Trailer brake question

Gary207 · 06-15-2022, 10:52 AM

New 212QBW trailer, the car I used to pick up our new trailer had no hot 12 volt power supply from the car at the dealer they said yes it did and sold us the echo brake control. The brakes worked fine but I found out when I got home I was using the on board trailer battery to power the brakes, I do have a solar panel on the trailer. Is this right? Thanks in advance.

craigav · 06-15-2022, 11:06 AM

What is it that led you to that conclusion? The 12v hot in the trailer connector doesn't provide any braking aspect, and the battery in the RV doesn't either except in an emergency disconnect scenario. ~CA

Kim Gass · 06-15-2022, 12:01 PM

Was your phone on?
I dont trust bluetooth devices for safety

Gary207 · 06-15-2022, 12:32 PM

I traced the wires wire from the battery positive and was wired into 7 pin connector cord. The 7 pin connector had one spot that said EMT on the car.

Gary207 · 06-15-2022, 12:38 PM

Yes the phone was on. I was going to install the auto brake controller but the dealer said it would void Jayco’s warranty and they refused to install it. They offered to have it towed to my house at my expense and I could install it myself. So I ended up with the echo just to get out of there and get it home.

DocBrown · 06-15-2022, 01:54 PM

This is confusing. What do you mean by "auto brake controller"? I've never heard of a brake controller that would void a warranty. Electric trailer brakes require a controller.

With a brake controller there is nothing to install on the trailer itself. The trailer's 7 pin connector plugs into the 7 pin connector on your tow vehicle. With a BlueTooth setup like you have, the receiver plugs in between the two. Power for the brakes comes from pin #2 on the connector. That's most likely the one coming from your battery.

https://www.etrailer.com/question-20...e%20(2)%20pin.

craigav · 06-15-2022, 02:36 PM

I didn't catch the condition earlier, now I get it that the "Echo" controller gets it power from the 12v power at the trailer connector. I would verify from DocBrown's link that you have power at the 12v battery power feed at the vehicle side of the trailer connector and at the location indicated in the image in the link, if not then I would enable the power to the connector. ~CA

SloPoke · 06-15-2022, 05:26 PM

I had to read up on this new trailer brake controller that is mounted on the rear of your tow vehicle... get's its power from the Tow Vehicle (or maybe the trailer) and senses the vehicle from the rear.

The Bluetooth is only to adjust the gain / features to the unit on the rear of the tow vehicle>

https://www.curtmfg.com/dm/echo-mobile-brake-controller

OnTheGo · 06-15-2022, 07:07 PM

... not sure I understand. Was the car you were towing with equipped with a trailer brake controller before you arrived at the dealer?

If you had a working brake controller that would have been all that was necessary. If you didn't, the Echo would be necessary to control the brakes

The solar panels would help keep the trailer battery charged, but would not have any direct effect on the actual braking.

Gary207 · 06-15-2022, 08:01 PM

Doc check out etrailer item 340001 electric brake controller.

Gary207 · 06-15-2022, 08:09 PM

I have no 12 volt power or a brake controller on my car. Jayco ties in the positive battery cable to the trailer wiring harness that connects to the 7 pin connector to the trailer I told them I had no power coming from the car they said I did. When I left the dealer the brakes power came from the trailer battery if it ran down the battery I would have no brakes.

Gary207 · 06-15-2022, 08:12 PM

Yes I will have to run power from the car through the 7 pin connector. I just brought this up so other people are aware of to potential problem.

DocBrown · 06-16-2022, 06:54 AM

No such item on Etrailer: 340001 electric brake controller.

I'm sorry, I have to be a bit frank here. You are being really vague. Help us out a little.

In one post you said you traced a wire from the car battery to the 7 pin connector. In another you say you have no 12 volt power. Which is it?

What kind of vehicle are you towing with? Does it have a towing package? Is the 7 pin connector a factory installed item, or aftermarket? Did you use a multimeter to verify no power to pin #2 on the vehicle side of the connector?

