My house and chassis batteries are not keeping enough charge overnight

[JoePickleball]

Hello all. I'm annoyed with my 2-year, factory-installed HB brand AGM pair of batteries. They are not keeping charged overnight, dropping to low critical levels, forcing me to start the engine or generator overnight, despite our efforts to conserve electric usage, limiting use of appliances, tablets, cell phones, etc. I am not interested in Lithium upgrade but wish to upgrade to a new pair of improved AGM batteries. All ideas and thoughts are welcome. My rig is a 2024 Jayco Swift 20T with 200 watt solar. Thanks. Joe

 

[Iowagriz]

What do you have on overnight? The inverter to charge all of those items mentioned?

I have a 23T. I found the inverter pulls a big draw overnight. Remember that it pulls even when not being used, so once the items are charged, it will continue to draw down power.

My best practices are to charge when driving and/or during the dinner hour. I'll usually run my generator for 10min just before bedtime to refill the house batteries.

 

[JoePickleball]

Thank you, Iowagriz. I'm not sure it's the Inverter alone. We rarely have it on and when we do, it seems that the batteries drain too quickly. I'm thinking that the HB brand AGM factory-installed batteries are already getting shot, which is sad cuz they seem brand new. Thanks again and sorry for my tardy reply. Joe

 

[Grumpy]

Hello all. I'm annoyed with my 2-year, factory-installed HB brand AGM pair of batteries.

If you're still under warranty they would be covered. If not contact Harris Battery and see what they say. .800.367.7670

 

[JoePickleball]

Thanks Grumpy. Curiously, I checked the circuit breaker panel. I do not routinely do this so maybe I have been part of the problem. Anyway, I found that the circuit breaker for the Converter was NOT fully engaged. I have no idea how long that may have been in that position. Should I be checking the panel regularly? Peace all...Joe

 

[Grumpy]

Thanks Grumpy. Curiously, I checked the circuit breaker panel. I do not routinely do this so maybe I have been part of the problem. Anyway, I found that the circuit breaker for the Converter was NOT fully engaged. I have no idea how long that may have been in that position. Should I be checking the panel regularly? Peace all...Joe

I only checked it when I had no 12 volt with shore power. The lights are normally brighter than when on battery.

 

[COCJ]

If you are looking for replacement AGM batteries, I highly recommend Deka brand AGM batteries. I have used them in my last three RVs and also in my daily driver truck and my ATVs. They have been great. Plus they are made in America. They might cost a little bit more and may be harder to find than other brands, but I think that they are worth it.

 

[Sugarbear-JAY]

Hello all. I'm annoyed with my 2-year, factory-installed HB brand AGM pair of batteries. They are not keeping charged overnight, dropping to low critical levels, forcing me to start the engine or generator overnight, despite our efforts to conserve electric usage, limiting use of appliances, tablets, cell phones, etc. I am not interested in Lithium upgrade but wish to upgrade to a new pair of improved AGM batteries. All ideas and thoughts are welcome. My rig is a 2024 Jayco Swift 20T with 200 watt solar. Thanks. Joe

What's life expectancy of those AGM batteries? I've found regular deep cycles only have a 1 year warranty and you're good of they last 2 years. We sell deep cycle batteries made by Johnson Controls and if I leave them disconnected while not in use and recharge them as needed, they'll last 2 years.

 

[GD-Skip]

Hey Joe,
I really don't understand your reluctance to use Lithium batteries.
A 100A LFP gets you exactly 100Ah, whereas a 100Ah AGM gets you maybe 50 or 60Ah.
Lithium batteries can be charged faster, can be drained down to zero (which is 2.5 volt per cell) and they are much lighter.
And, even if you are really lazy and don't change your charger to Lithium, they still get charged to maybe 85 or 90%, which is still better than any AGM. And you get much more cycles out of a LFP.
I know, I know, the charge curve is different, but it is perfectly fine.
I had an LFP in my old 5th wheel for 3 years and it did not age a bit. Sitting at an outside storage; sometimes for 2 or 3 months it kept the voltage just fine.

 

[billcf7]

Hey Joe,
I really don't understand your reluctance to use Lithium batteries.
A 100A LFP gets you exactly 100Ah, whereas a 100Ah AGM gets you maybe 50 or 60Ah.
Lithium batteries can be charged faster, can be drained down to zero (which is 2.5 volt per cell) and they are much lighter.
And, even if you are really lazy and don't change your charger to Lithium, they still get charged to maybe 85 or 90%, which is still better than any AGM. And you get much more cycles out of a LFP.
I know, I know, the charge curve is different, but it is perfectly fine.
I had an LFP in my old 5th wheel for 3 years and it did not age a bit. Sitting at an outside storage; sometimes for 2 or 3 months it kept the voltage just fine.

I second that, and your solar will top them off if you dont have a lithium compatible convertor

 

[Jimer]

Quick question- I have a new Swift 20T. I am going to use it as a second vehicle. If I drive it maybe once a week, should I disconnect (turn off) battery disconnect switch.
If I leave switch on will Solar keep the house batteries charged with nothing else turned on or running?

 

[jimmoore13]

Thank you, Iowagriz. I'm not sure it's the Inverter alone. We rarely have it on and when we do, it seems that the batteries drain too quickly. I'm thinking that the HB brand AGM factory-installed batteries are already getting shot, which is sad cuz they seem brand new. Thanks again and sorry for my tardy reply. Joe

I'm pretty late to this party, but thoughts.

