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Old 05-06-2011, 08:51 PM   #1
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(2) 6V Deep Cycle Battery upgrade.

There is an existing 'Jayco Mods' thread on adding a second 12V Marine/RV battery by "SmokerBill", so to keep our "volts" from getting crossed I thought I would post my 6V upgrade on a separate thread.

Since my boondocking has been increasing my battery amp/hr capacity has become more critical, especially since I have yet to invest in a solar system or a generator (leaning toward solar). I'm very conservative on my energy usage, and also incorporated LED's to minimize amp/hr draw.

After researching different deep cycle batteries, I decided to go with (2) Interstate 6V GC2-XHD-UTL Deep Cycle batteries. First I contacted Jayco to confirm that the existing support rails would hold the additional 100 pounds that the (2) 6V's would add over the (1) existing 12V Marine/RV battery. Next, finding (2) single 6V battery boxes that would fit into the existing space within the A-frame. Since I remove my batteries between camping trips, I didn't want to go with one battery box containing both batteries.

The inside dimension between the angle support rails on my 2005 Eagle is 7 1/2" which allows for a standard group 24 battery box width, and I had about 25 1/2" inside the A-frame. The other factor was that 6V deep cycle batteries are 1" to 1 1/4" taller than a standard 12V group 24 battery, so a standard group 24 battery box wouldn't be an ideal choice.

I did find a battery box manufactured by Power House A/T, #13228. I purchased two of them from http://www.rvplus.com/power-house-a-...ack-13228.html, basically it's a modified group 24 box with an additional 1" in height. NOCO makes a box for the GC-2 (6V) deep cycle as well, but the manufacture told me that they are 7 3/4" wide...., won't fit between the Jayco support rails without some additional modifications.

Upon receiving the boxes I determined what battery orientation would best meet my existing cable paths, and I was also curious whether or not the battery box lids would be an issue (touching each other). I found that the Interstate batteries were about 1/4" taller than the new battery boxes, but the lid design did allow for a firm fit over the battery surface. Since I was using (2) 6V batteries, I had to wire them in series to produce a 12V output.......,



Once I confirmed my battery and lid orientation, I had to purchase a longer 4-gauge ground cable, and a 19" 1-gauge cable ((connect the (2) 6V batt's together)). I was also pleased that I was able to route all my cables/wires to the rear of the battery boxes. This is the end result..........,



I could have rotated one of the battery box lids 180 degrees creating more usable space between the boxes (or moving the boxes closer together), but then my cable/wire routing would be impacted and the 1-gauge cable would have to be lengthened (or cutting access into the lid for direct cable landing on the terminals).

I was able to create a little radius in the 1-gauge cable between the boxes allowing the lids to be placed as shown in the following photo. I also made the length of the 1-gauge cable as short as possible as well. With the battery box lids in place I ended up with about 1/2" between the lids. I also had about 1" between the one battery box and the inside wall of the A-frame allowing for cable/wire runs (E-brake switch, etc.). I did put tape over the lid vents feeling that there was plenty of ventilation through the cable openings. Plus I prefer to keep the moisture off the terminals.



Now I have 232 amp/hrs capacity compared to about 65-80 amp/hrs with the 12V Marine/RV battery. Plus the 6V deep cycle batteries are designed to take a lot more discharge/charge cycles without degrading the battery capacity or life of the battery. Since it''s recommended not to discharge a battery to less than 50% capacity, my TriMetric battery monitoring system will let me know where I stand.

Please Note: Placing a 70lb battery into a plastic battery box can be a little tricky, especially when the battery doesn't have anything to grip on to. The tabs on top of the 6V battery are for golf cart hold-down brackets only and aren't designed to hold the weight of the 6V battery under lifting conditions. What I did was wrap and buckle the two new nylon straps (came with new battery boxes) around the battery, then had a friend steady the battery while I lifted the battery with the straps and lowered it into the box. Just unbuckle the straps and pull them out from the box. Don't use an old nylon strap, the sun and weather has compromised the integrity of the nylon.


Bob
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Old 05-06-2011, 09:26 PM   #2
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Great job. You do great work.

I wonder if the Moderator can copy your post into TeckTalk section and apply a sticky to it. Thus, great "easy to access" info for other folks - who may want to perform the same upgrade (2x6V battery installs).

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Old 05-06-2011, 11:39 PM   #3
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Nice looking job and a good explanation. It was a shame to cover up those pretty green batteries.
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Old 05-07-2011, 04:43 AM   #4
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I sent an email to Trojan battery company a few months ago just prior to converting my Designer to 2 six volt batteries. I was wondering what their position on level of discharge is. I did convert my Designer to 2 six volt Trojan batteries and I couldn't be happier.