The Echo brake control is exactly that, a brake controller. While not "installed" on your tow vehicle, it plugs into your 7 pin connector and the power from pin #2 powers your trailer brakes.

The 12 volt connection on the trailer is strictly through the breakaway switch and will not engage the brakes unless the pin is pulled. There is no brake control on the trailer itself. Trailer brakes do not work without a brake controller getting power from the tow vehicle.

https://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Bra...RT/C51180.html

DonBr · 06-16-2022, 07:14 AM

etrailer number is C51180 but I don't see any possibility there of the system using the trailer battery.
https://www.etrailer.com/Trailer-Bra...RT/C51180.html

Gary207 · 06-16-2022, 10:50 AM

Doc my mistake item number #3430001 on etrailer. Also on you tube Autowbrake explained A-Z same item.
The vehicle is a 2018 Lexus’s GLX460 came with a trailer hitch and 7 pin connector ( No Brake controller )
Pin # 2 marked mt no power verified with a meter.
Pin marked electric brake no power verified with a meter.
Some how Jayco ties the #2 pin wire to the trailer battery maybe to charge the trailer battery on the road maybe in my case with no power coming from the vehicle the brakes work off the trailer battery.

Gary207 · 06-16-2022, 10:55 AM

Interesting thing about the Echo is you have to disconnect the four way flasher on your phone I presume to keep the brakes from pulsing on and off. It must get the brake signal from the stop lights.

DonBr · 06-16-2022, 11:20 AM

Just a few off-the-wall guesses: I don't think you should ever see power on the brake line - it should only happen when activating the brake AND a trailer being sensed as attached.

Second, the echo applies braking according to an accelerometer, not any brake light signal.

Third, according the Q&A on the etrailer page, the Echo does not pass charging power to the trailer. The reasoning is that it can possibly get too hot for the electronics in the Echo.

If you are getting braking you pretty much have to be getting it from your car, just hard to work out a proper way to test it.

DocBrown · 06-16-2022, 12:57 PM

Ah, with that background info, now we're getting somewhere. And thank you for the part # correction. The Autowbrake requires wiring directly into the trailer, so yeah, I can see your dealer's reluctance.

Also your GLX 460 has multiplex wiring so not all brake controllers are compatible. I know the Prodigy P3 is. But I'm thinking that something isn't right with your 7 pin connector or they would have went that route. Did you but the Lexus new? You may need to check with your dealer and find out what the story is. If it's under warranty make Lexus/Toyota fix it. If it was used, who knows what was done.

Regardless, there should be brake power from your Lexus. Can you hook it all up and have someone press the brake pedal while you put your ear by a trailer wheel? You should hear the magnets engage, they will buzz like a transformer. And if you disconnect the trailer from the Echo, when someone presses the brake, put your multimeter on #2 again and see what you get.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DonBr

Just a few off-the-wall guesses: I don't think you should ever see power on the brake line - it should only happen when activating the brake AND a trailer being sensed as attached.

Good point, and maybe I should not assume that everyone understands that.

DonBr · 06-16-2022, 02:24 PM

The Echo should not respond to a brake pedal when there is no stopping action, it requires that movement is slowing and doesn't know anything about the brake pedal. The test should be done from the bluetooth app, or if the separate manual button exists (I think it is an option) by pressing it.

Gary207 · 06-16-2022, 06:49 PM

DonBr we were in stop and go traffic and the Lexus has a 2 inch travel of dead space before the brakes are applied every time I touched the brake pedal the trailer brakes came on with the stop lights drove me nuts. We changed the setting on the phone app to a lower setting traffic cleared and we continued up to the mountains climbing up to 4000 ft we reached our destination short down hill with a turn NO BRAKES I thought I was going to roll the trailer over.That why I have to figure this out before I head down the mountain.

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