A winter day in my White Hawk

[Mikey]

Not sure if anyone will find this interesting or not, but I've been curious about how our 2017 28DSBH would fare in the cold. It has the glacier package, but that doesn't necessarily mean much. Anyway, yesterday it was in the mid-thirties here and extremely gusty so I tried her out for about 8 hours. Key point...I kept the one slide in all day.

Bottom line up front - I was pleasantly surprised. I didn't t feel any air leaks around any windows or the slide out, and both exterior doors were the same...a nice tight fit when closed. The windows, which are single pane, were of course cold to the touch, but comfortable to sit near with the shades drawn.

I ran the onboard propane furnace to see how quickly I could get the interior to a comfy 68 degrees throughout the entire cabin...it took about 30 minutes. But the more impressive thing was how long it held that temperature once it got there. With the thermostat in auto, the furnace cycled on only about twice an hour all day, and only for perhaps 5 minutes each time, so it was sipping propane rather than guzzling it. The house battery had no problem running the furnace blower over the day.

The other thing I wanted to test was how well the Vortex II fan in the bathroom did at venting humidity caused by the propane furnace (and me!). With the fan on low and the bathroom door open, humidity levels hovered between 35-40%, with no condensation observed all day. It felt very comfortable. Even though I usually use electric heat during late-autumn camping, for real winter camping I'm going to have to use the furnace, at least to get the trailer to temperature quickly. Nice to know it can be done without accompanying dampness!

I didn't monkey with any of the winterized plumbing, and since it wasn't below freezing outside it wouldn't have been a good test of the heated and enclosed underbelly anyway. But if I go winter camping, I'll probably use just the black and grey bathroom tanks with some anti-freeze and take sponge baths for a couple of days. Perhaps someday I'll get up the nerve to winter camp with full plumbing in use, heat tape, etc. I'd probably add tank warmers first.

Anyway, that's about all there is to report. I know I need to test her out again in much colder temperatures, but for now the trailer seemed pretty snug and it gave me a lot of confidence that I could boondock in cold weather and enjoy it. The heated and enclosed underbelly may or may not protect my plumbing, but it definitely makes for a warmer interior floor and comfortable cabin, as does the additional R-value in the Glacier package ceiling. And perhaps the biggest lesson for me...leave the slide IN in cold weather if you can (you can move easily around the White Hawk cabin with the slide in). It's less cubic feet of air you need to heat and doubles the floor and ceiling insulation in one part of your rig.

[oldnnew]

Thanks for sharing this cold weather experience in your WH! We are anxious to get ours in the spring (hopefully). We did order it with the Glacier Package as well. Looking forward to our new second home to arrive! As always, thanks for sharing your experiences!

[Mikey]

Originally Posted by oldnnew

Thanks for sharing this cold weather experience in your WH! We are anxious to get ours in the spring (hopefully). We did order it with the Glacier Package as well. Looking forward to our new second home to arrive! As always, thanks for sharing your experiences!

Oh, great! Forgot to mention one thing...some travel trailers with front bedroom have a ton of cold air seaping in under the bed platform from the pass through storage area. Wasn't an issue in the White Hawk, at least not with temps in the mid-30s.

[NVGun40]

I have used my Whitehawk on a 5 day Caribou hunt, where the highest temperature we saw was 12 below. I won't go into detail on the preparations we did, however, we did not use the onboard plumbing (I.e., de-winterize), but we did use the grey and black tanks (along with water softener salt and RV antifreeze to assist the waste and keep the tanks from freezing.
Yet, just as has been said, we had no problem staying warm inside and keeping condensation down. With the glacier package I can honestly say, our Whitehawk held up a lot better against the cold and stayed more comfortable than any other previous rig we have owned.


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[Mikey]

Originally Posted by NVGun40

I have used my Whitehawk on a 5 day Caribou hunt, where the highest temperature we saw was 12 below. I won't go into detail on the preparations we did, however, we did not use the onboard plumbing (I.e., de-winterize), but we did use the grey and black tanks (along with water softener salt and RV antifreeze to assist the waste and keep the tanks from freezing.
Yet, just as has been said, we had no problem staying warm inside and keeping condensation down. With the glacier package I can honestly say, our Whitehawk held up a lot better against the cold and stayed more comfortable than any other previous rig we have owned.

Wow, that's amazing. Would love to hear more about that experience if you've ever got a moment to share!

