Propane alarm when no power?

[bjlasota]

What do you folks use when you take your camper to a non-powered campground but still use your LP gas? I don't have battery power hooked up to my camper, so that's not an option. Can anyone recommend a battery(non-12v) run gas alarm that doesn't cost the same as installing 12V batteries?

[Sundancer330]

You could use something like this, its a 120v plug in detector but will also run off its 9v backup battery, available at Home Depot.

Explosive Gas/CO - Plug-in Combination Explosive Gas & Carbon Monoxide Alarm

[sennister]

So you don't hook up the battery at all while using the camper? How do you use the water pump or lights? Maybe you don't use water and use flashlights for light.

There is this one which has a battery back up but I am not sure how long it will run on battery power alone since it is meant to be plugged in. The battery backup is there to provide protection when the power is out. I think that is the main issue. The original sensor will kill the big 12V deep cycle in the mater of a week or two. If run on some AA or a 9V I can't imagine it will last very long.

Gas Detector, Carbon Monoxide Detector, Gas and Carbon Monoxide Detector, Combination Explosive Gas and Carbon Monoxide Alarm with Backlit Digital Display | First Alert Store

If your use means you take your battery with you when you leave your camper in a non-powered seasonal site or storage lot, then I wouldn't worry about the detector not being powered since the camper probably isn't in use while you are away. I wired in a battery shutoff switch and don't bat an eye at disconnecting my battery if I move my camper to a different part of my property where it isn't plugged in. Sure my detectors are dead, but the only time someone is in there is if we go out to grab something or to load it up. However if loading odds are I pulled it around to the house anyhow so we don't have to carry things so far and so we can plug it in to start the fridge a couple days before the trip.

Just trying to better understand how you are using the camper and the challenge that you are having.

[bjlasota]

@Sennister When I camp, at most, I got for 5 days at a time. My pop up does not have 12v battery. Can either run on 30a campground supplied power or nothing. The particular campground I'm going to this weekend does not have power, its very primitive. My water faucet has a manual pump that works fine, and I use lanterns and battery powered lights. When I refer to lights and gas monitors, I'm talking about batteries such as AA or 9v. Not a 12V camper or car battery. My fridge works off propane, so I'll be using that for my babies milk this weekend, but want to be safe and have some type of alarm should a gas leak start. Without power, I can't use the gas alarm built into the camper.

[bjlasota]

@Sundancer Thank you. I have a similar one I use at home for my gas stove. It has a 9v battery backup. We upgraded our home Smoke alarms which now run on AA backup, so I have a TON of new 9V batteries that I could realistically swap out in the gas alarm daily if it eats them that quick. We're only camping for 3 days this weekend.

[sennister]

That makes sense. I should have noticed you posted this in the popup section. I just kind of default to thinking travel trailer since that is what we have always had. A lot of popups don't have thinks like electric water pumps and bathrooms.

I think Sundancer330 and I happened to mention the same unit which has a battery backup but the manual states it is only intended to bridge the gap while 110v may not be available.

ACTIVATING THE BATTERY BACK-UP
Activate the battery back-up by installing the battery. The battery is for
back-up only and is not intended to power the Alarm for an extended
period of time in the absence of AC.
The Alarm will light-up the display briefly to indicate the unit is receiving power.

It also mentioned not installing it within 20' of a combustion source

Keep units at least 20 feet (6 meters) from the sources of combustion
particles (stove, furnace, water heater, space heater) if possible.

That may be hard in a popup.

[bjlasota]

The one I have at home can be placed and is actually designed to be placed right next to the stove. So I think I might try that out tonight and see how it works. I have enough batteries that I could put one in tonight and see how long it lasts.

[sennister]

Another question for it is if it alerts you to low battery. Normally units designed to run on battery would but I would test this. If it is only intended to bridge short outages one would hate to be relying on it to be monitoring when the battery went dead in the middle of the night. I would assume it is going to have a low battery alert but I also wouldn't want to assume that for a safety thing.

[bjlasota]

So maybe here's a solution, but would like to know, what's it take to install a 12V battery to my camper? I am mechanically inclined, but also have a decent knowledge in electrical. Both my trailer and my Jeep have a 4-way and 7-way connector. There's a bundle of spare wires coming from the camper to the hitch that appear to just have nuts on them which makes me assume it's pre-wired for 12v, seeing as my fridge also have 12V capabilities. From what I gather, I would need, a 12V Deep cycle battery, battery box, Battery box connection to frame, 30A inline fuse and holder, shut-off switch, and extra wire. Is there a good write-up anywhere for this?

I should add that I do not have A/C or heat. So the battery would only be used to power lights, the gas monitor, and the occasional outlet power.

[bankr63]

Question, does the detector work when the pup is hooked up to your TV? (assumes a 7 pin connector, 4-pin doesn't do 12v). If yes, you just need to buy a bit of extension wire so you don't have to pull the vehicle as close to the trailer and hook it up. You may also need to wire the 12v for the connector to a RAP (retained accessory power) circuit in your TV so it will be energised when the ignition is off (most of the accessory circuits in my Chev are like this now).

I wouldn't worry too much about draining your TV battery as it doesn't sound like you have a lot of 12v loads in your pup.

This could probably be done for a very small investment in parts (wire).

[crumgater]

What kind of fridge do you have?

When ours is running on LP, it still needs 12v power to run the controls... even our old truck-camper needed a 12v battery to run the fridge (and gas detectors, etc.) Nothing worse than waking up at 3am when the battery got low and the gas detector had to let us know about it with an incessant slow (and loud) beep... the battery only ever went low in the middle of the night, of course.

