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Old 04-10-2013, 03:34 PM   #1
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Doug's CAT Scale Results - 2008 4Runner Towing 165 Sport - Double Check Requested

Hey Guys,
I went to the CAT scales today loaded out and ready to go.
If I am calculating correctly, summary of findings:
A. Tongue Weight is too high. 880lbs My Hitch Tongue Weight is rated for 600 Lbs
B. My current WDH setting has returned 104% to front axle. Front axle is over rating by 30lbs
C. My WDH bars are rated at 800lbs and are at lowest setting. Should I have bought 600 lb. bars?
D. Measurements from ground to wheel well today. Front equal to unhitched, Rear - 1/2" versus unhitched

Looks like I have a couple of options and wondering what your recommendations are.
1. Move some weight from front of TT to rear of TT
2. Raise hitch ball 1" (front of TT is currently 1" higher than rear)
3. Do both and re-weight?

Here are my numbers:

TV GAWR Front = 2,550 (Tow vehicle Gross Axle Weight Rating Front)
TV GAWR Rear = 3,060 (Tow vehicle Gross Axle Weight Rating Rear)
TV GVWR = 5,580 (Tow vehicle Gross Vehicle Weight Rating)
TV GCWR = 10,580 (Tow vehicle Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating)

Hitch GTWR = 5,000 (Hitch Tow Weight Rating)
Hitch TWR = 600 (Hitch Tongue Weight Rating)

TT GVWR = 3,500 (Trailer Gross Vehicle Weight Rating)

CAT SCALE RESULTS
Weight #1 = (Weight of the TV and attached towable with the WDH activated)
TV Steer Axle = 2,580 ***** (30lbs over rating, (2,580 - 2,550) 104% versus unhitched)
TV Drive Axle = 2,680 (good, rated at 3,060)
Towable Axle = 3,000 (good, rated at 3,500)
Note 1: WDH returned front axle to 104% of unhitched
Note 2: WDH reduced weight on TV rear axle by 640lbs (Rear axle at 109% versus unhitched)

Weight #2 = (Weight of the TV and attached towable with WDH deactivated, but attached)
TV Steer Axle = 2,180
TV Drive Axle = 3,320 ***** (260 lbs over rating, (3,320 - 3,060))
Towable Axle = 2,780
Note1: WDH redistributed 640 lbs of weight from rear axle of TV? ((3,320 w/o WDH) - (2,680 w/WDH))

Weight #3: = Weight of loaded TV (unhitched from towable)
TV Steer Axle = 2,480
TV Drive Axle = 2,440
Note 1: Tongue weight = 3,320 - 2,440 = 880lbs **** Over rating of hitch rated at 600 lbs

If you have time, please take a look at my numbers and conclusions to make sure that my findings are supported by the data.

Kind regards,
Doug
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Old 04-10-2013, 03:41 PM   #2
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I will let Eagle look at the numbers but where are you getting all of that hitch weight, are there heavy items in the front compartment? 880 seems high for that trailer.
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Old 04-10-2013, 03:50 PM   #3
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Crabman,
I have what I think is normal stuff in front compartment. Not overly stuffed.
1. Pack 4 Lynx blocks, 3lbs?
2. 9'x12' patio matt, 12lbs?
3. 2 small folding camp chairs, 5lbs?
4. 5 fireplace logs, 15lbs
5. Sewer hoses, 6lbs?
6. Couple tools for WDH, awning tool, 2 ea chocks, 15lbs?
I get only about 55-60 lbs adding that up. I will move logs and awning matt to rear of TT

I guess you also have to add full 20lb Propane + 12V battery/case 100lbs?

Doug
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Old 04-10-2013, 03:54 PM   #4
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Dry hitch for 2007 165 is 450, so you are picking up 430 lbs from somewhere if the scale is accurate.


FLOORPLAN 165
Weights
Unloaded vehicle weight (lbs.) 2850
Hitch weight (lbs.) 450
Gross vehicle weight (lbs.) 3500
Cargo carrying capacity (lbs.) 650
Measurements
Exterior length 17' 11"
Exterior height w/AC 114"
Interior headroom 78"
Tank Capacities
Fresh water tank (gals.) 30
Gray wastewater tank capacity (gals.) 30
Toilet/black wastewater capacity (gals.) 11
Other
Sleeping capacity 5
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Old 04-10-2013, 04:22 PM   #5
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Yep,
Has me a little puzzled too Crabman.
I was actually tilted down in the front thinking I was going to be struggling with tongue weight being too low.
I weighed the matt, 11lbs, log = 15.5lbs. Moved those to bathroom and bed.
I do have the weight of the WDH fixtures on the TT rails, 10lbs?
I measured my TT again, I am only 3/4" low in the front, so can't go a hole higher on the hitch ball.
I am going to remove a couple washers and see if I can get TT right on level in tow.

I'll see what Bob and others say as well.