[Crabman]

Have camped down to 22* in my Jayflight with no heated or enclosed underbelly and we were toasty warm, no issues. Of course it did get well above freezing during the day. An extended cold snap would not work so great like that.

[schrederman]

I use an electric space heater and set the trailer thermostat at 66 degrees at night. The heater is 1500 watts and keeps the trailer heat from coming on. If it's not too cold we set the heater to it's 750 watt setting and we have the same result. If it gets cold enough to make the propane furnace come on, we turn up the electric heater. I'm cheap... and it saves propane...

[Marcm157]

Living just across the NBB from you Mikey, I am now curious enough to try a day in my TT. Its snowing like hell today so I may just go out now and "Camp". I have no glacier package and I'm "Non- Elite" so I expect a slightly different result!

[Mikey]

Originally Posted by Marcm157

Living just across the NBB from you Mikey, I am now curious enough to try a day in my TT. Its snowing like hell today so I may just go out now and "Camp". I have no glacier package and I'm "Non- Elite" so I expect a slightly different result!

I don't know, you might be surprised. The 28BHBE is a nicely built rig. Is the underbelly enclosed?

[timj088]

Originally Posted by Marcm157

Living just across the NBB from you Mikey, I am now curious enough to try a day in my TT. Its snowing like hell today so I may just go out now and "Camp". I have no glacier package and I'm "Non- Elite" so I expect a slightly different result!

I'm interested in how it did.

[Hohenwald48]

Just a little tid bit. The propane furnace adds no humidity to the interior of the camper. All combustion takes place outside the trailer envelope (heated space). It's not like one of those "vent free" heaters where combustion takes place in the heated space.

Glad things worked out for you.

[FeatherFam]

We have camped in our Feather at 27-30 degrees, and it was really comfortable. We used our space heater one night and the furnace the other. The furnace nearly sweated us out of the trailer. I got up and back it way down. Soon, I want to get a digital thermostat for it.

[Marcm157]

Originally Posted by Mikey

I don't know, you might be surprised. The 28BHBE is a nicely built rig. Is the underbelly enclosed?

Originally Posted by timj088

I'm interested in how it did.

Well I have to say I am truly impressed and very surprised at how my 28BHBE did today. I spent a good part of the day in the trailer. It ranged from 22 - 26 degrees during the day and when I entered the camper this morning it was 42 degrees. It took about 20 minutes to bring it up to 65. The furnace did cycle fairly frequently to maintain it although I didn't actually time it.

I did extend the slide, and didn't feel any air leaking but I DID feel the cold when I sat near a window. It wasn't very windy today so I don't know how it would have done if it was.

I did feel a good deal of cold air coming up from the pass through storage and entering from around the bed. I planned on insulating the storage area anyway so this just confirmed that I need to do it.

Thanks Mikey for the idea to see how the trailer does in the winter. If not for your post I would not have thought about it. Our last trip this year was Halloween weekend and the temps dipped to the 40's on the Friday night but that was the coldest we camped so far.

Given the way the trailer performed today without an enclosed underbelly, or any other insulation other than what the standard package came with I wouldn't hesitate to camp in some colder weather.

[NVGun40]

Originally Posted by Mikey

Wow, that's amazing. Would love to hear more about that experience if you've ever got a moment to share!

I have detailed in other posts about using an RV in colder temperatures, however, in our Whitehawk we have not yet had the opportunity to be out in the extreme temperatures like I have been in past rigs. Regardless, when staying out several days in temps well below freezing there are lots of precautions to be taken. Many of these depend on whether you are boondocking or staying in campgrounds with full hookups or everything in between.
With that said; a 5 day trip where the temps were down to 12 below zero.
First for all those who will chime in on the safety of some things.
Mr. Heater Big Buddy propane heaters are designed to be used indoors and have sensors which initiate automatic shutdowns when O2 falls below a specific level (which is still above the minimum safe level)

