Nissian and a 5er ?

[TxLoser]

Originally Posted by Half Ton Heavy

What does your payload sticker read? Keeping it in the limits with a 3/4 diesel generally means less than a 26’ fiver.

Sticker is 2300 and change. I previously had an HT that was 31.5’. Full fuel, fully loaded for a big trip, full tank of water forward of the axles, me and the fam I was right at or 100lbs over GVWR.

So, while it can be done, you’re correct that the yellow sticker is very restrictive on a 3/4 ton diesel as far as FW’s go.

In all of this there’s, so much focus on the math which is good for planning, but too much tunnel vision on the math of payload. An F150 with 3000lbs of payload would be a nightmare pulling my 321RSTS. Although, you be within payload. We focus so much on payload in these threads, we miss the bigger picture. I think this math in this thread determining max pin weight based on tow rating is pretty spot on. Real world example... my math for my truck comes up with a pin just beyond 2K lbs. My current pin is beyond that a bit and while it does fine with no suspension mods, it’s better with them. This tells me if I were right at the calculated max, it would probably be just right and no mods. Math, but not just payload math.

[Half Ton Heavy]

Originally Posted by TxLoser

Sticker is 2300 and change. I previously had an HT that was 31.5’. Full fuel, fully loaded for a big trip, full tank of water forward of the axles, me and the fam I was right at or 100lbs over GVWR.

So, while it can be done, you’re correct that the yellow sticker is very restrictive on a 3/4 ton diesel as far as FW’s go.

In all of this there’s, so much focus on the math which is good for planning, but too much tunnel vision on the math of payload. An F150 with 3000lbs of payload would be a nightmare pulling my 321RSTS. Although, you be within payload. We focus so much on payload in these threads, we miss the bigger picture. I think this math in this thread determining max pin weight based on tow rating is pretty spot on. Real world example... my math for my truck comes up with a pin just beyond 2K lbs. My current pin is beyond that a bit and while it does fine with no suspension mods, it’s better with them. This tells me if I were right at the calculated max, it would probably be just right and no mods. Math, but not just payload math.

So your current pin is beyond 2K, and your payload is only 2300 and change? ( not a crew cab I am guessing).That leaves 200lbs for you, your mate, kids, groceries, generator etc. I am guessing you are way over payload by 500 lbs or so at least. Maybe that 3000 payload F150 is not such a bad idea?

[Demiles]

Originally Posted by Half Ton Heavy

So your current pin is beyond 2K, and your payload is only 2300 and change? ( not a crew cab I am guessing).That leaves 200lbs for you, your mate, kids, groceries, generator etc. I am guessing you are way over payload by 500 lbs or so at least. Maybe that 3000 payload F150 is not such a bad idea?

Since the f150 is only good for about 1800 lbs pin weight, no it wouldn’t be a better choice.

[TxLoser]

Originally Posted by Half Ton Heavy

So your current pin is beyond 2K, and your payload is only 2300 and change? ( not a crew cab I am guessing).That leaves 200lbs for you, your mate, kids, groceries, generator etc. I am guessing you are way over payload by 500 lbs or so at least. Maybe that 3000 payload F150 is not such a bad idea?

I’m definitely over payload. No doubt about it. I probably should get an F150. They’re nice trucks.

[TxLoser]

My whole point was that I think the idea of using the 15% of max fw/goose neck tow rating as a target for the rv shopper or truck buyer is a smart starting point.

[Half Ton Heavy]

Originally Posted by Demiles

Since the f150 is only good for about 1800 lbs pin weight, no it wouldn’t be a better choice.

I’m curious how you arrived at that number? It’s not far off, on mine I figure 2k max, that’s with the 2500 lb payload. The same thinking would put the above diesel 3/4 ton around 1500lb max pin.

[TxLoser]

Maybe I read it wrong above, but a lot of this is based on taking 15% of the vehicles max rated fw/goose neck tow rating. This math is independent of payload. So, regardless of payload. For this example take 15% of the above mentioned number. Who knows what’s right, but a fun discussion.

[Demiles]

Originally Posted by TxLoser

Maybe I read it wrong above, but a lot of this is based on taking 15% of the vehicles max rated fw/goose neck tow rating. This math is independent of payload. So, regardless of payload. For this example take 15% of the above mentioned number. Who knows what’s right, but a fun discussion.

You are correct and it has been this way since manufacturers implemented SAE j2807 as a rating standard. Prior to that is anyone’s guess.

[madmaxmutt]

Originally Posted by Demiles

You are correct and it has been this way since manufacturers implemented SAE j2807 as a rating standard. Prior to that is anyone’s guess.

Once again, I am not sure where you are getting your information. 15% is not anywhere in 2807. It says 20% and that's it.

"4.4.2.5 Trailer Tongue/Kingpin Weight (Fifth Wheel or Gooseneck Trailers)

Ballast should be applied to the trailer in a distributed manner such that the trailer tongue weight is 20% of total trailer
weight ±1.0%. This provides a nominal longitudinal center of gravity (cg) position of 20% of the effective tongue length
forward of the trailer wheel(s) centerline when the trailer is level."

[Demiles]

Here

[madmaxmutt]

That's downright comical. They lowered the standard from the 2012 version. I guess they caved to the manufacturer's and marketing. Who the heck tows a 5th wheel at 15%? LOL

At least 5.4 still says 15% is the minimum. The braking test was already pretty minimal only stopping from 20MPH. This standard has now effectively become as accurate as the EPA MPG ratings. But hey, the MFGs got higher combined towing ratings.

[TxLoser]

And tomorrow the standard will be something else. All about the dollar.

If you really want to make your weight calculating head explode, check out some truck camper forums.

[Demiles]

This is a standardized test using specific equipment (trailers, wdh) performed under specific conditions to establish a vehicle tow weight rating. It’s main purpose is for comparison of similar class vehicles. What is certainly lacking is a method for the average consumer to apply it they’re specific situation and trailer type. While staying within all applicable weight ratings is expected in the standard so is speed and handling requirements of the combination. Our RV’s in general have poor towing characteristics compared to the trailers and loading used in the standard so higher tongue weights % are needed to achieve reasonable stability. Higher TW % means lower a TWR.