Converting to LifePo4

[Fdnavy]

I have a 2016 264bhw currently it uses a marine battery but they don’t last very long. I’d like to replace that battery with a Battleborn 12v 100ah battery. 1 at first and hopefully a second next year. I plan on adding a 2000 watt inverter so I can run an extension cord into the camper to power a fan and to charge devices over night when the generator cannot be used. Has anyone done this before? How can I charge the new battery? My understanding is that the on board converter will not fully charge a LifePo4 battery. Will I. We’d to upgrade my converter? Can I charge it with another external charger or solar system while keeping the converter?

[shortyjacobs]

You can replace the converter with a lithium charging one - both WFCO and Progressive Dynamics make one that is a direct drop-in replacement for many of the standard models. Or you can just put in any lithium converter/charger and wire it up to the existing panel, (it should tap off of the shore power side for power, and it just connects to the 12V side where the current lead acid one connects). If you don't want to do that, you can certainly use an external charger or solar system as well....I don't think the stock converter will fuss if it sees a bit of extra voltage.

[billcf7]

Originally Posted by Fdnavy

I have a 2016 264bhw currently it uses a marine battery but they don’t last very long. I’d like to replace that battery with a Battleborn 12v 100ah battery. 1 at first and hopefully a second next year. I plan on adding a 2000 watt inverter so I can run an extension cord into the camper to power a fan and to charge devices over night when the generator cannot be used. Has anyone done this before? How can I charge the new battery? My understanding is that the on board converter will not fully charge a LifePo4 battery. Will I. We’d to upgrade my converter? Can I charge it with another external charger or solar system while keeping the converter?

If you contact Battleborn and give them the info on your converter they will tell you if it is compatible and if so how to set it for lifepo4

[Fdnavy]

I cannot for the life of me find my converter. I called Jayco and they told me it should be behind the fuse panel. I opened it up but there’s nothing there. They were as baffled as I was. They said they’re going to cal back. Anyone else have an idea where it would be? It’s a 2016 264BHW.

[shortyjacobs]

That middle part, with the rectifier, capacitor, and transformer coil looks like the converter (in your first pic, between the fuses and breakers). No writing on it you can google to figure out the model number?

[Fdnavy]

I think it’s an wf-8735p which Seems to be integrated with the control panel. There doesn’t seem to be an easy way to upgrade that to a converter that will do LifePo4. Any other ideas? How can I connect another charger? Solar would be last resort..

[shortyjacobs]

Ugh, looks like it’s an integrated converter, you’re right. Bummer.

Well, you could just wire a stand-alone lithium charger to AC power and then to your battleborn, and connect your battleborn as normal. I *think* that would work fine. Upon seeing your higher voltage from the lithium charger, the WFCO should just chill out. I am not sure though. If someone with more knowledge doesn’t come along here, you could try over at www.diysolarforum.com....even if you don’t need or want solar they are super knowledgeable about mobile charging systems and LiFePO4s.

[ttavasc]

Originally Posted by Fdnavy

I think it’s an wf-8735p which Seems to be integrated with the control panel. There doesn’t seem to be an easy way to upgrade that to a converter that will do LifePo4. Any other ideas? How can I connect another charger? Solar would be last resort..

Progressive Dynamics makes a direct replacement for the 8735 Power Center. You can see the details on their page here:

Progressive Dynamics PD4135W2BV

Given the design of the 8735 you have to replace the whole power center. The PD4135W2BV supports LiFePO4 (see the Lithium switch details in the Product Information section of the page) as well as lead acid batteries. Since it is a direct replacement it should fit right in where the old 8735 comes out allowing you to retain all the existing wiring. Looks like it runs ~$150-175.

[Fdnavy]

Thank you for the link. I think I’d prefer the smart charger from victron over the charger that comes in the drop in replacement. Is there a way to stop the converter from charging the battery? I would like to just leave the smart charger plugged in and not have to worry about the converter at all or go through the hassle of changing out the entire panel.

[ttavasc]

I'm not sure if you can disconnect the converter/charger on the 8735 as I don't have the 195RB any longer to reference. I know on the WFCO 8955 in our current ORV the converter/charger was wired into one of the circuit breakers in the power center along with the fridge. Maybe see if they did something similar for the 8735. When I swapped in the PD4655 with Lithium support I moved the converter/charger to its own circuit breaker so I could turn it off without turning off the A/C to the fridge.

The PD converter/chargers are high quality and I wouldn't see any issue using them with the lithium. Something else you gain with the swap out is the ability to replace/upgrade the converter/charger in the future as the PD unit is modular unlike the 8735. I'm trying to avoid major wiring and other modifications to my unit while still upgrading the capabilities to support lithium if I decide to go that route in the future. I have a Victron DC-DC charger as well as an MPPT solar charger depending on what my charge needs are.

[Fdnavy]

I called battleborn today. I spoke with Derrick. He told me that it’s possible to kee the WF8735 control center and add a Progressive Dynamics PD9130. I don’t see how this would work. He said there’s YouTube videos but I haven’t had luck finding them. Has anyone done something like this before?

[Bob K]

If you don't want to fuss with replacing the onboard charger, just hook up a lithium charger such as the Victron Bluesmart Charger.
https://www.amazon.com/Victron-Blue-.../dp/B07DWJD84N

Call or write Battleborn at (855) 292-2831 or info@battlebornbatteries.com. Give them your onboard charger model number and they'll tell you how much it can charge the LiFePO4 batteries. My WFCO charger will get the batteries to somewhere around 85-90%. When I want to get the batteries to 100%, I just attached the Victron Bluesmart charger.