Our trailer is winterized, in as much as there is no fresh water in the main tank or in the water heater. The water lines are all full of RV antifreeze. We have a stand alone 35 gallon water tank with a manual siphon pump which we stand up in the shower. When we went on this Caribou hunt we were boondocking, completely off the grid. We utilize a small 1000 watt inverter generator which has a run time of around 9 hours with no load and 7-8 hours under moderate load per tank of gas.
Prior to departing we premix 1 gallon of RV antifreeze with the standard holding tank chemicals. We also put about a cup of water softener salt in each drain (no need to wash it down, just let it sit there). Then we also dump about a quart of water softener salts down the toilet. The water softener salts lower the freezing point of water. Then we take extra RV antifreeze, 1 gallon for every 2-3 days. With preparations complete, here is the routine.
In the morning we turn the Buddy heater on to take the chill off, (we leave the bathroom door open unless it is being used), we also have the overhead vent cracked open. The buddy heater along with utilizing the stove top to make coffee and breakfast heats the trailer up very nicely. There has never been a need to utilize the furnace. The only down side is enduring the cold long enough for the inside to heat up after getting out of bed, yet even that isn't to bad (you will figure this out later). When we depart the trailer for the days hunt, we leave the furnace on with the thermostat set at 55 degrees. When you come in from below zero temps, 55 feels plenty warm.
At the completion of the days hunt in the afternoon/evening, I fill the generator and start it. The DW goes inside and turns on the buddy heater again. (note the furnace is still on and the thermostat is still set at 55.)
Again, with the buddy heater and cooking dinner, the trailer gets plenty warm (into the 70s). We hand pump the water from the tank in the shower, and all water heating is done on the stove top. As we utilize water and wash dishes, after we have let the water run down the drain, we add an extra cup or two or three of RV antifreeze as well. When we utilize the toilet, we try to maintain a 50/50 mix for flushing.
Usually, when we finally go to bed, the generator is still running. We shut down the buddy heater, and maintain the T-stat at 55. At some point during the night, it will kick on.
The Whitehawk holds heat extremely well. Obviously, the slide is out, but that still doesn't get that cold.
We had no issues dumping the tanks after this trip and stayed warm in the trailer the whole time.

If we ever stay at a campground with hook ups then we adjust things to make life much more comfortable, like setting the T-stat higher.

[Mikey]

Originally Posted by Marcm157

Well I have to say I am truly impressed and very surprised at how my 28BHBE did today. I spent a good part of the day in the trailer. It ranged from 22 - 26 degrees during the day and when I entered the camper this morning it was 42 degrees. It took about 20 minutes to bring it up to 65. The furnace did cycle fairly frequently to maintain it although I didn't actually time it.

I did extend the slide, and didn't feel any air leaking but I DID feel the cold when I sat near a window. It wasn't very windy today so I don't know how it would have done if it was.

I did feel a good deal of cold air coming up from the pass through storage and entering from around the bed. I planned on insulating the storage area anyway so this just confirmed that I need to do it.

Thanks Mikey for the idea to see how the trailer does in the winter. If not for your post I would not have thought about it. Our last trip this year was Halloween weekend and the temps dipped to the 40's on the Friday night but that was the coldest we camped so far.

Given the way the trailer performed today without an enclosed underbelly, or any other insulation other than what the standard package came with I wouldn't hesitate to camp in some colder weather.

Marc,

That's terrific, glad you had a good experience. When we bought our trailer I didn't have winter camping in mind but there's something appealing about the idea to me - more solitude, more of a man vs. nature experiment, although an admittedly cushy experiment in a trailer.

BTW, while I have an enclosed underbelly, in a way I envy you not having one. You've got much easier acess to your tanks and lines in case you ever want to add aftermarket tank heaters or insulation, and you could always enclose it later if you wanted to anyway. But it sounds like you may not need to.

[Mikey]

Originally Posted by NVGun40

I have detailed in other posts about using an RV in colder temperatures, however, in our Whitehawk we have not yet had the opportunity to be out in the extreme temperatures like I have been in past rigs. Regardless, when staying out several days in temps well below freezing there are lots of precautions to be taken. Many of these depend on whether you are boondocking or staying in campgrounds with full hookups or everything in between.
With that said; a 5 day trip where the temps were down to 12 below zero.
First for all those who will chime in on the safety of some things.
Mr. Heater Big Buddy propane heaters are designed to be used indoors and have sensors which initiate automatic shutdowns when O2 falls below a specific level (which is still above the minimum safe level)