[bjlasota]

@crumgater - I have a Norcold 323 and based on the manual, does not require 12V for anything.

@Everyone else - crumgaters question sparked a question for myself. My trailer has electric brakes and a breakaway cable for the brakes. From what I've read, for this to work, an onboard 12v battery is required. I've looked all over my camper and I do not see a 12v aux battery, nor do I see a power inverter anywhere. The only thing I see that might hint at 12v power is a single white taped off cable coming up to the A-frame. It seems that I'm going to have to dig into this much deeper to determine if this had battery power in the past. For reference, it's a 2004 Qwest 10B if anyone has the same one and might be able to help.

[Grumpy]

There are numerous "battery only" detectors on AMAZON.

[bankr63]

Originally Posted by bjlasota

@crumgater - I have a Norcold 323 and based on the manual, does not require 12V for anything.

@Everyone else - crumgaters question sparked a question for myself. My trailer has electric brakes and a breakaway cable for the brakes. From what I've read, for this to work, an onboard 12v battery is required. I've looked all over my camper and I do not see a 12v aux battery, nor do I see a power inverter anywhere. The only thing I see that might hint at 12v power is a single white taped off cable coming up to the A-frame. It seems that I'm going to have to dig into this much deeper to determine if this had battery power in the past. For reference, it's a 2004 Qwest 10B if anyone has the same one and might be able to help.

Does it have two strips of approx 3/4' or 1" angle iron welded or bolted to the A-frame about 8" apart? That would be the biggest clue that a battery box was strapped present once upon a time. Since all the wiring is there, it sure sounds like it probably was...

You may only need a battery box, strap, and deep cycle battery to be in business.

A popup generally doesn't have an inverter (changes 12V to 120V) but yours does have a converter (120V to 12v) since your lights do work when the shore power is connected. Inverter is not required, just means your 120V devices don't work when dry camping.

[bjlasota]

I'll have to take a peek tonight. Thanks. If I run off battery, does that mean I won't have outlet power, only lights?

[bankr63]

Originally Posted by bjlasota

I'll have to take a peek tonight. Thanks. If I run off battery, does that mean I won't have outlet power, only lights?

Exactly. A 12V battery doesn't really store enough power to run a 120V load for any length of time. We never really miss it when dry camping, not much I need to plug in, and there is an inverter in my SUV if I really want something.

[bjlasota]

Well, the important thing I need plugged in is an owlet for our newborn. It's basically a pulse ox for a baby. Might have to come up with a different way to power that even if we did have a battery.

[Sundancer330]

Here is a link to the owners manual in case you don't have one. Under electrical it does talk about the battery and the converter being able to charge it, all you need to do is locate the wires to hook it up.

https://www.jayco.com/files/download...lename_109.pdf

[bjlasota]

Yeah, I have that thanks, however, your link sparked me to re-read the electrical section. It does appear that all I need to find is red and white wires. I found the white one last night, but failed to find a red one. I'll have to see if it's there somewhere. I do believe I have the angle iron welded to the frame. Looks like I might be taking a quick trip to wallyworld for a box, strap, and battery tomorrow. Since it's not listed on my floorplan, do you know which devices inside will run off 12v? Lighting would be convenient, but my main purpose for power when going rogue is powering the gas monitor while I use the fridge off propane.

I guess another followup, is that if my trailer is pre-wired, is it necessary for me to add a fuse and a battery disconnect switch, or is that all handled via the electrical box inside the camper?

[bankr63]

Originally Posted by bjlasota

Yeah, I have that thanks, however, your link sparked me to re-read the electrical section. It does appear that all I need to find is red and white wires. I found the white one last night, but failed to find a red one. I'll have to see if it's there somewhere. I do believe I have the angle iron welded to the frame. Looks like I might be taking a quick trip to wallyworld for a box, strap, and battery tomorrow. Since it's not listed on my floorplan, do you know which devices inside will run off 12v? Lighting would be convenient, but my main purpose for power when going rogue is powering the gas monitor while I use the fridge off propane.

I guess another followup, is that if my trailer is pre-wired, is it necessary for me to add a fuse and a battery disconnect switch, or is that all handled via the electrical box inside the camper?

The wiring on yours is going to be fairly similar to everyone other TT with electric brakes, everyone pretty much does it the same way.

The white wire was easy to find because it runs directly to an attachment point on the frame. You don't really have a neutral side on a trailer, the frame serves this purpose.

You mention that you have a bundle of wires (and a seven pin harness?) on the pup now. The hot wire from the battery probably runs into that same bundle of wires, and goes straight back to the power distribution centre inside (generally where the converter, fuse block, and breaker panel are located). I've seen these wires as either red or black at the termination, usually depending on the pigtail for the fuse. Most trailers have a small rubber fuse holder on this wire near the battery terminal connector - your manual should say what size fuse to use here if it is missing, often 30A. The end of the wire is generally a battery terminal crimp ring connector. Also look for one more red wire coming up from the emergency breakaway switch. This wire should also connect directly to the battery hot side, with no fuse (in an emergency you want the brakes to work no matter what).

In a pup the following will work on 12v - all lighting, electric water pump, bunk fans/lights, 3-way fridge if equipped (but will kill your battery in no time, use propane), furnace (fan and controls).

The following 120VAC items (if equipped) will not work - air conditioning, power outlets, water heater (use on propane), 2-way fridge (use propane).

Note that many medical devices will run on 12v with an appropriate adaptor. Check online with the manufacturer to see if one exists. These are generally low voltage, low current, devices already; the first thing most do is rectify and transform 120VAC down to 9VDC. You might need to add a special power point to plug into but it is entirely doable with some simple parts.