Below is Trojan Battery's response:

We never want you to discharge your batteries below a 20% state of charge (80% depth of discharge). For a 36 volt system of batteries this would mean you never want to go below about 35 volts. The voltage of 34.9 volts is an open circuit voltage, which means the batteries would be at rest. For your 12 volt RV system, a 20% state of charge would be an open circuit voltage of 11.6 volts. Thanks.

If you have additional comments or questions, please contact me at the information below.

Sincerely,

Stacey Delzeit
Product Engineer
Trojan Battery Company
sdelzeit@trojanbattery.com
678-518-7378
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Old 05-07-2011, 11:55 AM   #5
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Now you have boondocking power!
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Old 05-07-2011, 12:05 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edatlanta View Post
snip......Below is Trojan Battery's response:
We never want you to discharge your batteries below a 20% state of charge (80% depth of discharge). For a 36 volt system of batteries this would mean you never want to go below about 35 volts. The voltage of 34.9 volts is an open circuit voltage, which means the batteries would be at rest. For your 12 volt RV system, a 20% state of charge would be an open circuit voltage of 11.6 volts.....snip
Although I agree that most GC-2 Deep Cycle batteries are designed for an 80% DoD (Depth-of-Discharge), but it comes at a price.

A shallower average DoD will increase battery life. A deep cycle battery with an average 50% DoD will last at least twice as long as an 80% DoD. A typical GC-2 deep cycle battery will average 225 cycles at 80% DoD, but will increase to 750 cycles at 50% DoD.



........................... Depth-of-Discharge (DoD) ...........................

IMO the best lifespan versus cost approach is to keep the average charge cycle at about 50% DoD.

Bob
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Old 05-07-2011, 12:08 PM   #7
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Now you have boondocking power!
Yep, I'm a happy camper now

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Old 05-07-2011, 06:33 PM   #8
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I'm very happy with mine also.
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Old 05-07-2011, 06:48 PM   #9
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Ed,

Do you have one of these 12V fans? http://www.fantasticvent.com/product...ss_breeze.html

The maximum draw is only 3 amps/hr., and it really moves the air around in lieu of the A/C.

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Old 05-08-2011, 05:23 AM   #10
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No I don't Bob. I have two ceiling fans that work pretty good when I need them. One in the kitchen area and one in the bath.
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Old 07-25-2012, 11:07 AM   #11
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Bob and others: I installed two Interstate batteries, too, but spent some time looking for a single battery case. I found (and ordered) a battery case specifically for golf cart batteries from here -- http://http://www.allbatterysalesand...fm/4,576.html.

After receiving the battery case, I discovered that the battery case was about 3/8" too wide () to fit between the angle iron brackets for the battery bank. To resolve this problem, I took my trailer to a truck repair shop and had a welder cut-off one of the angle iron brackets and re-weld into place to accommodate for the wider footprint of the new battery case. Since the angle iron was only slightly moved, the distance is such that it still can hold a group 27 type 12V battery. See the attached pics (note: since taking the pics, I have upgraded to 4 AWG wiring; the pics show 8AWG wiring; also, I insert a piece of plywood between the two batteries to ensure that they do not move inside the battery case). I have not, however, securely attached the battery case to the A-frame with U-bolts; instead, have relied on the weight of the two batteries and battery straps to keep in place. I realize that it would be best to do so, but I have not had any problems with this configuration after traveling well over 8000 miles over the past three years.

Before going on a trip, I place the battery case on the A-frame. I then take nylon rope (rated for 120-150lbs); insert the rope through the inlets/brackets on top of the interstate batteries and carefully lift and place inside the battery case (note: I called Interstate Batteries to confirm that the inlets/brackets can be used to lift the batteries as opposed to just using them for tying-down the batteries); insert plywood between the batteries as a spacer; attach wiring to batteries; and finally, securely attach the cover to the case. If I'm transporting my TT to storage or to a repair shop (which is not too often !), I just attach the good 'ole group 27 12V battery. When not traveling, I keep all my batteries charged using a BatteryMINDer Battery Charger / Maintainer with Desulphator - 12 Volt 2/4/8 Amp, Model# 12248.

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Old 07-25-2012, 01:34 PM   #12
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Great job - some of those photos look familar haha...

I would have looked into installing the batteries in a 48-inch diamond plate side mount tool box. With the security for batteies getting so bad I am almost afraid to go anywhere anymore... The diamond plate box just weighs around 30-40lb and is lockable and of course looks great between the propane tanks and the trailer front wall...

My next upgrade will include the diamond plate tool boxes... This is a perfect fit for 4ea COSTCO/SAMs CLUB 6v Batteries. The LIP area you see under the front of the tool box is where the Battery fume vents are located.


