Dealership Alignment

[JaytheDJ]

After reading many posts about getting the caster adjusted on my 2018 E450, I researched around and could only find a local Ford Commercial Truck service center. I thought, they surely must be aware of the issue and be willing and able to set the caster at the forum recommended +5 and up.
I scheduled an appointment, explaining the situation. Service manager sounded confident he could fix it for us. Appointment day comes, I again talk with him and explain the situation, "no problem", he says.

4 hours and almost $500 later I'm leaving the service center. I signed the invoice and was told the settings were out of whack and the alignment report was in the glove-box. I take him for his word and drive the 45 minutes home. Imagine my surprise when the vehicle drives exactly as it did when I brought it in. I look at the alignment report and find that they set the alignment as below.

LF
Camber - .08
Caster - 3.6

RF
Camber - .08
Caster - 3.8

After going back and forth a few times the service manager is saying that he will set the alignment as recommended on the many forum postings, but wants me to not hold them liable for any issues that may arise from it.

Here are his words exactly: As you can see from the before and after specs the vehicle came in way out of spec. We set the front end to Ford Spec for the Chassis and readings it Is given while it is on the machine. We can certainly set the specs to whatever you would like but I would advise against it because it will most likely lead to abnormal tire wear… unfortunately because the vehicle is top heavy some sway is considered normal especially at highway speeds, and this will change depending on how loaded the vehicles is at the time (water tank, gray water tank, levels etc.) but if you would like to have the specs set as you specified below I do not have a problem doing that for you with the understanding that we are not liable for any future issues that may occur due to the alignment being set out of spec.

What would you do? I don't need this dealership for anything else, as I can handle most issues that arise with the unit. But god forbid something happens down the road and I need a Ford dealership to fix something.

[Steveii]

The first alignment should have been paid for by jayco. I know they paid for mine. It was pulling pretty good to the right and drives straight now.

If they set it to factory specs and it still feels out of alignment I would ask them to diagnose what else it could be. Talk to jayco first though because they should be paying for this if you still have factory warranty.

[MikeUSNRet]

Did they install adjustable caster bushings?

[Harvard]

I have had a first hand experience driving a 28 foot Ford E450 with the before caster set at +3.5 and then an after caster set at +5.5 degrees.

The Ford specification is from +1.5 to +7.0 degrees.

In my opinion driving with +3.5 degrees was down right dangerous and it deserves to be considered the safety hazard that it is....

[JaytheDJ]

Originally Posted by MikeUSNRet

Did they install adjustable caster bushings?

No
The only line item on the invoice was for "slugs and shims"?

[JaytheDJ]

Originally Posted by Harvard

I have had a first hand experience driving a 28 foot Ford E450 with the before caster set at +3.5 and then an after caster set at +5.5 degrees.

The Ford specification is from +1.5 to +7.0 degrees.

In my opinion driving with +3.5 degrees was down right dangerous and it deserves to be considered the safety hazard that it is....

I'm trying to get this shop to understand this. What concerns me is that while they are willing to set the specs to my requested values, they basically want me to not hold them liable for any future issues that may occur due to the alignment being set out of spec.

[ifallsguy]

Originally Posted by JaytheDJ

I'm trying to get this shop to understand this. What concerns me is that while they are willing to set the specs to my requested values, they basically want me to not hold them liable for any future issues that may occur due to the alignment being set out of spec.

You need to bring in Ford documentation for the +1.5 to +7.0 degrees so you can show them the 5 degrees is in spec and you don't have to sign a waiver. You need to have it in writing from Ford, not the forum. The service dept should be able to pull it up, so have them show it to you. If they won't either try another dealer, call Ford customer service and ask for it to be emailed or try an alignment shop. You should be able to find the actual Ford spec.

Try signing into this forum: https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/forum279/
This is their 2017+ SuperDuty forum and someone there probably can help you out.

Most shops will set alignment dead center unless they have a reason otherwise. That seems to work for most people so that's where they set it. You need to have them prove 5 degrees is not within the Ford issue spec.

You might check out this site to get the specs, though it does charge.
eSpecs Online Wheel Alignment Specs


I also found this in the online owner's manual (page 98). These folks should have access to the Ford spec and can help you deal with the service department. Give this a try!

IF YOU HAVE A SERVICE CONCERN, PLEASE FOLLOW THESE STEPS: 1. Call our Motor Home Customer Assistance Center (1–800–444–3311) which is available 24 hrs/day. If inspections or repairs are required let the assistance center make an appointment for you at the most appropriate repair location in your area. Please have the following information ready before you call: • Vehicle Identification Number • Current Mileage • A Summary of Your Concern 2. When you arrive at the repair location explain your concern fully to the service writer. If your concern is resolved please contact (1–800–444–3311) and advice them accordingly. If not... 3. Ask to see the Service Manager and review your concern with him. If you are still not satisfied... 4. Contact (1–800–444–3311) and our Motor Home Customer Assistance Center will assist you and or the repair location as needed.

Hopefully some of this will help.

[Harvard]

Does the alignment report not give you any information on the acceptable caster range. I realize such information on the report is from the company that created the alignment machine BUT it may give you a point to discuss.

[Harvard]

I have been collecting alignment specifications over the
last 8 years from alignment reports members have shared.
These specifications are by the alignment machine makers.

Left Hand Caster Specs for E350/E450

YEAR Specification Interpolation MID
1997 2.00 to 7.50 (4.75 +/- 2.75) 4.75
1998 1.3 to 6.8 (4.05 +/- 2.75) 4.05
2004 4.00 +/- 2.75 (1.25 to 6.75) 4.00
2005 4.00 +/- 2.75 (1.25 to 6.75) 4.00
2006 1.8 to 7.3 (4.55 +/- 2.75) 4.55
2008 1.0 to 6.8 (3.90 +/- 2.9) 3.90
2009 1.0 to 6.8 (3.90 +/- 2.9) 3.90
2010 3.90 +/- 2.90 (1.00 to 6.80) 3.90
2011 3.90 +/- 2.90 (1.00 to 6.80) 3.90
2012 1.0 to 6.8 (3.90 +/- 2.9) 3.90
2013 1.0 to 6.8 (3.90 +/- 2.9) 3.90

[75H]

Know you don't want to hear this after spending $500 at a Ford Commercial Dealership....as part of our purchase agreement, we included an alignment check and our coach was taken to a dealer. Big mistake, it came back with a pull to the left and a 'crooked' steering wheel.

So I spent some time getting referrals, looking online, and driving (my car) to various alignment shops until identifying one I was happy with. We a lucky to have several non-dealers to choose from within 45 minutes. If there is one nearby, you might ask a high end indoor storage/service facility that caters to Class A customers what shop they use.

Anyway, I identified a shop that has lots of experience, the right equipment and attitude, made an appointment, and did the work while I waited (a couple of hours including shims). Mechanic rode with me afterward to make sure I was happy.

These alignments are tricky and all the numbers are great, but you need to find the right shop with the right attitude and experience before the work is done. Sounds like you tried.

2018 Greyhawk 29MVP

[JaytheDJ]

As of right now, I believe I have the dealership convinced to go my way, am just waiting for the service manager to "check with management" to determine what my costs would be for this follow up work.

Major setback though, Jayco called me today. They received my invoice, report, and letter requesting reimbursement. I was denied. They said if they were to cover it, it would have had to have been done within 3 months or 2K miles, which I am obviously over.
Feeling sunk, but hopefully the rig will drive right if the dealership will stand by their word and do the alignment as I requested.