with children. We did add a support frame under the island queen so that we won't roll into each other anymore.

My main complaint about the trailer is the tiny bathroom. I would rather have the single bunks and a slightly wider bathroom than what we have now. But it was the closest thing they had to what we need, and on the lower end price-wise.

The bathroom mod we did is the best thing you can do without really gutting the thing. I found some bendable aluminum ceiling track on Amazon, and got the cars that go with it. And, a fabric shower curtain from our local Meijer store (sort of a local Walmart chain). Curve the track and attach it to the ceiling with short screws so when closed, the curtain encloses the area in front of the sink.

This mod has the effect of psychologically and physically doubling the size of the bathroom. When you step out of the shower, you no longer find yourself coming up short at the door. You leave the door open. Now, when you're standing on the bathmat in front of the toilet, the door's open, but you still have your privacy, and you have the room you need to dry off. It's just plain more space.

I lowered the towel rack that's over the toilet, which created room for a second medicine cabinet! You need that, right? And, we put another towel rack on the wall opposite the toilet. Maybe I recall from some of your old posts that you've done some of this stuff?

I almost did a video of our changes a couple weeks ago, as we're currently in Mobile for a month. But, I got too lazy. Our setup really only works for a couple, though.

The only other thing we did to improve the bathroom is to add some hooks in strategic places on the walls, so we have a place to hang our clothes while showering.

[Octopus Prime]

We've hardly done anything to the bathroom. I added command hooks above the toilet and we hung up a mesh bag for command hooks. I've meant to change the shower curtain, but haven't done so yet. I did get two shower rods so that we can hang swimsuits and wash cloths.

[Tomsmith07401]

You may want to look at a used 25bh. It's the same floor plan just a little shorter and lighter and I pull it currently with my 04 Tahoe and I am right at Max. I will be upgrading to an Expo this year and will not have to worry about going over weight.

[curver900]

Originally Posted by Tomsmith07401

You may want to look at a used 25bh. It's the same floor plan just a little shorter and lighter and I pull it currently with my 04 Tahoe and I am right at Max. I will be upgrading to an Expo this year and will not have to worry about going over weight.

^^^^^this is a good idea let someone else take the depreciation!

[MichaelO]

Originally Posted by curver900

^^^^^this is a good idea let someone else take the depreciation!

That’s what I did when I bought my trailer. It’s a 2017 that I bought in July of 2019. It went for $40k new and I picked it up for $26k. The original owner used it three times, so it was like new.

[spark of insanity]

All I can say is this. Wow nice TT. Although with me I kept our GVWR to under 3500 since I have jeep grand cherokee that tows at 6500. I did factor into all weight and et all. Did a great job out west on the hills and home. I would recommend making sure that you have at least 1000 for all variables in the tow. Otherwise I agree you are cutting it close. I do know the JGC can now tow up to 10K interesting but I like my little TT. As an after thought to one poster here. Our bathroom had nothing in it except the toilet and shower. I built a lite weight over the toilet cabinet and mounted it to the wall. Then got a nice shower curtain even though I like shower doors and rug. A lot of variables to making the bathroom look good. Good luck.

[jimmoore13]

My 2 cents:

It seems as if you are considering a TV (tow vehicle)/RV match-up that is approaching the upper limits of what your TV can handle. And you confess to no prior experience!
If you lived in Kansas and didn't plan to do much mountain driving, you'd be fine.

I looked up Waxhaw, NC (?? correct ??). If that's right, this suburb of Charlotte is close to the mountains, and I suspect you'll be going there - as well as the beach. If you explore nearby West Virginia and other very desirable locations, you'll really put your TV and driving skills to the test.

Once in the mountains, all bets are off. At or near the max will make mountain towing very challenging. You're not quite there, but that is a LOT of trailer for a relatively "little" TV...in the mountains.

I looked up the 27 BHB.
GVWR 7600#: Sounds OK with a 9000#+ tow rating.
Dry hitch weight 760#: that's half of your total payload capacity. There's the rub. Could you haul a 9000# horse trailer with a 1000# tongue weight? Sure. Chances are that, under those circumstances, your TV isn't going to be packed to the gills with camping gear and family members when you do that. And chances are you won't be towing, perhaps, hundreds of miles.
THAT'S WHAT THOSE TOW RATINGS ARE ABOUT! The ads depict towing an equipment trailer from the main office to a job site...for a reason.