First, with a 2024 rig, I'll bet you have a 12 volt compressor fridge.

Thanks Grumpy. Curiously, I checked the circuit breaker panel. I do not routinely do this so maybe I have been part of the problem. Anyway, I found that the circuit breaker for the Converter was NOT fully engaged. I have no idea how long that may have been in that position. Should I be checking the panel regularly? Peace all...Joe

Joe
If I interpret correctly, you described a tripped breaker. Tripped breakers can appear to be on until you examine closely. To reset, you must turn the breaker off, then turn it on.
If there is a breaker between your converter (the battery charger that draws from shore power to feed the batteries), then shore power was not charging the batteries. It's possible that only the engine alternator and/or generator would charge the batteries, and they will go dead fairly quickly.

If this was the case, you have "abused" your batteries, and they might need to be replaced. Badly abused batteries can't hold a full charge and deplete quickly. If you repeatedly discharge an AGM or lead-acid battery beyond 50% of its rated amp hour capacity, you'll kill it quickly.

You can get your batteries load tested, typically for free, at an auto parts store.

With all the responses you've received, I'm sure I duplicated some.

PS. the breaker could have tripped for any number of reasons, One of those reasons might be a short in one of the batteries...demanding more charging current than the converter can supply, with the internal damage in the battery messing up the essential feedback loop a healthy battery provides to the charger. Unless you just plan to replace the batteries, the load test is essential. And, as someone else said, your batteries MIGHT be under warranty.

 

[JoePickleball]

Thank you VERY much for everyone's responses. I will have the batteries tested at an Auto Zone. Good idea. Didn't know that was possible there. I am NOT opposed to Lithium batteries, just thought that they were much heavier than AGMs. And, evidently, according to an RV service center I spoke with 3 months ago, Lithium is undergoing some major reboots due to a lot of folks complaining about their Lithium systems on the B van configurations. What's up with that?

 

[AlexG.]

Are the batteries you currently have the 2 6volt batteries jayco is notorious for?

 

[Iowagriz]

I haven't fully studied Lithium for our Swift vans, but believe it would be best to find an inside place to install them. Lithium doesn't like cold, thus they use heat pads. Seems like placing them in the same spot (under the van), could be a problem. Again, my basic knowledge only...

I haven't measured, but under the drivers side bed, where the water filter is (that I removed), might have the space to install there. I think you also want to think of weight balancing. Placing them in the storage spot under the passenger bed would be easy. But then you have the water and battery weight all on one side.

 

[Camper_bob]

Thank you VERY much for everyone's responses. I will have the batteries tested at an Auto Zone. Good idea. Didn't know that was possible there. I am NOT opposed to Lithium batteries, just thought that they were much heavier than AGMs. And, evidently, according to an RV service center I spoke with 3 months ago, Lithium is undergoing some major reboots due to a lot of folks complaining about their Lithium systems on the B van configurations. What's up with that?

Weight is actually the opposite. Li batts are MUCH lighter than any lead battery.

Since yours is a 2024, I would find it difficult to believe the built-in charging equipment wouldn't be Li compatible. The only thing you might have to worry about is the alternator charging, which can be mitigated pretty easily.

Prices have become pretty reasonable too such that you can often find Li batteries for the same money or less than a good quality AGM unit. And the numbers look even better if you consider $$ per usable amp hours. As was mentioned, a 140AH AGM only has access to ~70 AH (and that's when it's brand spankin' new and in perfect health, storage capacity tends to degrade quickly in lead batteries) whereas a 100AH Li has access to nearly all of that 100AH. So if those 2 batteries were the same price, it pays to pick the Li every day of the week, but I'm betting the 100AH Li would be cheaper than the 140AH AGM deep cycle.

 

[JoePickleball]

I'm sold. Lithium batteries it will be. Now, can any Jayco Certified Service Shop do this work? Pete's RV in Mountville, PA is about 3 hours from me. Even though I did not buy the Class B from them, they told me recently, after I met them for the first time, that they are Jayco Certified, sell and service Jayco Swift Class B vans, and would provide service to me. Thanks again everyone for "piping in" as the knowledge is valuable and most welcomed. Peace on....Joe

 

[JoePickleball]

Are the batteries you currently have the 2 6volt batteries jayco is notorious for?

No. Two 12 volt AGM batteries.
Yes, I have a 12 volt compressor fridge/freezer.

 

[JoePickleball]

I am fairly certain that my van is configured for Lithium battery replacement.

 

[Camper_bob]

What work do you need the shop for? If your van is configured to be Li compatible, it should be a pretty simple "plug-n-play" swap. Just make sure you follow the existing wiring at the batteries since you already have 2x12V batts.

Again, if it's truly "Li compatible/ready", it should have an appropriate "apparatus" for charging Li from the alternator (either a DC2DC charger, or a Li BIM). If not, those are relatively simple to add, but they can get kind of spendy IMO. Bottom line here is you may want to protect the chassis alternator.

Then you just need to make sure if your converter is not automatic, that you have it set for Lithium charging profile (look up the model and read the instructions). Same with the solar charge controller.

Certainly no judgement from me if you're uncomfortable and want a pro to handle it. Personally, I wouldn't pay a shop to swap batteries, but I (more or less) know what I'm doing and am relatively comfortable working on low-voltage systems.