Our trailer is winterized, in as much as there is no fresh water in the main tank or in the water heater. The water lines are all full of RV antifreeze. We have a stand alone 35 gallon water tank with a manual siphon pump which we stand up in the shower. When we went on this Caribou hunt we were boondocking, completely off the grid. We utilize a small 1000 watt inverter generator which has a run time of around 9 hours with no load and 7-8 hours under moderate load per tank of gas.
Prior to departing we premix 1 gallon of RV antifreeze with the standard holding tank chemicals. We also put about a cup of water softener salt in each drain (no need to wash it down, just let it sit there). Then we also dump about a quart of water softener salts down the toilet. The water softener salts lower the freezing point of water. Then we take extra RV antifreeze, 1 gallon for every 2-3 days. With preparations complete, here is the routine.
In the morning we turn the Buddy heater on to take the chill off, (we leave the bathroom door open unless it is being used), we also have the overhead vent cracked open. The buddy heater along with utilizing the stove top to make coffee and breakfast heats the trailer up very nicely. There has never been a need to utilize the furnace. The only down side is enduring the cold long enough for the inside to heat up after getting out of bed, yet even that isn't to bad (you will figure this out later). When we depart the trailer for the days hunt, we leave the furnace on with the thermostat set at 55 degrees. When you come in from below zero temps, 55 feels plenty warm.
At the completion of the days hunt in the afternoon/evening, I fill the generator and start it. The DW goes inside and turns on the buddy heater again. (note the furnace is still on and the thermostat is still set at 55.)
Again, with the buddy heater and cooking dinner, the trailer gets plenty warm (into the 70s). We hand pump the water from the tank in the shower, and all water heating is done on the stove top. As we utilize water and wash dishes, after we have let the water run down the drain, we add an extra cup or two or three of RV antifreeze as well. When we utilize the toilet, we try to maintain a 50/50 mix for flushing.
Usually, when we finally go to bed, the generator is still running. We shut down the buddy heater, and maintain the T-stat at 55. At some point during the night, it will kick on.
The Whitehawk holds heat extremely well. Obviously, the slide is out, but that still doesn't get that cold.
We had no issues dumping the tanks after this trip and stayed warm in the trailer the whole time.

If we ever stay at a campground with hook ups then we adjust things to make life much more comfortable, like setting the T-stat higher.

NV,

Thanks, that's too much great experience to ignore. I'll definitely follow your playbook the first time I boondock in winter. Thanks again for sharing.

[SecretCoveDave]

x2, thanks for the info I don't have to learn the hard way now.
Dave

[Marcm157]

Originally Posted by Mikey

Marc,

That's terrific, glad you had a good experience. When we bought our trailer I didn't have winter camping in mind but there's something appealing about the idea to me - more solitude, more of a man vs. nature experiment, although an admittedly cushy experiment in a trailer.

BTW, while I have an enclosed underbelly, in a way I envy you not having one. You've got much easier acess to your tanks and lines in case you ever want to add aftermarket tank heaters or insulation, and you could always enclose it later if you wanted to anyway. But it sounds like you may not need to.

I agree - My original plan was to enclose the underbelly myself after purchase but now I really don't see a reason to do it. Thanks again for the idea to see how my camper does in the cold. I am SLOWLY becoming intrigued by the idea of winter camping...

[Donedroolin]

I have camped in my Eagle when the temp got as low as 34 degrees. It is always on my mind to try sleeping in it when it is like below 20 like in the teens. I have the winter package (polar Package) with the double pane windows. My problem I winterize then I cover my camper. Now there is snow on it. I would never use any of the onboard water. Only the heater. But it would be a pain to uncover therefore I have never tried. I would love to hear more stories of [people that have tried to or have stayed in there camper on very cold nights. Good Thread!!!

[Mikey]

Originally Posted by Donedroolin

I have camped in my Eagle when the temp got as low as 34 degrees. It is always on my mind to try sleeping in it when it is like below 20 like in the teens. I have the winter package (polar Package) with the double pane windows. My problem I winterize then I cover my camper. Now there is snow on it. I would never use any of the onboard water. Only the heater. But it would be a pain to uncover therefore I have never tried. I would love to hear more stories of [people that have tried to or have stayed in there camper on very cold nights. Good Thread!!!

I bet your rig would be super comfortable with those features. FYI, during the winter day I spent in my White Hawk, it was covered. I have the Adco cover that allows you to unzip the sidewall to create clearance for entry, to run the onboard, furnace, etc. It's the only reason I left the slide in that day. It was also a nice test of the cover's claim to let humidity vent out...I had one ceiling vent open all day and there was no humidity buildup inside.