Also remember that towing stability depends heavily on making sure you don't attempt any loading tricks in the trailer to lighten the load on the tongue. 7600# GVWR/760# tongue weight is the barely-there 10% minimum tongue weight for stability...especially on what is a long (33') trailer! That tail can easily wag the dog when a semi blows by you. (Be sure your WDH has good sway control.) If you get clever and load those rear bunks with several hundred pounds of cargo, that's a formula to get run off the road.

As others have said, all the WDH does is apply leverage at the hitch to transfer some of the tongue weight to the front axle of the TV. That does nothing to lessen the overall "payload" of the tongue weight. Ford assumes even weight distribution in their payload calculation. Assuming 350# of humans and pets, you don't have much left for camping gear in the TV. Try to put it all in the RV? The RV has a max cargo capacity of 1200 pounds. Fill the freshwater tank, and 350# just disappeared. Do the math on your loads, including generator "wet", fuel, coolers, ice, contents, yada, yada, yada, and 1200# disappears fast.

"Half-ton towable" is a claim many RV manufacturers brandish about, and the "tow ratings wars" among truck manufacturers are another questionable marketing claim. Marketing being the key word.

Recommendations - you confessed to being a newbie:
1. Go smaller if you can bring yourself to do it. Personally, I would NOT choose a 33' RV as my first rig! Mine's 25' ball to bumper, and it's my 3rd.
2. Develop new driving skills....you'll need them in the mountains and in emergencies.
a) Learn to manually shift and hold lower gears on climbs and, more importantly, descents. Your Ford might have a 10 speed transmission. You'll need to be able to drop it in 3rd or 4th gear on the downhills. (With a 6 speed, perhaps 2nd or 3rd.) Engine braking is vastly superior to using the "service" brakes. You need cool brakes to handle an emergency...especially on twisty downhills where you might encounter an obstacle in the road. (see photo of obstacle on interstate 70 west of Denver.)
b) On climbs, it's far better to select and hold a low gear than to allow the transmission to hunt up and down, performing numerous full power shifts as you climb. Repeated full-power shifts put a lot of wear and tear on the transmission. If you have a tachometer, use it. You can cruise all day at 60% to 70% of redline.
If you don't have a tach, learn redline simply. Take your TV to a deserted stretch of road. Stop. When it's safe, floor it and hold it to the floor until you reach at least 60 MPH. Monitor your shift points. Those are, for practical purposes, redline for each gear. You'll be surprised to see that even a 6 to 10 speed transmission will only be in 3rd or 4th gear at 65 mph.
My 2006 Ram 1500 has a conventional 3 speed with 4th as an electronic OD gear. I can cruise all day at 60 mph in 2nd gear! In the Rocky mountains, that's where I spend most of my time...in 2nd. There is precious little "flat" out here.
c) Tow-haul mode is a poor substitute for manual shifting. Ford's tow-haul mode, in particular, is notorious for ham-fisted shifting, especially on the downhills. Brace yourself for this if you try it, because it may scare the crap out of you the first time or two. Again, I prefer to control the shifting rather than turn it over to an algorithm.
d) Take it easy the first time or two in the mountains. Regardless of the RV you choose, you'll be dragging something far bigger and considerably heavier than your TV. We all do it, so it's not that big a deal, but the first time you crest a hill going too fast and facing a long twisting downhill, you'd better be well practiced on manual shifting, conserving your brakes, and you'd better have a change of underwear.
e) Learn how to use the brake controller to regain control of the trailer if it starts to sway. One does not just apply the brakes on the TV. That will exacerbate the sway. Instead, practice (until it's second nature) using the manual button on the trailer brake controller to apply trailer brakes only. This will drag the trailer back in line behind the TV...or at least try to.
f) Also understand that you have what amounts to a huge, relatively lightweight "sail" behind you, and that crosswinds are the enemy. Note that YOUR axles are in the middle of the load. Now look at a semi trailer. The axles are at the rear of that trailer, and the "tongue weight" on the fifth-wheel of the "tractor" is 35 to 40% of the total weight of the trailer. RV axle configurations are meant to allow you to use a relatively tiny TV to haul a huge RV, but it's FAR from the best configuration for towing stability. Now add in the fact that a bumper pull trailer tongue jogs left somewhat when you steer right (due to the pivot/lever action of the distance from the TV rear axle to the hitch), and, unlike a fifth wheel, you're wiggling the trailer one way when you steer the other.

Whatever you buy, practice towing it EMPTY and with no passengers. The typical semi ranges from 57 to 61 feet. Your combo will be 33' of trailer and about 18' of TV - 51 feet! With little or no training or experience, you'll be out there competing with the drivers with CDLs and better rig configurations.
Practice.

Believe it or not, all of that for 2 cents!