I have tomorrow to adjust and re-weigh before heading out.

Pretty windy here today at 18-22mph. Had some highway driving and 2 lane at 55.
You can definitely feel the wind pushing you, but nothing dangerous or white knuckle.

Doug
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Old 04-10-2013, 04:47 PM   #6
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(Doug... that went fast; it's already time for you to head our for you trip out West! Congrats on checking those weights! I'm sure as a result you will have safe travels..... and post some pics of your neat trip!)
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Old 04-10-2013, 05:11 PM   #7
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Doug,
Don't take this wrong, but you have made a mistake in calculating the tongue weight.
It is as follows;
with TT hooked up and no WD, add the TV FAW and the RAW = 2180 + 3320
then subtract the TV alone FAW and RAW; - 2480 - 2440
Your tongue weight is actually 580 lbs

So, your WD bars are rated okay.
To reduce the load on your front axle when hitched up and WD engaged, tilt the hitch head forward a bit.

Dave
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Old 04-10-2013, 06:28 PM   #8
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Dave,
Thank you so much. I was hoping I did something wrong.
I didn't see anything on the from the 5ver worksheet that I was using to calculate that.
I should of maybe looked in our CAT scale thread.
Ah, I feel much better now.
So I moved some weight out of the front storage and I should take a couple washers out of the WDH and pitch the ball towards the TV?

I was headed that direction because I can't raise the hitch 1 complete hole.

So, I am at 580lbs tongue weight. I am targeting 525. I moved 27 lbs to the rear = 553.
Once I tilt the hitch head, I should be very close to a good setup.



Greatly appreciate your catch.

Kind regards,
Doug
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Old 04-10-2013, 06:43 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dougtoms01 View Post
Hey Guys,
I went to the CAT scales today loaded out and ready to go.
If I am calculating correctly, summary of findings:
A. *Correction* Tongue Weight 580lbs My Hitch Tongue Weight is rated for 600 Lbs
B. My current WDH setting has returned 104% to front axle. Front axle is over rating by 30lbs
C. Measurements from ground to wheel well today. Front equal to unhitched, Rear - 1/2" versus unhitched

Looks like I have a couple of options and wondering what your recommendations are.
1. Move some weight from front of TT to rear of TT
2. Take some washers out to tilt hitch ball to the front to reduce front axle load
3. Make these changes and re-weigh.

Here are my numbers:

TV GAWR Front = 2,550 (Tow vehicle Gross Axle Weight Rating Front)
TV GAWR Rear = 3,060 (Tow vehicle Gross Axle Weight Rating Rear)
TV GVWR = 5,580 (Tow vehicle Gross Vehicle Weight Rating)
TV GCWR = 10,580 (Tow vehicle Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating)

Hitch GTWR = 5,000 (Hitch Tow Weight Rating)
Hitch TWR = 600 (Hitch Tongue Weight Rating)

TT GVWR = 3,500 (Trailer Gross Vehicle Weight Rating)

CAT SCALE RESULTS
Weight #1 = (Weight of the TV and attached towable with the WDH activated)
TV Steer Axle = 2,580 ***** (30lbs over rating, (2,580 - 2,550) 104% versus unhitched)
TV Drive Axle = 2,680 (good, rated at 3,060)
Towable Axle = 3,000 (good, rated at 3,500)
Note 1: WDH returned front axle to 104% of unhitched
Note 2: WDH reduced weight on TV rear axle by 640lbs (Rear axle at 109% versus unhitched)

Weight #2 = (Weight of the TV and attached towable with WDH deactivated, but attached)
TV Steer Axle = 2,180
TV Drive Axle = 3,320 ***** (260 lbs over rating, (3,320 - 3,060))
Towable Axle = 2,780
Note1: WDH redistributed 640 lbs of weight from rear axle of TV? ((3,320 w/o WDH) - (2,680 w/WDH))

Weight #3: = Weight of loaded TV (unhitched from towable)
TV Steer Axle = 2,480
TV Drive Axle = 2,440
Note 1: *Correction*Tongue weight = (2,180 + 3,320) - (2,480 + 2,440) = 580

If you have time, please take a look at my numbers and conclusions to make sure that my findings are supported by the data.


Kind regards,
Doug
A. *Correction* Tongue Weight 580lbs My Hitch Tongue Weight is rated for 600 Lbs

Note 1: *Correction*Tongue weight = (2,180 + 3,320) - (2,480 + 2,440) = 580

Next Steps:
1. Move some weight from front of TT to rear of TT
2. Take some washers out to tilt hitch ball to the front to reduce front axle load
3. Make these changes and re-weigh.

Thanks so much to David472 for the correction on tongue weight calculation.

I really appreciate the help here.

Kind regards,
Doug
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Old 04-10-2013, 06:48 PM   #10
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That looks more like it! Your 880 TW figure was almost as much as mine!
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