I haven't had any issues running the chargers in parallel. A Battleborn battery can be charged at .5C (i.e. 50 amps per each 100 Ah battery). The battery's onboard Battery Management System (BMS) regulates incoming current. The Victron Bluesmart charger only puts out 15 amps and my onboard WFCO charger puts out a max of about 30 amps. Both will charge in parallel until the batteries reach the voltage where the WFCO charger will turn off (because it's programmed with the lower voltages for lead acid batteries). The Victron Bluesmart charger, however, being a lithium charger, will continue to put out the higher voltage necessary to charge LiFePO4 batteries. In other words, my onboard WFCO charger helps with the bulk of the charging and then turns off. Then the Victron charger continues on and puts that last 10-15% of charge into the batteries.

If you have easy access to your battery terminals, you can just attach the charger alligator clamps. Mine are in the basement, so I put a 2-prong SAE connector on the side of the basement wall. That way the charger stays inside and out of the weather while I'm away from home.
https://www.jaycoowners.com/forums/f...tml#post907598

I also installed a 2-prong SAE solar port in the front frame so that I can plug the Victron charger into it while the trailer is parked beside the house. The charger stays in my garage and the cord runs out to the trailer.
https://www.jaycoowners.com/forums/f...tml#post908137

[craigav]

Hi Bob, Just to share that the Battle Born BMS does not limit the incoming charge current as you have been lead to believe. I hesitated to comment as it likely doesn't matter for most systems but at the price these batteries costs, this could be important to know especially for those with high current chargers. In fact, I am not aware of any BMS that controls the charge current, however a BMS (all I have worked on) will disconnect at a high voltage for protection purposes although the disconnect voltage is higher than you should ever take a lifepo4, so it is just a protection of last resort so to say. Check out the last FAQ here under the BMS menu. https://battlebornbatteries.com/faq/

[Bob K]

Originally Posted by craigav

Hi Bob, Just to share that the Battle Born BMS does not limit the incoming charge current as you have been lead to believe

Thank you very much for the correction!

[craigav]

Originally Posted by Bob K

Thank you very much for the correction!
Attachment 70135

Not a problem, I usually hate to comment with corrections as sometimes they don't come across as friendly as they are intended, but these batteries are a bit expensive so the more knowledge the better for longevity.

I commented on another post earlier today about Lifepo4 batteries and the OP had asked how to charge say to only 85%, as that will allow the battery to last longer when he doesn't need to have 100% (longevity in the overall service life of many years). You made a great point about the onboard converter (those not set or designed for lifepo4), in fact I will use my standard converter for most of my charging needs knowing I will not get a 100% charge and then I will charge the lifepo4 batteries with my other charger (powermax pm3-lk) that I can set the voltage on it for the times that I would like for the lifepo4 batteries to be 100% charged as you stated you do. I usually leave my batteries at around 60% for long term storage (winter or similar) but knowing where 60% is can also be a challenge. Good Luck. Thanks, Craig

[sthomas]

I am going through a similar upgrade on my Jayco 287 - Lithium battery, solar panels, MPPT charger (with integrated DC charger) - all from Renogy.

I have the WF-8735 converter. Per the manual, this will Bulk charge at 14.4V for 4 hours. My Renogy lithium battery says 14.4V for Boost charge - although the upper limit is 15.5V.

I am part way through the install - and have not yet connected the battery to the converter. Once I do, I will run a test and see how high the battery will charge with just the converter. I also want to see what the voltage is at the battery while charging - line-loss, etc. There are so many opinions, and other setup's, so I will see what mine really looks like.

[flyfishMT]

Originally Posted by ttavasc

Progressive Dynamics makes a direct replacement for the 8735 Power Center. You can see the details on their page here:

Progressive Dynamics PD4135W2BV

Given the design of the 8735 you have to replace the whole power center. The PD4135W2BV supports LiFePO4 (see the Lithium switch details in the Product Information section of the page) as well as lead acid batteries. Since it is a direct replacement it should fit right in where the old 8735 comes out allowing you to retain all the existing wiring. Looks like it runs ~$150-175.

Where did you see that it's a direct replacement for the 8735?

[flyfishMT]

Originally Posted by sthomas

I am going through a similar upgrade on my Jayco 287 - Lithium battery, solar panels, MPPT charger (with integrated DC charger) - all from Renogy.

I have the WF-8735 converter. Per the manual, this will Bulk charge at 14.4V for 4 hours. My Renogy lithium battery says 14.4V for Boost charge - although the upper limit is 15.5V.

I am part way through the install - and have not yet connected the battery to the converter. Once I do, I will run a test and see how high the battery will charge with just the converter. I also want to see what the voltage is at the battery while charging - line-loss, etc. There are so many opinions, and other setup's, so I will see what mine really looks like.

Interested in hearing your results

[ttavasc]

Originally Posted by flyfishMT

Where did you see that it's a direct replacement for the 8735?

The link I provided should have taken you to the main PD4100-series page on Progressive Dynamics website. It worked when I previewed my post - hopefully it isn't broken for you. Below is a screen shot from that page highlighting the 8735 replacement and LiFePO4 features. Since this is a new model if you decide to go this route ensure that you are getting the correct P/N as earlier models don't have the LiFePO4 support.

[sthomas]

Originally Posted by flyfishMT

Interested in hearing your results

You can see my install and charging results here:
https://www.jaycoowners.com/forums/f...tml#post955949