Photo from gilldawg79 RV.net
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Old 07-25-2012, 01:55 PM   #13
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We have been camping off the power grid for a three or more years and we use around 250AH in a one day/night camping event. We actually do just about what we normally do at regular electric camp sites except no air conditioners.

Being able to re-charge the batteries by connecting the shore power cable directly to the 2KW generator using a RV30A-15A adapter allows us to re-charge the batteries in as little as 2-3 hours generator run time. We try to do this every morning during the breakfast run. Once our batteries are back up to their 90% charge state then we can do this all over again..

I have a DC Battery monitor system inside my POPUP that I watch pretty close reading the DC VOLTS on my two Battery Banks as well as the total current being drawn by the 12VDC Power Distribution Center. The next morning I am usually down to the 12.1VDC to 11.9VDC which is pretty close to the 50% charge state of the batteries.

Works great for us camping off the power grid.

Like in this photo at Wichita Mtns Wild Life Refuge near Medicine Park OKLA, its kinda fun to run 120VAC extension cords to whatever you want to run at the camp site off the power grid.
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Old 07-25-2012, 02:01 PM   #14
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Roy -- I'm with you; one of my next projects will be the diamond plate tool box. Shortly after I got my trailer, I replaced the group 27 battery with two (2) GC batteries and the GC battery case was a quick and simple way to begin my travels and protect the batteries. I do, however, worry about the theft issue, so the diamond plate tool box mod will help resolve that issue. I have seen that mod on rv.net and I have it bookmarked for future reference (the one I saw used sink strainers as a way to vent the batteries; gotta love that kind of thinking!). Thanks for the post. Greg.
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Old 07-25-2012, 08:32 PM   #15
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WIBadger - Yes that is the one... The last guy I worked with doing almost the same mod used regular round vents instaed of the sink strainers.. They were also available from LOWES right next to the sink strainers. I liked the sink strainer idea also - pretty neat...

I have been accumulating parts for my next battery box and just about ready to start changing over to the lock box. Mine will look a tad different but has has the same idea in place. My tool box came from Northern Tools... I'm still thinking about how to come into the bottom of the DiamondPlate box. Probably will use large rubber grommets. I also changed ideas on the U-shaped anchors. Mine are going to be inside the box in the floor and drill straight into the trailer frame. I plan to use a Carriage BOLT head under the frame and have my nut and washer up inside the lock box. Just another effort to keep someone from using a dremal tool to easily cut the box loose.

I also have a very neat idea of going thru the front wall of the trailer into the storgae bay using PVC electrical junction boxes lined up on both sides of the wall and then drill out a one inch or larger hole through the middle of these two electrical boxes. This will make a very weather tight pass-thru access port. If there is a couple of inches of the wall then I will glue in a solid PVC conduit piece and trim flush on both sides.

Ive done this already going through the floor of my OFF-ROAD POPUP hiding all the 12VDC 2-conductor cable pairs that are under the floor in PVC Conduit. Works out great and is weather tight, water tight, and bug tight.

I'm getting carried away here sorry....hehe
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Old 10-08-2012, 12:40 PM   #16
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I really like the battery mod options of adding the 6v golf cart batteries and secure storage that the diamond plated box provide. I am still new to travel trailers and can't help but wondering how the added weight on the front of the trailer effects tongue weight and weight distribution hitch configuration.
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Old 10-08-2012, 01:34 PM   #17
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snip.....can't help but wondering how the added weight on the front of the trailer effects tongue weight and weight distribution hitch configuration.
It's definitely a factor to consider, and depending on the TV/TT combination in question the effect can very. I have a Sherline travel trailer tongue scale, and visit the CAT scale when I incorporate any MODS that may effect weight to confirm if any WDH adjustment is in order.

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Old 07-20-2014, 05:19 PM   #18
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Checked the 6v's I have installed in my houseboat. They are basically the same demenisions as a 12v 27 except they are taller [10" to the top of the case plus the terminals]. I like the idea of the 48" tool box but not sure I have the budget after purchasing 2 batteries. Does anyone make a traditional single plastic battery box for the taller 6V's?

I hear the concern about battery thefts, but I've never had a problem. My TT is stored in my back yard in a very private and rural setting.
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Old 07-20-2014, 05:32 PM   #19
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Just a side note - I'm planning this mod soon and have been doing substantial amounts of online research into batteries. I've been searching and reading most about the Trojan batteries... Now EVERY website I pull up is filled with condom advertisements!
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Old 07-20-2014, 06:15 PM   #20
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Hmhhh? Will a 6volt fit?
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